Garza to Texas for CJ Edwards, Olt, Grimm & Neil Ramirez

[toonsterwu]

As a side note, I like this trade for us, but I agree with Law that this trade makes sense for both sides. They get a big upgrade for their push ... and what do they really give up? A 3rd baseman with some legitimate warts, a mid-rotation at best starter in Grimm, a raw arm far away whose ceiling isn't off the charts, and perhaps an intriguing/talented arm in Ramirez that hasn't put it together yet. It's a good package for us, but they protected key guys in their system and giving up these guys isn't a bad price for them.

 

I might've missed it, but were there any rumors on what the A's offered? Would've been fascinated to see what the AL West bidding war created as a package to challenge to the Rangers for Garza.

[davell]

Baez, Almora, Soler, Bryant, Alcantara, Edwards, Johnson, Vogelbach, Candelario, and one of Vizcaino, Paniagua, or Blackburn at 10. Only because Lake is in the majors and likely loses his eligibility. Olt? No clue. Lets see what he does the rest of the year. He could be 6th if he mashes, top 15 if he continues at his current-post lasik pace, or top 25ish, if he plays worse......

[Geech]

It's easy to come up with post hoc explanations for why a prospect struggled, but that doesn't make the explanation meaningful. While I hope the vision problem is the cause of the struggle and that it has cleared up, it's far from certain that Olt has all the skills necessary to be significant player in the majors. I think it's perfectly reasonable to question his status.

 

It's also still perfectly reasonable to dislike Kyle, though.

[Banedon]

Why did "the clock run out" for the Cubs with regard to insisting on Odor? Just didn't want Garza pitcbing another game for the Cubs?

[XZero771679666304]

It's absolutely possible, perhaps likely, that Olt's issues aren't a result of a correctable issue, meaning he'll never fulfill his past promise.

 

But it's far too early to say he's awful and write him off.

[Warpticon]

I still say Olt is the same guy he was last year, but a year older. Ks weer a concern before, and they still are, but outside of that April when he apparently couldn't see, his production hasn't been a major step down from what was expected. Given his D and power potential, he's still a prospect, one with warts, but the same warts he already had.

[tspain]

You better believe Olt is in our Top 10 Prospects list. He is so much better than you are reading on here. He is going to be good. Jim Callis said Cubs could put him on 3rd today cause he is ready, and I believe that. Don't hurt to send him to AAA for a bit, but he should be playing 3rd base very soon for the Cubs. And as he said, he is the one who will stay there. Baez and Bryant will move away from 3rd base. Olt will be our 3rd baseman of the future. Olt is not Brett Jackson. I agree with Jim Callis on this one. MLB had him the 19th best Prospect in baseball, BA had him the 22nd best Prospect in baseball last year. He is a good one. The pitchers, I will not comment on cause I know nothing about them, other than what I have read. I like this deal a lot.

[Guancous]

Baez, Almora, Soler, Bryant, Alcantara, Edwards, Johnson, Vogelbach, Candelario, and one of Vizcaino, Paniagua, or Blackburn at 10. Only because Lake is in the majors and likely loses his eligibility. Olt? No clue.

 

Our top 10 heading into 2011:

 

1. Starlin Castro, ss

2. Brett Jackson, of

3. Josh Vitters, 3b

4. Andrew Cashner, rhp

5. Jay Jackson, rhp

6. Hak-Ju Lee, ss

7. Logan Watkins, 2b

8. Chris Carpenter, rhp

9. Ryan Flaherty, ss/2b/3b

10. D.J. LeMahieu, ss/2b

[Geech]

It's absolutely possible, perhaps likely, that Olt's issues aren't a result of a correctable issue, meaning he'll never fulfill his past promise.

 

But it's far too early to say he's awful and write him off.

 

I don't think anyone is doing that. Instead, I think people are drawing new conclusions from the additional data provided by this season. I don't know how appropriate it is to drop him out of the top ten, but I do know that I am not nearly as excited by his acquisition as I would have been at this point last year. Maybe I'm just feeling burned by Brett Jackson, but there are some major questions that need by addressed in terms of Olt's AAA performances before I would count on him to contribute to the Cubs.

[XZero771679666304]

Why did "the clock run out" for the Cubs with regard to insisting on Odor? Just didn't want Garza pitcbing another game for the Cubs?

 

Maybe Texas measure his value on the number of starts he was going to give them and the return was going to be adjusted accordingly.

 

Or maybe, like me, the FO was afraid of his arm blowing up at any given time and had decided they had waited as long as they were going to. Given how well Garza had been pitching, I think his value was as high as it was going to get. An early exit or a game or two like he threw against the Reds and the Cubs may not have gotten what they did.

[Guest]

http://www.lonestarball.com/2013/7/11/4513080/neil-ramirez-a-developing-story

 

Once ranked by Baseball America as the best curveball in the entire system, the CB has fallen behind the CH in terms of nastiness, this season at least. The CH is, IMO, his best secondary offering now. It comes out of his hand exactly like the FB, but sits 84-86 and has nice arm-side fade. He and I have talked about the emergence of his CH several times this season, he loves the pitch and will throw it to both righties and lefties and he’ll pitch backwards with it as well. The SL can also be an out pitch for him, but lately, he’s kinda been using that as a show-me type offering to set up the CH or the FB. A few times a game, he’ll still snap off a vintage Neil Ramirez CB that will make you happy, but it’ll sometimes get too loopy and hang too. Regardless, the entire gist of this paragraph is to tell you that Neil Ramirez throws a FB/CH/CB/SL and all 4 of them are good/decent pitches.

So he’s been working very hard in 2013 on the mental side of the game, and it’s starting to show. His last outing in Frisco was his best of the season. Not in terms of dominance, I’ve seen him be filthy at times this season, but in terms of growth. In 2013, Neil’s thrown 92 innings, walking 38 and striking out 113, third most in all of MiLB. Opponents are hitting .196 against him and only 6 of his pitches have left the yard. He’s dominating the Texas League, but by the end of his outing Friday night, I was grinning like a cat. After allowing 4 ER including a HR, all in the second inning, Neil buckled down and threw 4 scoreless innings, striking out 5 of the last 6 batters he faced. It was a huge step and I told him so the next day, and he seemed genuinely happy about it. The kid has been working hard and has openly discussed his efforts to eliminate negative thoughts and possible outcomes while trying to simply focus on the process. Control what you can control. Sounds easy, but isn’t. Oh, and another thing, I’ve asked him point blank and I’ve written it before, but he likes pitching out of the pen as well. He’s got a starter’s arsenal and build (6’4” 200lbs), but as the kids like to say “IJS”. I have no idea if his future is as a starter or out of the pen, or if it involves a 911 with a quadrophonic Blaupunkt, but I know his 2013 is already a helluva lot better than his 2012, and for that, the young man deserves some credit.

[davell]

Ramirez is on the 40 man already, by the way. Depending on what else is done at the deadline, I could certainly see us taking two guys that don't cost roster spots over Ramirez.

[Guest]

Ramirez is on the 40 man already, by the way. Depending on what else is done at the deadline, I could certainly see us taking two guys that don't cost roster spots over Ramirez.

 

or you can just trade brett jackson or something

[scarey]

I would be interested to know if Buckel is on Hoyer's radar. I know he has had inexplicable control problems this year, but last year he was far and away my most coveted prospect when Dempster was getting dealt. It would make a whole lot of sense that he would be a PTBNL candidate so that the Cubs can check him out. That being said, I cannot find any news on the guy after he was sent to instructs early in the year. Anyone else have any updates on him?

[Illini Iceman]

Ramirez is on the 40 man already, by the way. Depending on what else is done at the deadline, I could certainly see us taking two guys that don't cost roster spots over Ramirez.

 

or you can just trade brett jackson or something

 

I think at least two of Borbon, Bogusevic, Gillespie become redundant when Sweeney and DeJesus come back since they will probably also have Schierholtz, Sappelt and Lake still hanging around unless someone is traded in which case that would clear a spot anyway.

[Guest]

Baseball America Trade Central[/url]"]Mike Olt, 3b

Age: 24 Bats: R

Career Transactions: Selected by Rangers in supplemental first round (49th overall) of 2010 draft; signed June 18, 2010.

 

Club Lg Class AVG G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB OBP SLG OPS

Frisco TL AA .333 3 12 1 4 2 0 1 2 0 6 0 .333 .750 1.083

Round Rock PCL AAA .213 65 230 37 49 15 0 11 32 35 89 0 .317 .422 .739

 

 

Don’t read too much into Olt’s overall batting line at Triple-A. He entered the season ranked as the No. 22 prospect in the game, but after struggling out of the gate with vision problems, he redeemed himself by batting .247/.353/.506 with 10 homers in 158 at-bats since returning to Round Rock on June 3. Strikeouts will be a permanent fixture of Olt’s game, but that will be an acceptable tradeoff for his plus power production. He led the Texas League in home runs (28) and slugging (.579) in 2012, but he’s more than just a one-trick pony. Scouts rave about his agility, sure-handedness and arm strength at third base, and he forces pitchers to throw him strikes with a disciplined hitting approach—his strikeout-to-walk ratio was about 2-to-1 since June. Olt represents a good buy-low option for the Cubs, and his acquisition could directly influence the futures of Kris Bryant (2103) and Javier Baez (2011), two of the organization’s recent first-round picks.

 

Justin Grimm, rhp

Age: 24

Career Transactions: Selected by Rangers in fifth round of 2010 draft; signed Aug. 16, 2010.

 

Club Lg Class W L ERA G GS CG SV IP H HR BB SO BB/9 SO/9 WHIP

Round Rock PCL AAA 1 0 1.59 1 1 0 0 5.2 4 0 2 4 3.18 6.35 1.06

Texas AL MAJ 7 7 6.37 17 17 0 0 89.0 116 15 31 68 3.13 6.88 1.65

 

 

One of three rookies in the Rangers rotation at the time of the trade, along with Nick Tepesch and Martin Perez, Grimm had fallen on hard times of late, running up an 11.91 ERA over his past three starts while allowing 23 hits in 11 1/3 innings. Grimm’s fastball sits at 91-92 mph and must be located down because he doesn’t have much life on the pitch or deception in his delivery. He throws a sharp, high-70s curveball as his primary out-pitch, though his changeup and slider have made strides and project as average. Grimm competes and throws strikes, with many scouts seeing him as a mid-rotation arm. The Cubs can afford to throttle back the pressure and, if they so choose, allow their new acquisition to sort out his repertoire in Triple-A for a few weeks.

 

C.J. Edwards, rhp

Age: 21

Career Transactions: Selected by Rangers in 48th round of 2011 draft; signed Aug. 15, 2011.

 

Club Lg Class W L ERA G GS CG SV IP H HR BB SO BB/9 SO/9 WHIP

Hickory SAL LoA 8 2 1.83 18 18 1 0 93 62 0 34 122 3.28 11.76 1.03

 

 

A 48th-round pick in 2011, Edwards may be the best scouting and player-development story in the minors. Little-scouted in high school, he thrived under professional tutelage, rapidly streamlining his delivery and adding velocity during his 2012 debut in short-season ball, where he ranked among the top 10 prospects in both the Arizona and Northwest leagues. Edwards sits in the low- to mid-90s and imparts a natural cutting action on the ball due to the unique nature of his finger position and arm slot. At the time of the trade, he led the South Atlantic League in ERA (1.83) and strikeouts (122) while not allowing a home run in 18 starts, which is more impressive than it sounds give Hickory’s home park. Edwards must continue to stay on top of a solid breaking ball and fringy changeup, but his athleticism and aptitude argue well for continued refinement.

[Infrequent Poster]

Not that it's a huge deal, but because it was discussed a few days ago, has anyone heard if Texas is paying Garza the rest of the season or if the Cubs are picking up the bill?

 

Cubs not picking up any of Garza's salary. All on the Rangers.

[Irrelevant Dude]

Not that it's a huge deal, but because it was discussed a few days ago, has anyone heard if Texas is paying Garza the rest of the season or if the Cubs are picking up the bill?

 

Cubs not picking up any of Garza's salary. All on the Rangers.

Well, that should make the international overage easier for Ricketts to stomach.

[ctcf]

Baez, Almora, Soler, Bryant, Alcantara, Edwards, Johnson, Vogelbach, Candelario, and one of Vizcaino, Paniagua, or Blackburn at 10. Only because Lake is in the majors and likely loses his eligibility. Olt? No clue. Lets see what he does the rest of the year. He could be 6th if he mashes, top 15 if he continues at his current-post lasik pace, or top 25ish, if he plays worse......

 

I'd put Olt before Vogelbach, Candelario, JCP and Blackburn. Probably Vizcaino. You're discounting him too much for one half of a season.

[abuck1220]

edwards and olt both clearly in the top 10. seems pretty obvious that edwards is the cubs' best pitching prospect.

[bukie]

From BP, a look at the depth chart for Texas's rotation prior to the Garza trade:

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/u/images/RangersRotation.jpg

[toonsterwu]

edwards and olt both clearly in the top 10. seems pretty obvious that edwards is the cubs' best pitching prospect.

 

I'm surprised that Edwards is getting so much love, and I am a big fan of Edwards. But, I don't recall many suggestions out there that his secondary stuff projected to be better than plus. I'm not even gigantically huge on Pierce Johnson, but it's hard for me to take Edwards over him unless Edwards breaking ball improves enough. Johnson's arsenal is, on paper, better.

 

Again, I like Edwards a ton, but I'm just a bit surprised with this push for him at 1 on our pitching list, unless I've missed something on Johnson in the last month or so (fairly possible).

[Rob]

edwards and olt both clearly in the top 10. seems pretty obvious that edwards is the cubs' best pitching prospect.

 

I probably would rank him the top pitching prospect, but if somebody is really worried about his size (and by extension, his ability to stay in the rotation) I wouldn't begrudge them for ranking Pierce Johnson higher. If we're completely ignoring that, I'd think Arodys Vizcaino would be the #1.

[Guest]

i really like the trade. based on most midseason rankings, the cubs have 5 hitters in the top 50.

[bukie]

Excerpt from Jason Cole interview at BP with CJ Edwards:

 

Cole: Growing up where you did in South Carolina and playing against all these top amateur players, do you think that helped you in a way?

 

Edwards: Yeah, I can say that. But I also played bush league baseball. And that’s like grown men. They are yapping at you, they’re talking junk. They’re telling you this––saying you won’t be this. But at the end of the day, I go out there and handle my business, and they all say, ‘Hey man, you’ve got a good shot at being something special.’ I pretty much took what I learned from out there and brought it here. Because you never know when you’re going to get to a stadium and fans are going to be yapping at you. I’ll be used to that, while some other people wouldn’t. I think that is pretty much my advantage––playing with older guys and then coming here and playing with guys my same age.

 

Cole: Chris Kemp had mentioned the bush league thing to me before. Tell me a little bit about that. What is it exactly ?

 

Edwards: Man, bush league––you hear a lot of people say, ‘That’s a bush-league play,’ or ‘That’s a bush-league this.’ I kind of take that as an offense. Because the bush league is nothing bad, as the way people put it. It’s just––it’s older people that you’re playing against. They had a great shot out of high school, and they go play somewhere. They probably didn’t have the grades, or they had the chance to play pro ball and they didn’t want to leave home. It’s nothing bad. It’s pretty much just another experience. A lot of my friends now are playing in that league. For a matter of fact, my little brother is out there. He’s trying to follow in my same footsteps. The day that I met Kemp––I think Kemp came when we were playing this team called the Black Sox. We were down like 16-4, and the coach was like, ‘Do you want to go pitch?’ My dad ran out there like, ‘No, no, no. He ain’t going out there. You are not going to go out there and pitch.’ I was like, ‘Come on, dad. I don’t even care if we win or lose.’ He was like, ‘Alright,’ and let me go out there. My uncle was the catcher. So after that, I ended up bringing us back and we ended up winning that game. I finished with, I think, 12 or 13 strikeouts, and I had two hits and an RBI. I think that’s when everything really changed––after that one game.