Re: What would you deal Garza for?

[JeffH]

Gonna pull a B2B move here for the first time, so just stay with me.

 

Cubs get: Rizzo, Turner, Smyly

Tigers get: Garza, Byrd

Padres get: Porcello, Tigers prospect

 

Cubs get their first baseman and two high upside starters. Tigers get Garza and some outfield insurance. Padres get a starter they could plug into their rotation to make up somewhat for the loss of Latos. And playing in Petco could help his numbers.

 

Laugh away.

 

the prospect the Padres get would have to be pretty good, which means the Tigers are giving up quite a bit here.

 

Cubs might have to give up Wells to the Tigers to effectively replace Porcello.

[Splendid Splinter]

Gonna pull a B2B move here for the first time, so just stay with me.

 

Cubs get: Rizzo, Turner, Smyly

Tigers get: Garza, Byrd

Padres get: Porcello, Tigers prospect

 

Cubs get their first baseman and two high upside starters. Tigers get Garza and some outfield insurance. Padres get a starter they could plug into their rotation to make up somewhat for the loss of Latos. And playing in Petco could help his numbers.

 

Laugh away.

 

the prospect the Padres get would have to be pretty good, which means the Tigers are giving up quite a bit here.

 

 

Also there's should be a Cubs prospect (for compensation of getting Hoyer) that should be going to the Padres.

[weis21]

Gonna pull a B2B move here for the first time, so just stay with me.

 

Cubs get: Rizzo, Turner, Smyly

Tigers get: Garza, Byrd

Padres get: Porcello, Tigers prospect

 

Cubs get their first baseman and two high upside starters. Tigers get Garza and some outfield insurance. Padres get a starter they could plug into their rotation to make up somewhat for the loss of Latos. And playing in Petco could help his numbers.

 

laugh away.

Just today I was thinking a three-way trade with cubs, tigers, pads could be a possibility given the reported conversations around both garza and rizzo. I agree the padres need just a bit more (probably from Cubs). Maybe someone like Lake? I have no clue what SD would covet from the cubs, though.

 

Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk

[davell]

Russell and young bullpen arms is what kept coming up with Headley.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Gonna pull a B2B move here for the first time, so just stay with me.

 

Cubs get: Rizzo, Turner, Smyly

Tigers get: Garza, Byrd

Padres get: Porcello, Tigers prospect

 

Cubs get their first baseman and two high upside starters. Tigers get Garza and some outfield insurance. Padres get a starter they could plug into their rotation to make up somewhat for the loss of Latos. And playing in Petco could help his numbers.

 

Laugh away.

 

the prospect the Padres get would have to be pretty good, which means the Tigers are giving up quite a bit here.

 

Cubs might have to give up Wells to the Tigers to effectively replace Porcello.

 

If Randy Wells was the only thing needed to make this trade a reality, believe me I wouldn't think twice. Also, I think the Padres would probably need a Cubs prospect as well as a Tigers prospect. Also, I don't know how appealing 1 year of Marlon Byrd would be to the Tigers especially when he's not much of an upgrade over their staring 3 outfielders but the Padres might have some interest in him. To rework things:

 

Cubs get: Rizzo, Turner, Smyley

Tigers get Garza, Wells

Padres get: Porcello, Byrd, Cubs prospect for purposes of compensation(Rhee, Antigue, J Jax)

 

In this case we should also end up with at least 1 more prospect.

Edited January 2, 2012 by Little Slide Rooter

[davell]

I have a feeling Prince is even holding up a Garza deal. Not because of we don't know whether or not we'll deal Garza or not, but because we've probably got SD involved in a deal, because of Rizzo, who we won't need, if we get Fielder obviously. That said, Detroit is a very good landing spot for either of Dewitt or Baker. I think one of them would be involved personally, probably Dewitt, since he's cheaper. How's this: San Diego sends Rizzo to us, we send Garza and Dewitt to Detroit, Detroit sends Porcello to San Diego, and Turner and Smyly to us. We send San Diego their choice of Carpenter or Dolis.

[Clem Fandango]

Padres need to move Kyle Blanks. Tigers don't really have a use for him with DH/1B locked up by Cabrera and V.Mart and LF is occupied by Delmon Young, though that's not saying much... but Blanks is inevitably going to be on the move and he provides a lot of intriguing offensive upside. I can't imagine a 3-way trade with these three teams involved without Blanks being involved. Padres have no reason to keep him on their roster with Quentin, Alonso, Guzman, and Rizzo on their roster at the moment

[USSoccer]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

 

Because they will be asked to coach a different way. Rather, told.

[CubsInNC]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

 

That's been one of my hangups. But, I'm pretty sure that with the advances in advance and self-video scouting, a lot of that will payoff in development of our own players. More of a, we're bringing things up to normal in some areas, so by default we'll have a better development system.

[treebird]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

 

Because they will be asked to coach a different way. Rather, told.

 

new boss: "JOHNSON, YOU'VE BEEN A HORRIBLE ACCOUNTANT FOR YEARS, IT'S KILLING OUR BUSINESS. AS YOUR NEW BOSS, I DEMAND THAT YOU START DOING A GOOD JOB INSTEAD OF A BAD JOB"

 

johnson: becomes competent employee

[TruffleShuffle]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

 

Because they will be asked to coach a different way. Rather, told.

 

new boss: "JOHNSON, YOU'VE BEEN A HORRIBLE ACCOUNTANT FOR YEARS, IT'S KILLING OUR BUSINESS. AS YOUR NEW BOSS, I DEMAND THAT YOU START DOING A GOOD JOB INSTEAD OF A BAD JOB"

 

johnson: becomes competent employee

 

yeah, i don't really have the concern about trading for highly-regarded prospects, but that's mostly because i assume there will be a lot of new people coming in to do things on the farm, not because the morons we've had running the show will all of a sudden become competent.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I have a feeling Prince is even holding up a Garza deal. Not because of we don't know whether or not we'll deal Garza or not, but because we've probably got SD involved in a deal, because of Rizzo, who we won't need, if we get Fielder obviously. That said, Detroit is a very good landing spot for either of Dewitt or Baker. I think one of them would be involved personally, probably Dewitt, since he's cheaper. How's this: San Diego sends Rizzo to us, we send Garza and Dewitt to Detroit, Detroit sends Porcello to San Diego, and Turner and Smyly to us. We send San Diego their choice of Carpenter or Dolis.

 

Nah, I think the only thing holding back a Garza deal is not getting what we want.

[toonsterwu]

Honest question: what good will trading for highly regarded prospects do if it's the same people in the developmental spots in the organization coaching them as in the past?

 

Well, it's a fair point. I'd argue that the system has actually done a good job of identifying and finding coaches (Kopitzke and Johnson were, for the most part, lauded for their efforts this year. Listach came up internally. Bill Dancy, Dennis Lewallyn were well-regarded as coaches. Mark Riggins was great in the minors, and I thought did a better than appreciated job in the majors). What it hasn't had, on the positional/offensive side, is a more advanced/structured approach to hitting. That philosophy has to come from the top down, from the organizational heads to the hitting coach at the major league level (have often heard how the MLB hitting coach significantly influences orgs hitting philosophies). If there's any concern I have with all this turnover, it's that Jaramillo, on paper, is still the hitting coach, and he's more of an aggressive guy at the plate. It works for some situations, not all, but I think the positive is that Sveum was a hitting coach and will be able to implement his vision.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

[mul21]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

 

Yeah, that thought is completely ridiculous. When one company buys another, they keep some of the employees and ask them to do their jobs in a different way in many cases. It's not like people are completely unable to adapt in any way. Some might be more difficult things to change, but it's certainly not ridiculous to think it can happen and in a significant way.

[mookie]

Um...twitter seems to be, albeit small sample, smelling Toronto and Drabek involved. Hmm. Twitter, I know, I know, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is about ready to go down.

[Rob]

Um...twitter seems to be, albeit small sample, smelling Toronto and Drabek involved. Hmm. Twitter, I know, I know, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is about ready to go down.

 

Who on twitter, exactly?

[El Duderino]

Um...twitter seems to be, albeit small sample, smelling Toronto and Drabek involved. Hmm. Twitter, I know, I know, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is about ready to go down.

 

if drabek is the centerpiece of a garza deal i'm going to vomit

[USSoccer]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

 

I'm a bit skeptical about baseball people in an organization rife with developmental failure being able to suddenly adapt to something likely totally different than has been dictated in the past.

[Have a seat, Neifi]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

 

I'm a bit skeptical about baseball people in an organization rife with developmental failure being able to suddenly adapt to something likely totally different than has been dictated in the past.

Our minor league development structure has scared the sh*t out of me ever since I read that interview with Sam Fuld following his trade to TBR.

[TruffleShuffle]

Um...twitter seems to be, albeit small sample, smelling Toronto and Drabek involved. Hmm. Twitter, I know, I know, but I wouldn't be surprised if it is about ready to go down.

 

Who on twitter, exactly?

 

it's probably just a regurgitation of this article.

 

only other thing i've found is this.

 

TradeDeadliner TradeDeadliner

#Cubs may want Drabek, Gose, Marisnick, MaGuire for Garza. Maybe not all, could be 2-3 of those 4. RT@BlueJays08 whats the rumour here?

 

i don't really see anything that would lead one to think that a deal is close, or that drabek/other stuff for garza is likely.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

 

I'm a bit skeptical about baseball people in an organization rife with developmental failure being able to suddenly adapt to something likely totally different than has been dictated in the past.

 

I believe that stuff comes from the very top. Our people at the Major League level are the ones who implement what is going to be taught in the lower levels by what they believe in, etc. Too bad for us, the higher ups and their way of doing things wasn't very good.

[USSoccer]

So some of you actually don't think a coach can be asked/told that we are doing things different, and then actually change what they are teaching? If, for instance, we want our prospects to start taking more walks, they can't come up with a way to teach that?

 

I disagree.

 

I'm a bit skeptical about baseball people in an organization rife with developmental failure being able to suddenly adapt to something likely totally different than has been dictated in the past.

 

I believe that stuff comes from the very top. Our people at the Major League level are the ones who implement what is going to be taught in the lower levels by what they believe in, etc. Too bad for us, the higher ups and their way of doing things wasn't very good.

 

I'm almost certain it's been incompetence at both levels

[82TonyM]

Heyman on Twitter:

 

"No real favorite'' in 5-team Garza derby

Posted on: January 1, 2012 10:06 pm

 

There is "no real favorite'' in the five-team Matt Garza sweepstakes, according to someone familiar with the talks.

 

The teams involved the derby for the 28-year-old Cubs righthander at this point are the Yankees, Blue Jays, Tigers, Red Sox and Marlins. With the Cubs seeking young pitchers, it would seem that the Yankees, Blue Jays and Tigers could hold an edge ultimately. The Yankees have Manny Banuelos and Dellin Betances, the Tigers Jacob Turner and the Blue Jays several well-regarded prospects at the lower levels. The Cubs are hoping to improve their young pitching stock, and Garza is the most marketable player they're willing to deal.

 

The Red Sox earlier named Garza, who went 10-10 with a 3.31 ERA in 2011, his only one with the Cubs, as a target in Theo Epstein compensation talks, but it's unclear wether the Cubs would even consider trying to solve the compensation issue while making a bigger Garza deal with Boston. They wouldn't surrender Garza straight-up for Epstein, and it's possible the Cubs would want to keep Garza and the compensation issues totally separate. The Red Sox don't have pitching prospects to match the Yankees or Blue Jays but do have hard-throwing righthander Anthony Ranaudo, who was drafted by Epstein, the new Cubs president.

 

The Cubs are obviously rebuilding but have been nonetheless tied to the Prince Fielder derby. A Cubs person suggested that while Fielder is the type of player they need, they aren't willing to pursue Fielder at all costs, a not unfamiliar refain for teams pursuing big-name free agents.