Glasnow...Now?

[CubinNY]

In one of these many pitching FA threads rolling around the new and improved NSBB there were some comments about Tallion. I am actually fairly optimistic about a healthy bounce-back year for him if he comes into spring training in shape. He came into camp last year about 20-30 pounds overweight. But he had a great spring. I'm pretty sure he had 0 walks in Arizona. Then as the year started he lost his command. I think this was partially because he was out of shape. I don't expect that Jed Hoyer's Cubs will let that happen again. 

So If Tallion can pitch like he's capable of pitching and they had a front-line starter along with what they already have, they may have the best starting 6-7 in the NL.

I'm less optimistic about Hendricks moving forward. I'm hoping he can muster 10 good starts. 

[mul21]

13 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

I don’t think it is a hard decision at all. Cubs have a lot of similar middle relief/lonf relief/spot starters. I wouldn’t think twice about moving Wesnecki. They can have Thompson too(another easily replaced pitcher)

His name is Wesneski.

[Rcal10]

14 minutes ago, mul21 said:

His name is Wesneski.

See what I mean. So easy to replace I don’t even know how to spell his name. Thanks for pointing that out. 

[CubinNY]

8 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

See what I mean. So easy to replace I don’t even know how to spell his name. Thanks for pointing that out. 

Wisnecki is from Humboldt Park and he's off the books plumber who also, "knows some guys". 

[Rcal10]

4 minutes ago, TomtheBombadil said:

MLBTR or one of their local papers did a whole thing on non-Glasnow ways to clear Tampa’s payroll (the forever goal of this model 21st century sports entertainment org) and Lowe was included. They mentioned some injuries in the MiF, that Brujan is more likely, but also injuries to the pitching staff haven’t stopped Glasnow rumors and if they just want to get cheaper and younger a soontobe 30 YO with a contract …He’s a terrific fit if (wisely?) willing to move around the infield before FA

This is definitely influenced by conditioning/brainwashing for the looming cap (what we euphemistically most often call budget this year), really they should do both, but I’d much rather go the extra mile for Logan Gilbert than Glasnow right now 

I think the difference in cost between those two would be like going an extra marathon not a mile. But sure, Gilbert would be the much better addition. 

[Tryptamine]

24 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

I think the difference in cost between those two would be like going an extra marathon not a mile. But sure, Gilbert would be the much better addition. 

Yeah, you're talking the difference between like Assad vs PCA+Morel+more. The acquisition gap is huge.

[Rcal10]

17 minutes ago, TomtheBombadil said:

The difference in trade cost is offset massively by the contract situations and really probably by prospects being overrated . One thing I feel confident in promising is there will always be prospects to pin hopes on, they’ll add another 30+ shiny news next year alone even if the draft goes international 

Personally I looooove the idea of trading some popular prospects now while everyone’s still mysterious

I get that. I am not a prospect horder. I am fine with them moving guys out because a new one will be in. And Gilbert is a guy who makes sense to deal for. But the cost will be very high. 

[Transmogrified Tiger]

 

[gocubs218]

That tweet says absolutely nothing that we didn’t already know. 

[muntjack]

That move works in such perfect concert with Ohtani........

[Bertz]

33 minutes ago, gocubs218 said:

That tweet says absolutely nothing that we didn’t already know. 

I think there's some value in a local guy confirming it.

I do kind of wonder if there's like a backlog of stuff that's going to happen boom boom boom once Ohtani makes his decision.  Like if I recall correctly, in 2015 Zobrist, Montero, and Ross all happened within like a day of Lester.  Now granted it was the winter meetings, but it felt like those there was a specific progression there.

[JD94]

4 minutes ago, Bertz said:

I think there's some value in a local guy confirming it.

I do kind of wonder if there's like a backlog of stuff that's going to happen boom boom boom once Ohtani makes his decision.  Like if I recall correctly, in 2015 Zobrist, Montero, and Ross all happened within like a day of Lester.  Now granted it was the winter meetings, but it felt like those there was a specific progression there.

I’m also wondering if the Cubs would like to strike a semi big deal soon before Ohtani signs to show him we are serious about adding around him and going all in with him should he choose us. 

[CubinNY]

13 minutes ago, JD94 said:

I’m also wondering if the Cubs would like to strike a semi big deal soon before Ohtani signs to show him we are serious about adding around him and going all in with him should he choose us. 

That will have 0 impact on signing him. If they weren't serious, they wouldn't be in the bidding to give him half a billion dollars to play baseball for them. 

[mul21]

1 minute ago, CubinNY said:

That will have 0 impact on signing him. If they weren't serious, they wouldn't be in the bidding to give him half a billion dollars to play baseball for them. 

Your absolutist attitude toward things is pretty wild considering you know nothing about his preferences.

[CubinNY]

3 minutes ago, mul21 said:

Your absolutist attitude toward things is pretty wild considering you know nothing about his preferences.

come on. It's asinine. The Cubs and all the other teams trying to woo Ohtani are all working on multiple fronts to make their teams better. No team is going to sit on their hands and wait out to see what happens. They have to proceed as if he's not going to sign with them. The effect on Ohtani is not relevant. In other words, the Cubs are not spending farm capital and $25M to show Ohtani they mean business. Everyone should know that. 

[squally1313]

5 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

come on. It's asinine. The Cubs and all the other teams trying to woo Ohtani are all working on multiple fronts to make their teams better. No team is going to sit on their hands and wait out to see what happens. They have to proceed as if he's not going to sign with them. The effect on Ohtani is not relevant. In other words, the Cubs are not spending farm capital and $25M to show Ohtani they mean business. Everyone should know that. 

Occam's razor is just 'offer him the most money' for sure. But to the extent Ohtani cares about winning (which we don't honestly know), there's maybe something to him, coming off his Angels run, being wary of some team throwing their checkbook at him just to tap into new revenue streams and boost ticket sales while point to his salary as the reason they can't supplement the team around him. While this wouldn't like, help us beat out the Dodgers, who can just point to all the other HOFers currently on the roster, I could see something like this (and the Counsell hiring) at least making the powerpoint. 

[CubinNY]

1 minute ago, squally1313 said:

Occam's razor is just 'offer him the most money' for sure. But to the extent Ohtani cares about winning (which we don't honestly know), there's maybe something to him, coming off his Angels run, being wary of some team throwing their checkbook at him just to tap into new revenue streams and boost ticket sales while point to his salary as the reason they can't supplement the team around him. While this wouldn't like, help us beat out the Dodgers, who can just point to all the other HOFers currently on the roster, I could see something like this (and the Counsell hiring) at least making the powerpoint. 

ok. Put it in the PowerPoint in 18pt font along with making him Grand Marshall of the St. Patrick's Day Parade. Next to the 32pt font of half a billion dollars. 

[SOFNR]

The Dodgers win 100 games and the division almost every year. The Cubs havn't show much interest in putting forward the sort of resources that make that possible. The Dodgers won 100 last year. The Cubs won 83. If winning is at the top of the list for Ohtani then the Dodgers have a pretty big advantage at the moment. You can pitch to Ohtani all day that you are building a contender right now but actions speak a lot louder then words. It's very plausible that making a couple big moves during negotiations could impact his decision in a positive way and show they are fully committed to acting like a big market team.

Edited November 30, 2023 by SOFNR

[Rcal10]

5 minutes ago, SOFNR said:

The Dodgers win 100 games and the division almost every year. The Cubs havn't show much interest in putting forward the sort of resources that make that possible. The Dodgers won 100 last year. The Cubs won 83. If winning is at the top of the list for Ohtani then the Dodgers have a pretty big advantage at the moment. You can pitch to Ohtani all day that you are building a contender right now but actions speak a lot louder then words. It's very plausible that making a couple big moves during negotiations could impact his decision in a positive way and show they are fully committed to acting like a big market team.

I don’t know how much it helps to show Otani they are committed to winning, but it can’t hurt. I am sure they aren’t going to make a deal just to prove a point to Otani. But if they get the right deal prior to Otani signing I am sure they will make it and let him know they did so as confirmation they are trying to put a winning team in the field in 24’. In the end the most money or bet structured contract to the players wishes typically wins out, however. 

[Transmogrified Tiger]

5 minutes ago, SOFNR said:

The Dodgers win 100 games and the division almost every year. The Cubs havn't show much interest in putting forward the sort of resources that make that possible. The Dodgers won 100 last year. The Cubs won 83. If winning is at the top of the list for Ohtani then the Dodgers have a pretty big advantage at the moment. You can pitch to Ohtani all day that you are building a contender right now but actions speak a lot louder then words. It's very plausible that making a couple big moves during negotiations could impact his decision in a positive way and show they are fully committed to acting like a big market team.

Yep.  In a reality where the Dodgers are also offering a half billion dollars and Ohtani cares about not being in Angels purgatory anymore, illustrating that he would be joining a team that is actively improving could matter.  I don't think they'd make a move that they wouldn't otherwise, but it seems very reasonable to me that they could be motivated to pay a little bit more to get that over the line quicker.

[Cuzi]

If I'm a player looking to win, I'm not looking for "wide open." Wide open can go both ways. The Dodgers are simply going to be winning. It's not a question.

[Rcal10]

24 minutes ago, Cuzi said:

If I'm a player looking to win, I'm not looking for "wide open." Wide open can go both ways. The Dodgers are simply going to be winning. It's not a question.

Very true. If he wants a sure playoff experience he goes to the Dodgers. However we don’t know what else he values. And I am also certain the Cubs can make a case to him that with him they will be very good. If he loves Chicago, guys like Darvish and Suzucki talk it up, he loves the park and the Cubs offer is right up there with what he wants, both in money and structure, I wouldn’t worry about him not coming here because he isn’t sure they can win. 

[CubinNY]

43 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

I don’t know how much it helps to show Otani they are committed to winning, but it can’t hurt. I am sure they aren’t going to make a deal just to prove a point to Otani. But if they get the right deal prior to Otani signing I am sure they will make it and let him know they did so as confirmation they are trying to put a winning team in the field in 24’. In the end the most money or bet structured contract to the players wishes typically wins out, however. 

agreed

[squally1313]

1 hour ago, CubinNY said:

ok. Put it in the PowerPoint in 18pt font along with making him Grand Marshall of the St. Patrick's Day Parade. Next to the 32pt font of half a billion dollars. 

The thing about the half billion at 32 point font is that it becomes less of a differentiator when every other team also includes it in the powerpoint.

Having said that, if it leaks or if for some reason they try to sell the Counsell move and whatever other player moves as a substitute for cash (rather than a complement), I will be incredibly disappointed at their cheapness/stupidity.

[gocubs218]

Let’s get this done before the meetings start.