HAPPY MITCHELL REPORT DAY!!!!!!!! Clemens named.

[jersey cubs fan]

Alright, I'm bored. You guys are never going to persuade me into thinking Sammy wasn't a user, and I'm not going to be able to persuade you into thinking he was. We'll all just have to agree to disagree.

 

I think he probably did, I just also think it's meaningful that there is absolutely no evidence that says he did. I can't say it's stupid to think that maybe he didn't.

[pitchcs]

Alright, I'm bored. You guys are never going to persuade me into thinking Sammy wasn't a user, and I'm not going to be able to persuade you into thinking he was. We'll all just have to agree to disagree.

 

I think he probably did, I just also think it's meaningful that there is absolutely no evidence that says he did. I can't say it's stupid to think that maybe he didn't.

 

I would think that he 'probably' did as well. However, I could really care less.

[OleMissCub]

i'm not talking in the report but the actual list of names that are circulating from the report. bonds, sosa, wood, prior & mcgwire are not on the list

 

There is a BOGUS list and a REAL list.

 

THIS IS THE REAL LIST as created by ME skimming through the document very quickly:

 

Marvin Benard

Barry Bonds

Bobby Estalella

Jason Giambi

Jeremy Giambi

Benito Santiago

Gary Sheffield

Randy Velarde

Lenny Dysktra

David Segui

Larry Bigbie

Brian Roberts

Jack Cust

Tim Laker

Josias Manzanillo

Todd Hundley

Mark Carreon

Hal Morris

Matt Franco

Rondell White

Roger Clemens

Andy Pettite

Chuck Knoblauch

Jason Grimsley

Greg Zaun

David Justice

F.P. Santangello

Glenallen Hill

Mo Vaughn

Denny Neagle

Ron Villone

Ryan Franklin

Chris Donnels

Todd Williams

Phil Hiatt

Todd Pratt

Kevin Young

Mike Lansing

Cody Mckay

Kent Mercker

Andy Piatt

Miguel Tejada

Jason Christianson

Mike Stanton

Stephen Randolph

Jerry Hairston Jr.

Paul Lo Duca

Adam Riggs

Bart Miadich

Chad Allen

Fernando Vina

Kevin Brown

Eric Gagne

Mike Bell

Matt Herges

Gary Bennett Jr.

Jim Parque

Brandon Donnelly

Jeff Williams

Howie Clark

Nook Logan

Daniel Naulty

Rick Ankiel

Paul Byrd

Jay Gibbons

Troy Glaus

Jose Guillen

Gary Matthews, Jr.

Scott Schoeneweis

Jose Canseco

Jason Grimsley

Darren Holmes

John Rocker

Ismael Valdez

Matt Williams

Steve Woodard

David Bell

[hawkeyecub]

 

So what? Have you ever known a steroid user? That's much of the point of steroids. You're able to workout hard for long periods of time but recover quicker and make gains that you can't make naturally.

 

As far as his diet and economics, do you guys not realize how many players have come from the Dominican, Venezuela, etc. and grew up dirt poor?

 

Seriously if you want to continue to believe Sosa didn't use, that's your own thing. But those are two of the stupidest excuses I've ever heard.

 

I've known plenty of steroids users. Knew a guy who ran a website selling them in the 90's. Drove around in brand new sports cars all the time and was arrested multiple times.

 

Not sure what that has to do with anything.

Not sure how those are two stupid excuses.

 

Okay I didn't word that first part the way I should have, but my point was that if you've worked out with someone on steroids you know the superhuman workouts they can have that others can't.

In college I knew about 6 guys who shot up in the offseason and weren't ashamed of telling anyone. They pooled money together and figured out what worked best by trial and error. Before they started using or during the season when they cycled off, they were basically average in terms of length, volume and vigor of the workouts. Once January rolled around everything started to increase noticeably. In April and beyond they absolutely blew past all of us who were similar. They would lift hard for 2.5 hours, sometimes more. If any of us even tried to keep up we would be absolutely shot for days or would just break down. They recovered the exact same way we did.

 

Long story short, someone supposedly working out harder means nothing. If anything it almost raises suspicions if you're talking about a guy being able to have marathon weight sessions compared to other elite athletes who are putting in effort.

By the way I'm just talking about just strength training, not cardio, endurance or plyometrics.

[wrigley23]

ok...so back to my question...

[Roast]

Long story short, someone supposedly working out harder means nothing. If anything it almost raises suspicions if you're talking about a guy being able to have marathon weight sessions compared to other elite athletes who are putting in effort.

By the way I'm just talking about just strength training, not cardio, endurance or plyometrics.

 

Alone it doesn't mean anything. But that combined with the fact that he's never been named in any steroid report...well, that's a different story.

 

ok, I said i'm done with this debate tho. Time to go play some madden and drink Egg nogg in celebration of Finals being over.

[OleMissCub]

ok...so back to my question...

 

How is this so hard for you?

[UK1679666180]

While I think this is just another chapter of the dog and pony show, I hope this stirs the pot as far as increased testing, mentioning names does nothing but turn it into a larger soap opera and create more of a buzz.

 

I'm for increased testing, just disappointed it takes spectacles like this to get there.

[brinoch]

I am 32 years old. I designed what I would call a modest workout program for myself this April (around a 2 hour workout 3 times a week plus playing soccer on Sundays). When I started, I was in decent running shape for soccer, but betrayed by several years of playing goalie -- I weighed 175 with about 24% body fat. In 5 months I was at 170 with a 13% body fat.

 

I gained more than 14 pounds of muscle in 5 months. If I had more time and a trainer to really help focus me, I could have gained more muscle than that. My arms, chest and legs are noticeably larger. Any baseball player who wasn't bulked up already could easily undertake this relatively easy regimen and see similar results. All it takes is a little time. And in the offseason, they all have plenty of time.

[wrigley23]

i'm not following you. mcgwire, sosa, wood & prior are not on the list. i'm only asking why? i thought they were supposed to have been named.

[nilodnayr]

Does the report say exactly what kind of performance enhancing drugs were used? HGH or anabolic or another kind?

 

Yes, it says how they got the evidence and what drugs they took.

[Roast]

ok...so back to my question...

 

I think you're confused. The report is where the list comes from. That other list that was circulating is Bogus. The list OMC posted is a list of names that he compiled after reading through the names listed on the report. Therefore the players on OMC. I don't get what you're not understanding.

[Cubfanintheknow]

OleMissCub's list looks pretty good to me. I did a similar scan and noted the same names.

 

Interesting, no Sosa (not that I expected his name to be all over the thing. But there's another thread I started that might cause some speculation).

 

At first I thought the report would do nothing more than nail Bonds to the wall. But about midway through they got to the others. Mitchell did a pretty good job hammering Roger Clemens.

[wrigley23]

again, sosa, mcgwire, prior & wood are not on the list. i'm just saying, i'm surprised as i thought they would be on it based on earlier reports.

[Roast]

i'm not following you. mcgwire, sosa, wood & prior are not on the list. i'm only asking why? i thought they were supposed to have been named.

Because that first list was bogus. They pulled those names out of their asses. Period. it was false. Their names were not on the list because they couldn't find proof they did steroids in their research.

[nilodnayr]

i'm not following you. mcgwire, sosa, wood & prior are not on the list. i'm only asking why? i thought they were supposed to have been named.

 

 

That list that came out before the actual report was a bogus list.

[E.J.]

i'm not following you. mcgwire, sosa, wood & prior are not on the list. i'm only asking why? i thought they were supposed to have been named.

 

The list that came out this morning was false. Sosa, Wood, and Prior were on that list. BUT IT WAS FALSE. The real list came out an hour ago and Sosa, Wood, and Prior were not named in it.

[cubweiser03]

OleMissCub's list looks pretty good to me. I did a similar scan and noted the same names.

 

Interesting, no Sosa (not that I expected his name to be all over the thing. But there's another thread I started that might cause some speculation).

 

At first I thought the report would do nothing more than nail Bonds to the wall. But about midway through they got to the others. Mitchell did a pretty good job hammering Roger Clemens.

 

Do you know what page he starts on about Clemens?

[CubinNY]

It's kind of funny watching you guys try to convince yourselves that Sammy wasn't a roid user.

Where is your proof/evidence?

[jersey cubs fan]

but it was on the internet?

[Roast]

It's kind of funny watching you guys try to convince yourselves that Sammy wasn't a roid user.

Where is your proof/evidence?

 

Didn't you see those pictures he posted? pictures speak a thousand words you know. So, that's liek two thousand words he posted.

 

Ok. Ok, i'm removing myself from this. I should be happy. Sosa wasn't on the list and I'm off school till the last week of january, now.

[OleMissCub]

OleMissCub's list looks pretty good to me. I did a similar scan and noted the same names.

 

Interesting, no Sosa (not that I expected his name to be all over the thing. But there's another thread I started that might cause some speculation).

 

At first I thought the report would do nothing more than nail Bonds to the wall. But about midway through they got to the others. Mitchell did a pretty good job hammering Roger Clemens.

 

Do you know what page he starts on about Clemens?

 

Page 167

[CuseCubFan69]

Why isn't Raffy on the list?

[ottawacubbie]

Ferguson Jenkins is listed 26 times, but it seems to be all about weed and coke with the Rangers.

[OleMissCub]

Ferguson Jenkins is listed 26 times, but it seems to be all about weed and coke with the Rangers.

 

Yeah, it's only in an introductory section that talks about the history of substance abuse and MLB's response to it.