How much are so many Cub fans overrating Ryan Theriot?

[nolanwood]

I think some of these Theriot comparisons are a bit off. His #'s at the moment are skewed from his major slump in the month of September. At the end of August, Theriot's line:

 

.281 .341 .367 .707

 

Those numbers are not close to Izturis, or the 250 less AB's than Theriot he brought to the table that would've adjusted his numbers towards the pathetic side even more.

[Keener98]

Like was mentioned, Theriot had one great month of July where he had an OPS over .900, but has been pretty awful every other month. He has a .330 OBP which is not good for a leadoff or #2 hitter. You couple that with Fonzie's OBP, and we have a 1 and 2 hitter who are below average at getting on base. Not exactly what you'd like from the guys hitting in front of your RBI guys.

 

He's 20th in OPS for all SS. Not really setting the world on fire. Sure, he's shown great defense at SS, but I'd like to have a little offense from the position as well. The Riot doesn't hit for any power and has shown that he's not all that great at getting on base either. He's a great utility guy who's been forced into a starting role because we have no other opttions. I'd love to see an upgrade at SS this offseason.

 

Dude quit using OPS with Theriot, it doesnt count his stolen bases, and hustle man, its no fail

[Keener98]

I think some of these Theriot comparisons are a bit off. His #'s at the moment are skewed from his major slump in the month of September. At the end of August, Theriot's line:

 

.281 .341 .367 .707

 

Those numbers are not close to Izturis, or the 250 less AB's than Theriot he brought to the table that would've adjusted his numbers towards the pathetic side even more.

 

No his numbers are skewed from his ridiculous July when he put up an OPS over 900.

 

Other than that month he hasnt put up an OPS over 700 in any single month.

[Sammy Sofa]

I'd imagine many of the Theriot-lovers were weeping for days when Burnitz was traded. Man, that guy hustled his heart out and he was mediocre as all get-out.

[CubinNY]

Yes. There's a lot to like about him from an image standpoint. Everybody likes the underdog or in this case undersized player. That doesn't make him a good player. It also dosen't mean he sucks either. It's too bad he's 27. If he was 24 or younger I might think he has a future.

[Abe Frohman]

When is the last time Theriot threw one by Lee? When is the last time he loafed? How many runs has he scored, and where does that stand on the team.

 

Theriot is a big reason this team is in a pennant race. Some times statistics just don't tell the whole story.

[UMFan83]

I'd imagine many of the Theriot-lovers were weeping for days when Burnitz was traded. Man, that guy hustled his heart out and he was mediocre as all get-out.

 

Except Burnitz was a corner OF with below average defense, while Theriot is a SS with above average defense.

[Rob]

EqA for NL starting shortstops. (min. 250 PA)

 

Hanley Ramirez - .320

Edgar Renteria - .302

Jimmy Rollins - .290

Jose Reyes - .285

Troy Tulowitzki - .275

Jack Wilson - .267

Khalil Greene - .263

Alex Gonzalez - .262

David Eckstein - .262

JJ Hardy - .262

Mark Loretta - .254

Rafael Furcal - .245

Ryan Theriot - .243

Felipe Lopez - .236

Stephen Drew - .231

Omar Vizquel - .216

 

He'd look much better in the AL, where teams can afford to hide below-average bats thanks to having a DH... but he's not even a pretty good bat for an NL SS.

[Outshined_One]

He's our own David Eckstein.

 

...except David Eckstein is a better hitter. I just threw up in my mouth a bit.

[CuseCubFan69]

He's our own David Eckstein.

 

...except David Eckstein is a better hitter. I just threw up in my mouth a bit.

 

So now you want the Cubs to offer Eckstein a 3 year 24 million dollar deal this off season?

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

EqA for NL starting shortstops. (min. 250 PA)

 

Hanley Ramirez - .320

Edgar Renteria - .302

Jimmy Rollins - .290

Jose Reyes - .285

Troy Tulowitzki - .275

Jack Wilson - .267

Khalil Greene - .263

Alex Gonzalez - .262

David Eckstein - .262

JJ Hardy - .262

Mark Loretta - .254

Rafael Furcal - .245

Ryan Theriot - .243

Felipe Lopez - .236

Stephen Drew - .231

Omar Vizquel - .216

 

He'd look much better in the AL, where teams can afford to hide below-average bats thanks to having a DH... but he's not even a pretty good bat for an NL SS.

 

Hanley Ramirez is good

[CubinNY]

EqA for NL starting shortstops. (min. 250 PA)

 

Hanley Ramirez - .320

Edgar Renteria - .302

Jimmy Rollins - .290

Jose Reyes - .285

Troy Tulowitzki - .275

Jack Wilson - .267

Khalil Greene - .263

Alex Gonzalez - .262

David Eckstein - .262

JJ Hardy - .262

Mark Loretta - .254

Rafael Furcal - .245

Ryan Theriot - .243

Felipe Lopez - .236

Stephen Drew - .231

Omar Vizquel - .216

 

He'd look much better in the AL, where teams can afford to hide below-average bats thanks to having a DH... but he's not even a pretty good bat for an NL SS.

 

Hanley Ramirez is good

I'm soooooo glad Furcal decide Chicago wasn't good enough for him.

[Keener98]

I'd imagine many of the Theriot-lovers were weeping for days when Burnitz was traded. Man, that guy hustled his heart out and he was mediocre as all get-out.

 

Except Burnitz was a corner OF with below average defense, while Theriot is a SS with above average defense.

 

Thats very very debatable. Average defense yes, but not above

[Rob]

EqA for NL starting shortstops. (min. 250 PA)

 

Hanley Ramirez - .320

Edgar Renteria - .302

Jimmy Rollins - .290

Jose Reyes - .285

Troy Tulowitzki - .275

Jack Wilson - .267

Khalil Greene - .263

Alex Gonzalez - .262

David Eckstein - .262

JJ Hardy - .262

Mark Loretta - .254

Rafael Furcal - .245

Ryan Theriot - .243

Felipe Lopez - .236

Stephen Drew - .231

Omar Vizquel - .216

 

He'd look much better in the AL, where teams can afford to hide below-average bats thanks to having a DH... but he's not even a pretty good bat for an NL SS.

 

Hanley Ramirez is good

I'm soooooo glad Furcal decide Chicago wasn't good enough for him.

 

Well for what it's worth, Furcal is 23 runs better with the glove than Theriot, if you believe FRAA. Those two full wins would have come in pretty handy right now.

[Guest]

He's our own David Eckstein.

 

...except David Eckstein is a better hitter. I just threw up in my mouth a bit.

We've always got Darwin Barney, who is not only a gritty huslter, but also a proven winner!

[USSoccer]

If our overall offense was better Theriot would be a nice player to hit 7th or 8th.

[neely crenshaw]

eckstein has been around a lot longer and did not start off as the hitter he is.

theriot is very good. we don't have an arod or rollins or tejada..and right now we could not afford to pay one. he is cheap. he is faster than heck

he plays d.

look at what it cost for izturis for similar production!

is he an all star..no but when you have put all stars at 3b,1b and lf and paid what we paid our pitchers you can't afford one at ss.

please look at what eckstien,greene,visquel or furcal make. do we really want to drop between an extra 8 and 12 mil a year to have our shortstop hit 20-30 points higher? not to mention the fact that the chances are he gets better every year that he plays!

[E.J.]

eckstein has been around a lot longer and did not start off as the hitter he is.

theriot is very good. we don't have an arod or rollins or tejada..and right now we could not afford to pay one. he is cheap. he is faster than heck

he plays d.

look at what it cost for izturis for similar production!

is he an all star..no but when you have put all stars at 3b,1b and lf and paid what we paid our pitchers you can't afford one at ss.

please look at what eckstien,greene,visquel or furcal make. do we really want to drop between an extra 8 and 12 mil a year to have our shortstop hit 20-30 points higher? not to mention the fact that the chances are he gets better every year that he plays!

 

When looking at The Riots' numbers, I fail to see how he's "very good". He's 27 years old in basically his first full season of baseball, putting up offensive numbers that ranks him 20th in the Majors for all SS. I fail to see how that can be considered "very good." And there are a lot of players that are faster than heck. That doesn't make them good.

[neely crenshaw]

I'd imagine many of the Theriot-lovers were weeping for days when Burnitz was traded. Man, that guy hustled his heart out and he was mediocre as all get-out.

 

Except Burnitz was a corner OF with below average defense, while Theriot is a SS with above average defense.

 

I have always said it wasn't burnitz' fault he failed. he was signed as a corner of..at a pretty decent cost to replace sosa and alou. he did exactly what he did his entire career hit 250 with 25-30 hrs, strike out, play average to below average defense and hsutle. the probklem was our management signed him to be our huge power guy and carry the team with an outfield of murton and pierre...which he simply is not that type of player. similar to what they did to jones last year.

theriot is cheap and does not need to hit 50hrs to help this team.

[rawaction]

I thought Burnitz was really good in the OF, the year he was with the Cubs.

[SouthSideRyan]

Theriot is good for what he is, but the original poster is right, he's way overrated by Cubs fans. He should be the 8 hitter.

[Fred Hornkohl]

I'd imagine many of the Theriot-lovers were weeping for days when Burnitz was traded. Man, that guy hustled his heart out and he was mediocre as all get-out.

 

Except Burnitz was a corner OF with below average defense, while Theriot is a SS with above average defense.

 

I have always said it wasn't burnitz' fault he failed. he was signed as a corner of..at a pretty decent cost to replace sosa and alou. he did exactly what he did his entire career hit 250 with 25-30 hrs, strike out, play average to below average defense and hsutle. the probklem was our management signed him to be our huge power guy and carry the team with an outfield of murton and pierre...which he simply is not that type of player. similar to what they did to jones last year.

theriot is cheap and does not need to hit 50hrs to help this team.

 

Burnitz and Pierre were never teammates.

[neely crenshaw]

a little comparison

eckstein..2001(26yrs old) .285 26 (2B) 2 (3B) 4(HR) 29 Steals .355obp

971. fielding at short

Theriot..2007(27yrs old) .268 30(2b) 3 (3b) 3 (hr) 26 steals .330obp . 974 fielding at short...

I think we are ok for a while at short.

 

I'm sure we could drop another 10mil to get a little better offense at short but unless you are the yankees you simplt can not afford to do that everywhere.

i would rather see us spend money on another top pitcher and hope that our corner guys who are counted on to hit 330 and 35-40 hrs come around.

[RynoRules]

If our overall offense was better Theriot would be a nice player to hit 7th or 8th.

 

Correct. Add Tejada or ARod to this lineup and you have:

 

Soriano

Theriot

Lee

ARod/Tejada

ARam

Derosa (RF)

Kendall / Soto

Pie / Jones

 

Looks quite a bit different, IMO.

[Rob]

If our overall offense was better Theriot would be a nice player to hit 7th or 8th.

 

Correct. Add Tejada or ARod to this lineup and you have:

 

Soriano

Theriot

Lee

ARod/Tejada

ARam

Derosa (RF)

Kendall / Soto

Pie / Jones

 

Looks quite a bit different, IMO.

 

Even considering Murton's early year-slump, his numbers are much much better than Theriot's. Why on earth would you sit him and move DeRosa to right just to get Theriot in the lineup?

 

Also, why throw Tejada in at 4th in the order? He's not a better hitter than Aramis.