Ryan Braun suspended for rest of 2013

[Cubswin11]

Has an accused PED user ever been shown to be innocent?

Not in MLB that I can recall. Better question, other than Hedo why are there never any NBA guys who test positive or are accused?

[Sammy Sofa]

And, given how it's ridiculously obvious how many guys are using, how come relatively nobody is busted or even accused in the NFL? The other major sports must LOVE how all of the PED-heat is on baseball.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Even when they are busted in the NFL, they're never really vilified. Shawne Merriman comes to mind.

[ConstableRabbit]

Even when they are busted in the NFL, they're never really vilified. Shawne Merriman comes to mind.

Rodney Harrison as well.

[ConstableRabbit]

Terry Bradshaw.

[MWV]

I could be misremembering, but no one really cared about PEDs in baseball until 2 of the game's most revered numbers were eclipsed by dopers. I think that the continuing outrage over PEDs in baseball stems from the demise of that romantic notion of baseball and the nostalgia that accompanied it.

[Sammy Sofa]

Eh, even then nobody really cared (outside of a tiny handful of reporters) about it because it "saved the game" and all of that gobbledygook despite it being hidden in plain sight. It really wasn't until Bonds exploded and suddenly you had a guy who wasn't going to kiss the media's ass and was just straight up unlikable did you have any real effort to expose things (and even then the effort was pretty halfassed and operating under the idea that only a relative few had been or are using).

[MWV]

Eh, even then nobody really cared (outside of a tiny handful of reporters) about it because it "saved the game" and all of that gobbledygook despite it being hidden in plain sight. It really wasn't until Bonds exploded and suddenly you had a guy who wasn't going to kiss the media's ass and was just straight up unlikable did you have any real effort to expose things (and even then the effort was pretty halfassed and operating under the idea that only a relative few had been or are using).

 

I think you're correct that Bonds' being so unlikable had a lot to do with the rise of PED outrage among baseball fans. People broadly accepted the idea that a talented jerk could make himself into a phenomenal, record-stealing colossus through illicit drug use. Bonds' case cultivated a sense among baseball fans that PEDs made baseball really unfair, and I'm not sure that any analogous example exists in football, for instance. I'm not an avid football fan, though.

[jersey cubs fan]

And, given how it's ridiculously obvious how many guys are using, how come relatively nobody is busted or even accused in the NFL? The other major sports must LOVE how all of the PED-heat is on baseball.

 

Baseball is the only one of these sports that lives in its past and glorifies it to the extent that they do.

 

To this day the greatest baseball players discussions begins and ends with a whole bunch of dead guys that baby boomers grew up watching, or rather listening to on their radio under their covers blahblahblah.

 

Footballs greatest players, with the exception of running backs, all play right now and the NFL is very happy about that. The hero worship in the NBA goes back to Jordan for most people and Kobe Bryant is practically an old timer. Hockey isn't on any of these lists, but outside of Montreal and Toronto, everybody worships at least guys who played in the 80's/90's (Gretzky Lemieux) and have been going gaga for it forever.

 

Baseball is all about history, sanctity, myth making and the poetry of the game rather than just really good pitchers throwing to really good hitters. It stands to reason the sport that thrives on the memories of 60 year old men who all think they created their own success and who can't stand the young kids is more up in arms about steroids (a theoretically modern change to the game).

[Sammy Sofa]

Right, but the ironic thing is that looking fondly back on (certain types of) cheating is part of the mythology. That's one of the most hypocritical things about that approach.

[captain_kickass]

I've seen on other websites that TJ Quinn was on ESPN news citing a source that MLB is dangling a lifetime ban over A-Rod's head.

 

Found a video:

 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=9500303

 

Starts at about 1:30

[Banedon]

I've seen on other websites that TJ Quinn was on ESPN news citing a source that MLB is dangling a lifetime ban over A-Rod's head.

 

Found a video:

 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=9500303

 

Starts at about 1:30

 

A-rod's done anyway. Would a lifetime ban void his contract?

[mul21]

I've seen on other websites that TJ Quinn was on ESPN news citing a source that MLB is dangling a lifetime ban over A-Rod's head.

 

Found a video:

 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=9500303

 

Starts at about 1:30

 

A-rod's done anyway. Would a lifetime ban void his contract?

 

I don't think it would matter because PED suspensions are without pay.

[jersey cubs fan]

I've seen on other websites that TJ Quinn was on ESPN news citing a source that MLB is dangling a lifetime ban over A-Rod's head.

 

Found a video:

 

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=9500303

 

Starts at about 1:30

 

A-rod's done anyway. Would a lifetime ban void his contract?

 

I don't think it would matter because PED suspensions are without pay.

It matters. With that much money on the line it definitely matters.

[mul21]

 

A-rod's done anyway. Would a lifetime ban void his contract?

 

I don't think it would matter because PED suspensions are without pay.

It matters. With that much money on the line it definitely matters.

 

Not if there's a PED suspension it won't. If he doesn't get a lifetime ban, then there will be some haggling/buyout. If he's suspended he's not getting paid.

[Wilson A2000]

Is ARod a repeat offender officially now?

[jersey cubs fan]

 

A-rod's done anyway. Would a lifetime ban void his contract?

 

I don't think it would matter because PED suspensions are without pay.

It matters. With that much money on the line it definitely matters.

 

Not if there's a PED suspension it won't. If he doesn't get a lifetime ban, then there will be some haggling/buyout. If he's suspended he's not getting paid.

 

He's not going to let $90m disappear without a fight. They are negotiating an endpoint.

[captain_kickass]

The lifetime ban is kind of like when the NCAA came to the table with Penn State and started out with the death penalty and then negotiated down.

 

I don't think baseball expects to be able to ban A-Rod for life. They're just starting their price high and then will be haggled down.

 

However, IF (and that's a big 'if') he is banned for life for PED usage, does that make him automatically ineligible for the HOF like Pete Rose?

[illiniguy]

Is ARod a repeat offender officially now?

I don't think so. The '03 test wasn't supposed to count against the players who volunteered for it. Wasn't that his only real link before this?

[captain_kickass]

Is ARod a repeat offender officially now?

I don't think so. The '03 test wasn't supposed to count against the players who volunteered for it. Wasn't that his only real link before this?

 

Yeah, under the terms of the agreement A-Rod can't be punished for that '03 test.

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

The lifetime ban is kind of like when the NCAA came to the table with Penn State and started out with the death penalty and then negotiated down.

 

I don't think baseball expects to be able to ban A-Rod for life. They're just starting their price high and then will be haggled down.

 

However, IF (and that's a big 'if') he is banned for life for PED usage, does that make him automatically ineligible for the HOF like Pete Rose?

 

Not sure, but it's not like he has a chance in hell of getting in anyway.

[captain_kickass]

The lifetime ban is kind of like when the NCAA came to the table with Penn State and started out with the death penalty and then negotiated down.

 

I don't think baseball expects to be able to ban A-Rod for life. They're just starting their price high and then will be haggled down.

 

However, IF (and that's a big 'if') he is banned for life for PED usage, does that make him automatically ineligible for the HOF like Pete Rose?

 

Not sure, but it's not like he has a chance in hell of getting in anyway.

 

Not in our lifetimes, but maybe decades down the road if public perception of PED's and their users in the past have changed.

[imb]

i feel like this whole thing is just so MLB can get the Yankees out from under ARod's contract.

[captain_kickass]

i feel like this whole thing is just so MLB can get the Yankees out from under ARod's contract.

 

I have an inkling you might be right. That may not be their primary motivation, but it's definitely one of the deciding factors.

 

Also, reports are that A-Rod is going to dig in his heels and not accept any sort of plea deal, and will appeal any suspension.

 

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2013/07/23/alex-rodriguez-biogenesis-mlb-negotiations-suspension/2579977/

 

The standoff begins.

[SouthSideRyan]

Yeah, let's have a baseball hall of fame without Barry Bonds and Alex Rodriguez