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Posted
19 minutes ago, Derwood said:

We signed the Vanilla Gorilla. Print your Super Bowl tickets now

Not only that but he traded up for that Georgia Tech tackle, Van something. I think we owe Ryan Poles an apology after bashing him for neglecting the trenches. 

Posted
3 hours ago, Derwood said:

We signed the Vanilla Gorilla. Print your Super Bowl tickets now

Like what I read about him, some mocks had him going on day 3, got PFF pass and run blocking grades in the 70's. 

Posted

I think the Bears ended up with a solid draft, but took a questionable route to get there. 

Thieneman- full disclosure, I had McNeil-Warren as the better safety, by just a tad. That being said, I am willing to go against my gut and go with the consensus best player on the board at the position of biggest need. Obviously, he's a day 1 starter at safety, so no issues with the pick. Interesting though, Bears could have gone elsewhere here and still had EMW, who went 58. There just wasn't anyone better than Thieneman on the board IMO.

Logan Jones- again, I didn't have him as my top C, but clearly the Bears did. Of course, my C1 didn't go til the 5th round (Hecht). I'm willing to get on board with this move. Jones was my C2, so they got consensus top 2 players (by most accounts) at S and C. The next C went off the board at 63, so there may not have been the ability to take him at 69 after the trade down. My only concern is you could have traded down from 57, taken Jones and 60 and maybe gotten a bit more in that trade down? 

Roush- I know a lot hate this pick, but in hindsight, I get it. TEs were coming off the board like crazy. 5 TEs went off the board before him, 4 of those within a 15 pick span where the Bears had the two 2nds. So, if the Bears truly identified Roush as their guy, and felt they HAD to have him, then this was the right place to pick him. Three more TEs went before the Bears next pick, and he undoubtedly would have been gone by 124 or wherever they picked.

Thomas- It was obvious to me the Bears were going to take a really fast WR in this draft. Like TE, WRs came flying off the board at a record pace as well (most pass catchers in top 100 ever). But it's perfectly fair to question the pick and player. The pick, obviously front 4 was a huge need. And this was a real sweet spot for many of the DTs I liked personally. But the Bears didn't apparently. The player, I think if you wanted speedy, gadgety guy, there were guys like Brenan Thompson and Skyler Bell who were either just as fast (Thompson) or plenty fast enough (Bell) who are better at actual WR things. And then there were speedy outside guys like Bryce Lance or Colby Young who can fly and were better players too. 

Muhammad- no problem with this pick or player. CB getting some 2nd round steam in the last week or so. Got him in the 4th, CB is a depth and long-term need for sure. No issues here. You basically lost your chance to add any real DL help by this point anyway so take the best player out there, which Muhammad had a legit argument to be that.

Elliott- again, the DL left wasn't going to move the needle any. Got him in the late 5th and was projected to go in the 4th or so. Depth LB. Only issue is that you just drafted a depth LB in the mid rounds last year with Ruben Hyppollite. 

Van den berg- I actually love this dude. He is very raw as a player, but he has elite athleticism with a 10 RAS and elite strength (35 reps of 225, dad was Mr Olympia South Africa). That strength just has to be more football functional. Definitely a late pick I can see making the team and outplaying his draft status. Good pick.

 

  • Like 4
Community Moderator
Posted

In general, they hit all the positions I thought they would, except Edge. The big issue is the overall big picture. Like you can't just keep saying "we didn't like any of the DL in this class" or "we didn't have any guys we liked fall to us". Well, Poles has shown the willingness to trade up. He traded up for Tyrique Stevenson and this year for Muhammad and Vanderberg. So he definitely has the ability to identify a guy he wants and go get him. I just don't know why he doesn't "go get him" when that guy is in the trenches constantly. 

Poles has got to show more foresight. If there's even a remote chance you don't come out of Day 2 with DL help, then you HAVE to do more in free agency or on the trade front. I understand people gave up astronomical amounts for Crosby and then Dexter Lawrence, but the lack of a plan B/C is hurting Poles, IMO.

And I understand that Dayo/Grady took away a lot of ability to really make a big splash there in free agency, but then you gotta do more to identify and get your guy in the draft. And I will appreciate the fact that the focus early in the draft has been getting and supporting your QB. But you've had a clear weakness since 2022 when Brisker led the team with 4 sacks. Poles has made the effort, but with Sweat, Dayo, Grady, Dexter, Pickens, Ngakoue, Darrell Taylor, whatever, but it's clearly still not good enough. You can't keep missing opportunities to make it good enough. Whether it's more draft capital, better scouting, more aggressive trading, or more wise free agent spending, there's not much of an excuse to have this DL (on paper) at this point in his regime.
 

 

Posted

He’s made it pretty clear he just doesn’t value pass rush as much as coverage. Words and action support that idea. Maybe the former is a cover for the latter but he doesn’t see value at the pass rush positions. 
 

he’ll draft for special teams guys before D end. 

  • Like 3
Old-Timey Member
Posted
21 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

He’s made it pretty clear he just doesn’t value pass rush as much as coverage. Words and action support that idea. Maybe the former is a cover for the latter but he doesn’t see value at the pass rush positions. 
 

he’ll draft for special teams guys before D end. 

I agree.  But what about stopping the run then? He’s not doing a good job there either.  He can maybe stake a claim to valuing coverage over pass rush but not if his players also suck stopping the run.

Posted

I think from 30,000 feet it’s nice that they have safety and center likely taken care of for a bit. Kmet’s replacement is here a year early and the corner depth is fine. But the route they took to get there while ignoring more important positions (again) leaves a lot to be desired 
 

the two special team reaches at wr/lb are way too much like guys who’ve been brought in for similar purposes in recent years. How many non pass rushing LBs can you possibly acquire when LBs barely affect the game? 
the Afrikaners DT is a fun story but ultimately probably not much different from the Dominique Robinson “raw athlete” story. 

Posted
17 hours ago, Soul said:

I agree.  But what about stopping the run then? He’s not doing a good job there either.  He can maybe stake a claim to valuing coverage over pass rush but not if his players also suck stopping the run.

This, it's the primary reason they were terrible on defense, couldn't get off the field enough.  Stop the run, sacks and QB pressures will come.

Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Wilson A2000 said:

Cam Jordan, Joey Bossa, Hasaan Reddick, Calais Campbell, Von Miller still available. Any interest there?

They're all cooked, it's why they're still available.  That said, maybe, take a chance on the least cooked or youngest?  Bosa or Reddick?

Edited by gflore34
Posted
1 hour ago, gflore34 said:

They're all cooked, it's why they're still available.  That said, maybe, take a chance on the least cooked or youngest?  Bosa or Reddick?

Cam Jordan had 10.5 sacks last year, he can't be too cooked.

  • Like 1
Posted
9 minutes ago, Tryptamine said:

Cam Jordan had 10.5 sacks last year, he can't be too cooked.

He'll also be 37 in July, still, maybe there's something left in the tank, can't hurt.

Old-Timey Member
Posted

The only real optimism I have is that last season when DA got all his DBs back and healthy, the defense became an entirely different thing.  Maybe his scheme just isn't as dependent on a big pass rush as many others are and that's why they went this route.  I'm no expert but I agree with the sentiment of most here that this was disappointing because it didn't address what nearly everyone considered to be the biggest needs in a meaningful way.

  • Like 1
Old-Timey Member
Posted (edited)

Two thoughts here: either the Bears are extremely smart and are forward thinking and the rest of the league will play copycat in the future, or they are just trying to be the smartest guys in the room and it doesn't work out. 

1) Last year some were confused with the Bears selecting Loveland when they had Kmet. Well, they went a lot of 12 and it worked out extremely well. This year let's grab another skilled TE and and play a ton of 12 and 13 with 3 great blockers and athletes that can hurt you vertically.

2) Screw pass rushers we are going to cover really well on the backend with speed and good cover guys. Like someone said above, when the Bears DB's got healthy the defense ascended. This plays into the Poles line about now "QB can hold the ball a little longer". This seems risky but let's see it play out. I still think they grab a veteran DE before the season. I also think Booker is going to have a massive year. 

 

 

Edited by bjam12
Posted

To me, this is a solid defensive draft for a team focused on building an elite secondary while adding a few bodies to the front seven, which seems to be the Bears' MO under Poles.

It's not to say I agree with that philosophy, but I can reasonably foresee a world in which this draft gets an A grade five years from now.

Posted
1 hour ago, bjam12 said:

Two thoughts here: either the Bears are extremely smart and are forward thinking and the rest of the league will play copycat in the future, or they are just trying to be the smartest guys in the room and it doesn't work out. 

1) Last year some were confused with the Bears selecting Loveland when they had Kmet. Well, they went a lot of 12 and it worked out extremely well. This year let's grab another skilled TE and and play a ton of 12 and 13 with 3 great blockers and athletes that can hurt you vertically.

2) Screw pass rushers we are going to cover really well on the backend with speed and good cover guys. Like someone said above, when the Bears DB's got healthy the defense ascended. This plays into the Poles line about now "QB can hold the ball a little longer". This seems risky but let's see it play out. I still think they grab a veteran DE before the season. I also think Booker is going to have a massive year. 

 

 

For me, the Loveland pick was more about me liking the other top TE who I can't remember his name. I cant remember his name because I was massively wrong and Loveland is HIM and has made me forget the other guy entirely

if the secondary is healthy, great. If not, oh boy.

I do think Booker will be a 8 sack guy this year if hes playing more all season and stays healthy, and thats not bad, but Sweat better be double digits and Dexter needs to repeat his last years production at least. I'm higher on Dexter then most, hes still a kid really and producing fairly well. Its his gaffs that make him look silly like his inability to cover a fumble. I've seen him botch at least 2 recoveries, but thats something that they work him out of with more experience I hope, 

 

 

 

 

Old-Timey Member
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, minnesotacubsfan said:

For me, the Loveland pick was more about me liking the other top TE who I can't remember his name. I cant remember his name because I was massively wrong and Loveland is HIM and has made me forget the other guy entirely

if the secondary is healthy, great. If not, oh boy.

I do think Booker will be a 8 sack guy this year if hes playing more all season and stays healthy, and thats not bad, but Sweat better be double digits and Dexter needs to repeat his last years production at least. I'm higher on Dexter then most, hes still a kid really and producing fairly well. Its his gaffs that make him look silly like his inability to cover a fumble. I've seen him botch at least 2 recoveries, but thats something that they work him out of with more experience I hope, 

 

 

 

 

Tyler Warren.  I believe a few of us, most especially UMFan, thought Loveland was, at least, as good, if not better than Warren.

Edited by gflore34
Old-Timey Member
Posted (edited)

Tyler Warren was every bit as good as Loveland last year. Either would have been a home run pick

Loveland: 58 REC, 713 YDS, 6TD

Warren: 76 REC, 817 YDS, 4 TD

Edited by Derwood
Community Moderator
Posted
1 hour ago, bjam12 said:

Two thoughts here: either the Bears are extremely smart and are forward thinking and the rest of the league will play copycat in the future, or they are just trying to be the smartest guys in the room and it doesn't work out. 

1) Last year some were confused with the Bears selecting Loveland when they had Kmet. Well, they went a lot of 12 and it worked out extremely well. This year let's grab another skilled TE and and play a ton of 12 and 13 with 3 great blockers and athletes that can hurt you vertically.

2) Screw pass rushers we are going to cover really well on the backend with speed and good cover guys. Like someone said above, when the Bears DB's got healthy the defense ascended. This plays into the Poles line about now "QB can hold the ball a little longer". This seems risky but let's see it play out. I still think they grab a veteran DE before the season. I also think Booker is going to have a massive year. 

 

 

There were 8 TEs drafted in a 40 picks with the Bears' Roush pick right in the middle of that run. The Rams actually ran the most 12/13 personnel in the league.  And McVay is in that Shanahan tree. So is about 1/3 of the playcallers in the league. So that's why you saw a bunch of TEs this year. 

And the TE position has typically been a position where you don't get great production right away. But with guys like Loveland, Warren and Bowers early production; teams are naturally valuing the position higher. While they may not get that level of players, they aren't going to stop chasing that. 

  • Like 1
Posted
7 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Tyler Warren.  I believe a few of us, most especially UMFan, thought Loveland was, at least, as good, if not better than Warren.

 

3 minutes ago, Derwood said:

Tyler Warren was every bit as good as Loveland last year. Either would have been a home run pick

Loveland: 58 REC, 713 YDS, 6TD

Warren: 76 REC, 817 YDS, 4 TD

who?

 

oh look LOVELAND STATS

 

Community Moderator
Posted
3 minutes ago, Derwood said:

Tyler Warren was every bit as good as Loveland last year. Either would have been a home run pick

Loveland: 58 REC, 713 YDS, 6TD

Warren: 76 REC, 817 YDS, 4 TD

In counting stats, sure. But Loveland was much more efficient, more explosive, and a much better blocker by all metrics. 

  • Like 2

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