If Everett is Non-Tendered...

[Derwood]

Everett is awful.

 

no, he's not. i like how people will make blanket statements like this about bad offensive players without considering the fact that they're great defensively and save their teams dozens of runs a year in the field. you don't see anyone saying "ryan braun is awful" because he is atrocious defensively.

 

because we live in an offensive era and people expect offensive production from every position. modern baseball fans are conditioned to think this way. it isn't the 80's anymore. not saying it's right, just explaining why people think he sucks

[snoodmonger]

I'd be open to Everett, especially over Theriot. I still haven't totally given up on Cedeno, but I may be the only one.

 

What kind of fight over Everett's services could one expect?

[TruffleShuffle]

Everett is awful.

 

no, he's not. i like how people will make blanket statements like this about bad offensive players without considering the fact that they're great defensively and save their teams dozens of runs a year in the field. you don't see anyone saying "ryan braun is awful" because he is atrocious defensively.

 

because we live in an offensive era and people expect offensive production from every position. modern baseball fans are conditioned to think this way. it isn't the 80's anymore. not saying it's right, just explaining why people think he sucks

 

ideally every player in the lineup should provide good offensive production. but if they don't, you can't just say that the player is horrible without considering his other skills. it's things like this that explain why so many people think ozzie smith has no business being in the hall of fame.

[Wheelimus]

Adam Everett signed and just given the starting job? No thanks.

 

Adam Everett signed and put into competition for it with Cedeno (if he's still around) and Theroit? Sure.

 

I'm not worried one way or another. Lou showed last year he can recognize an obvious upgrade at a position (Theriot over Cesar). Cedeno might not even be on the team. Last year could have very well been Theriot's peak and maybe he doesn't have that one great month next year. If the offense is a wash, it's an easy decision.

 

Frankly, bringing in Fukedome and his likely .380+ OBP makes going pure defense at SS a lot easier pill to swallow. It's not going to make a big difference if it's Theriot or Everett in the 8 hole. And if it's still Mark DeRosa at 2B, maybe a defensive whiz at SS makes his life easier. And that might make his bat even better.

 

Of course, if we're talking DeRosa as a bench player I think his bat overwhelms Everett's defense. Especially if you have Everett on the bench for late inning defense.

[mdwilla]

ESPN just metioned he was non tendered.

[USSoccer]

I'd take him for a reasonable price.

[nilodnayr]

Adam Everett signed and just given the starting job? No thanks.

 

Adam Everett signed and put into competition for it with Cedeno (if he's still around) and Theroit? Sure.

 

I'm not worried one way or another. Lou showed last year he can recognize an obvious upgrade at a position (Theriot over Cesar). Cedeno might not even be on the team. Last year could have very well been Theriot's peak and maybe he doesn't have that one great month next year. If the offense is a wash, it's an easy decision.

 

Frankly, bringing in Fukedome and his likely .380+ OBP makes going pure defense at SS a lot easier pill to swallow. It's not going to make a big difference if it's Theriot or Everett in the 8 hole. And if it's still Mark DeRosa at 2B, maybe a defensive whiz at SS makes his life easier. And that might make his bat even better.

 

Of course, if we're talking DeRosa as a bench player I think his bat overwhelms Everett's defense. Especially if you have Everett on the bench for late inning defense.

 

By "competition" you mean see what happens in 50 ABs in spring training when they are rusty playing against rusty pitching and rusty fielding? We know exactly what Theriot and what Everett can do. Theres no need for a "competition". Cedeno obviously is a different story.

[Post Count Padder]

Astros non-tendered shortstop Adam Everett.

 

The Cardinals should be regretting signing Cesar Izturis right about now. Everett, the best defensive shortstop in baseball, could fit with the Orioles, Twins or Nationals.

:lol:

[Illini Iceman]

Astros non-tendered shortstop Adam Everett.

 

The Cardinals should be regretting signing Cesar Izturis right about now. Everett, the best defensive shortstop in baseball, could fit with the Orioles, Twins or Nationals.

:lol:

 

If the Orioles wanted him why wouldn't they just have had the Astros include him in the Tejada deal?

[BigbadB]

Astros non-tendered shortstop Adam Everett.

 

The Cardinals should be regretting signing Cesar Izturis right about now. Everett, the best defensive shortstop in baseball, could fit with the Orioles, Twins or Nationals.

:lol:

 

If the Orioles wanted him why wouldn't they just have had the Astros include him in the Tejada deal?

 

Because the brilliant GM in Houston didn't want to include him in that deal. \:D/

[hawkeyecub]

This is honestly the most worth I've seen given to defense in my time on these boards and I don't mean that as a knock. Usually most discussions like this are met with the sarcastic "driving in runs with your glove" type remarks or people refuse to believe that a truly elite defender (at a spot like SS) can have value even if they OPS under .650.

 

Not that I'm necessarily advocating bringing in Everett, it's just nice to see people recognize that he has some value even with a putrid bat. As Ping said, we would have one hell of a defense if we added him and kept our outfield the way it stands.

[Post Count Padder]

Astros non-tendered shortstop Adam Everett.

 

The Cardinals should be regretting signing Cesar Izturis right about now. Everett, the best defensive shortstop in baseball, could fit with the Orioles, Twins or Nationals.

:lol:

 

If the Orioles wanted him why wouldn't they just have had the Astros include him in the Tejada deal?

They were being nice because they thought they were taking too much from the Astros?

[treebird]

This is honestly the most worth I've seen given to defense in my time on these boards and I don't mean that as a knock. Usually most discussions like this are met with the sarcastic "driving in runs with your glove" type remarks or people refuse to believe that a truly elite defender (at a spot like SS) can have value even if they OPS under .650.

 

Not that I'm necessarily advocating bringing in Everett, it's just nice to see people recognize that he has some value even with a putrid bat. As Ping said, we would have one hell of a defense if we added him and kept our outfield the way it stands.

 

everett is an awfully special defensive player.

 

and theriot sucks real bad.

[rocket]

This is honestly the most worth I've seen given to defense in my time on these boards and I don't mean that as a knock. Usually most discussions like this are met with the sarcastic "driving in runs with your glove" type remarks or people refuse to believe that a truly elite defender (at a spot like SS) can have value even if they OPS under .650.

 

Not that I'm necessarily advocating bringing in Everett, it's just nice to see people recognize that he has some value even with a putrid bat. As Ping said, we would have one hell of a defense if we added him and kept our outfield the way it stands.

 

the more scientific the data is when it comes to defensive metrics, the more the sabremetric community will embrace it.

[Rob]

This is honestly the most worth I've seen given to defense in my time on these boards and I don't mean that as a knock. Usually most discussions like this are met with the sarcastic "driving in runs with your glove" type remarks or people refuse to believe that a truly elite defender (at a spot like SS) can have value even if they OPS under .650.

 

Not that I'm necessarily advocating bringing in Everett, it's just nice to see people recognize that he has some value even with a putrid bat. As Ping said, we would have one hell of a defense if we added him and kept our outfield the way it stands.

 

To be fair, Everett might be the single player in the game with a glove good enough to cover up for his offense... at least among people with truly putrid bats.

[SouthSideRyan]

I think most of you know by now what a Cedeno fanboy I am, but I fully endorse bringing in Everett as our starting SS.

[MPrior]

If he's actually as good as those metrics say he is, I'd bring him in - I'd still cringe every time he came up to bat, though, but it'd be an upgrade over Theriot, who isn't good offensively OR defensively. I'd probably explore trading Pie or someone for a good SS first, though - I'm all about targeting Greene, as has been mentioned.

[questionmarkgrace]

not sure who you were watching but theriot was pretty darn good defensively this year.

 

As for Everett no way he takes a competition offer when he can get a starting gig with the twins, O's, blue jays, among others.

[Rob]

not sure who you were watching but theriot was pretty darn good defensively this year.

 

As for Everett no way he takes a competition offer when he can get a starting gig with the twins, O's, blue jays, among others.

 

Theriot looked good defensively when he got his hands on the ball. But because his arm is so weak, he was playing in a few steps, which comprimised his range considerably.

 

All in all, he was below average with the glove, simply because he could never get to the ball.

 

Everett shouldn't have to compete, he'd be hands-down a much better option than Theriot.

[NCCubFan]

not sure who you were watching but theriot was pretty darn good defensively this year.

 

As for Everett no way he takes a competition offer when he can get a starting gig with the twins, O's, blue jays, among others.

 

Theriot looked good defensively when he got his hands on the ball. But because his arm is so weak, he was playing in a few steps, which comprimised his range considerably.

 

All in all, he was below average with the glove, simply because he could never get to the ball.

 

Everett shouldn't have to compete, he'd be hands-down a much better option than Theriot.

Yes, he should have to compete. If he is much better than Theriot (and I think he is) it would be evident from the competition.

[Rob]

not sure who you were watching but theriot was pretty darn good defensively this year.

 

As for Everett no way he takes a competition offer when he can get a starting gig with the twins, O's, blue jays, among others.

 

Theriot looked good defensively when he got his hands on the ball. But because his arm is so weak, he was playing in a few steps, which comprimised his range considerably.

 

All in all, he was below average with the glove, simply because he could never get to the ball.

 

Everett shouldn't have to compete, he'd be hands-down a much better option than Theriot.

Yes, he should have to compete. If he is much better than Theriot (and I think he is) it would be evident from the competition.

 

Would it?

 

I'm not comfortable choosing a starting player based off a few spring training games. Obviously, if Everett lost a bunch of range and it showed from April through May, we can consider going in another direction... but Theriot isn't close enough right now to warrant leaving it up to chance.

[haltz]

He's not close in the slightest and this sort of thing where the answer is patently obvious just gives an observer a chance to make a mistake. If Everett is hurt or something that is an entirely different matter and doesn't have anything to do with a competition.

 

Theriot has a career 69 OPS+ and Theriot posted a 72 last year. That's a handful of runs a year. Or to put it another way, Theriot was -22 by BRef's lwts last year in 597 PA and Everett is -26 per 600 PA for his career. The difference is that Everett posts gaudy UZRs like a +48 in 2006.

[hawkeyecub]

This is honestly the most worth I've seen given to defense in my time on these boards and I don't mean that as a knock. Usually most discussions like this are met with the sarcastic "driving in runs with your glove" type remarks or people refuse to believe that a truly elite defender (at a spot like SS) can have value even if they OPS under .650.

 

Not that I'm necessarily advocating bringing in Everett, it's just nice to see people recognize that he has some value even with a putrid bat. As Ping said, we would have one hell of a defense if we added him and kept our outfield the way it stands.

 

the more scientific the data is when it comes to defensive metrics, the more the sabremetric community will embrace it.

 

I await that. I wish I had a better idea of what defensive stats to turn to for quick analysis and comparison.

 

Also, I don't think I really said what I wanted to say in that last post. It's not that I'm really advocating all-glove, no-bat players in our lineup. I do like to see discussion and comparison of the total player rather than just always taking the better offensive player and assuming defense doesn't matter that much. In the majority of cases you obviously should go with the offense. But that .050-.080 point difference in OPS can be made up for if you truly have a difference maker in the field.

[Bote McBoteface]

Looking at his stats, he reminds me a lot o Alex S. Gonzalez. I'm all for having a great defense, especially at SS, but man...that's really bad. With Soto, Pie, and Fukudome all possibly struggling early on, plus the pitcher's spot, I don't know if we can afford another hole in our lineup. I'd prefer to get Roberts and shift Derosa to SS, though that seems to have not crossed management's minds.

[badnews]

Most years Everett isn't as good defensively as he was in 2006. From 2003-2005 he was worth no more as a player basically than Theriot was in 2007.