Lou Piniella the New Cubs Manager

[Rob]

Levine just said payroll will probably jump to 115mil. Says Cubs would like to have Soriano for CF. Zito and Schmidt are possibilities. Says Piniella demands his players and coaches to take responsibility, unlike Dusty. Said if a catcher calls a bad sequence of pitches he will talk to the catcher(or the pitching coach, whoever is calling pitches) right after it happens to find out why it happened.

I like every word of that, especially the part about Soriano in CF.

 

Prepare to be bombarded by the "Soriano is overrated and sucks" faction. Last year the guy was a bum who didn't get on enough and was going to stink now that he's not in a hitters park and low and behold...40/40.

 

Seriously, what is your problem with posters on this board?

 

Soriano is overrated. But he's still good. Most everybody on this board would be happy with him being here next year, especially when you consider the limited options. And, if he's in CF, all the better.

 

If I recall correctly you were one of the guys saying Soriano sucks last year. A year ago people were saying you can't trade (name a worthless pitching prospect who we've waited for to pan out and still hasn't) for established players who's OBP is below .375 and people were lambasted at the suggestion. And for the record you're usually the only poster I tend to disagree because of your "I'm always right" attitude.

 

So because Soriano exceeded everybody's wildest expectations and the pitchers on our staff didn't come close to their talent, suddenly we were all stupid?

 

If you tell me that before the season you honestly believed Soriano would do anything near what he has done this year, I would be forced to call you a liar.

 

There was nothing in his track record to suggest he'd go from being merely a good or very good player to being a great one... and there's nothing to suggest he's established a new baseline level of performance for himself at the age of 30.

 

(BTW, he got caught stealing 17 times stealing, so his 41 steals mean jack squat. I'll give him credit for hitting the ball well enough to get 46 HR, but he wasn't stealing well enough to get 41 steals... he was simply attempting to steal often enough)

 

I'm not saying anyone is stupid. My point last year was that he's a proven run-producer and difference maker and people (many people) had the nerve to say he wasn't because of ball park factor. I was also told that his because he was in an inferior lineup he wasn't going to hit as well or score as many runs. oops.

 

A proven run-producer and difference maker?

 

Soriano's 2005 is pretty much the same as Murton's 2006, in terms of actual run producing (minus defensive woes). And Murton's 2006 is better than Soriano's 2004.

 

Are you saying that Murton, in his current state, is a true difference maker? The kind of guy that it's smart to trade a good chunk of the farm away for? Cause that's why so many of us were against it last offseason. Soriano simply hadn't shown he was still worth it (until this late career year)

[goonys evil twin]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

[USSoccer]

I think what people said about Soriano was that he wasn't worth the player cost plus salary at his Texas production levels. Given that he's a FA and can play 2 positions of need for us, he's a better investment now than he was in 2005.

 

I doubt he'll match his 2006 numbers at any point during his next contract, and his OBP isn't very good, but many posters here would take his SLG% at 2B or CF next season.

[Omar]

Back to Lou Piniella.. I think it's a good signing. He was my #2 guy behind Girardi. I still think Cubs are idiots for not getting Girardi.. but why does my opinion matter?

 

At least the hitting coach isnt coming back...

[cjbucks]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

I thought I had heard more than that for Juan but I could be wrong. Given those $'s who would you prefer in cf?

[b_wiggy_66]

Well I better change my avatar, the good thing about this is that this means they are ready to spend, now.

[Bull]

Is there a move to transactions coming?

[Omar]

Why do people think Girardi = rebuilding? Why cant we win with Girardi? Edited October 16, 2006 by Omar

[Rob]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

[baseball7897]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

 

He's right here. Remember? :lol:

[Rob]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

 

He's right here. Remember? :lol:

 

Awww, you're sweet. But your disturbing avatar says otherwise now...

[Bull]

Why do people thing Girardi = rebuilding? Why cant we win with Girardi?

 

Not so much that Girardi = rebuilding as Piniella does not = rebuilding. He wouldn't come to a team that had not promised to win NOW.

[Omar]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

 

He's right here. Remember? :lol:

 

Awww, you're sweet. But your disturbing avatar says otherwise now...

 

What's exactly happening? Was there some bet?

[goonys evil twin]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

I thought I had heard more than that for Juan but I could be wrong. Given those $'s who would you prefer in cf?

 

Soriano, easy. Pierre's upside is quite low, and downside is very low. Soriano will at least likely be a well above average CFer for a few years, and could have a great season or two. Pierre only has 2 seasons where his OPS+ was better than Soriano's worst season. Soriano has a 29 point advantage in career OPS+, and the odds are quite favorable that he would be over 110 most of the time. He'd be fantastically overpaid if he's giving you 110 and making $15m per year, but it's nothing a savvy GM wouldn't be able to work around.

 

I'll always maintain it's better to have overpaid good players than overpaid bad ones.

[Omar]

I expected NSBB to go down.. and it still might.

 

http://s8.invisionfree.com/emergencynsbb/index.php

 

Emergency NSBB, for those who dont know.

[C.C.]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

Both aren't worth their contracts but I'd rather over spend for Soriano then Pierre.

[Mizzou]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

 

He's right here. Remember? :lol:

Do you have to have that big of a picture in your signature?

[cjbucks]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

I thought I had heard more than that for Juan but I could be wrong. Given those $'s who would you prefer in cf?

 

Soriano, easy. Pierre's upside is quite low, and downside is very low. Soriano will at least likely be a well above average CFer for a few years, and could have a great season or two. Pierre only has 2 seasons where his OPS+ was better than Soriano's worst season. Soriano has a 29 point advantage in career OPS+, and the odds are quite favorable that he would be over 110 most of the time. He'd be fantastically overpaid if he's giving you 110 and making $15m per year, but it's nothing a savvy GM wouldn't be able to work around.

 

I'll always maintain it's better to have overpaid good players than overpaid bad ones.

 

^^^ Very nice :lol: Somebody should mention that to Hendry. As a matter of fact that should be his mantra for this off season.

 

I agree with the rest also. I cannot convince myself on any level that I want any part of Pierre in cf again next year.

[baseball7897]

In related news, I kinda miss Dusty Baker now.

 

He's right here. Remember? :lol:

Do you have to have that big of a picture in your signature?

 

Yes, it's my guy Zito!!!!!

 

I will find another one.

[A New Era]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

Both aren't worth their contracts but I'd rather over spend for Soriano then Pierre.

 

Ain't that the truth!! Bring in Sweet Lou and bring in Soriano in CF!!

[craig]

The concept of Soriano in center is really intriguing. Offensively, it would do a lot. Would boost the CF OPS by 200-300 points. Would add an extra 40 HR's.

 

Guess what: HR's are a really efficient way to score rune! He also compares favorably to Pierre OBP-wise. Soriano was .355 this year with 67 walks, thats a lot. And his career IsoD is around 45. So I think he's safer to OBP >.325 than is true for Pierre.

 

Soriano also has a very strong arm. After Pierre, Murton, and Jones, none of whom could throw at all, putting Soriano in between Murton and Jones would force baserunners to at least pay attention before deciding they can freely take the extra base.

 

Soriano may be fast, but I don't think he was very good in left, based on friends who saw him play. Experience may help, and CF is perhaps the easiest. But if you signed him for center and he was poor there, you could have a really, really bad defensive outfield. So be it, those are the chances you gotta take!

 

I think Soriano in center might also work well with Pie coming along. If Pie continues to progress well, he could spend this year improving at Iowa; next year s a 4th outfielder, and 3 years from now Jones' contract will be up and Pie could replace him. Perhaps by taking center and Soriano moving to right. Or, perhaps in 2008 one could imagine Pie taking center, Soriano moving to right, and either Jones being traded or Jones being a 4th OF or semi-platoon with Murton.

 

One of the other factors with Soriano is where you'd hit him. He's mostly led off and he likes leading off. It would be kind of exciting to have a leadoff hitter with a .350-OBP and a .900-OPS leading off.

 

Given that Izturis/Theriot/Cedeno don't have much power, retaining Pierre in center would put us really at a power disadvantage. I think they kind of need to get some HR's either in center or at 2nd.

 

But if you got Soriano for center, and a Jones platoon for right, you could put together some pretty interesting lineups.

 

Soriano-Theriot-Lee-Aram-Murton-Barrett-Jones-Izturis-pitcher? Were Soriano to replicate (or come close) to his .367 OBP, you could have a very strong OBP-lineup 1-6. And you could have a lot of HR's 1, 3-7.

 

Makes too much sense to actually happen.

[C.C.]

I think Soriano is a much better option than Pierre in CF for probably not a whole lot more $ than what Pierre is going to go for. Having said that I would like to see him in the 5 hole as opposed to the 1 or 2 hole that he will probably end up hitting in.

 

I don't know, there's a pretty big difference between 3/24 and 5/75, and those are two of the more frequent deals I've heard for each guy.

 

Both aren't worth their contracts but I'd rather over spend for Soriano then Pierre.

 

Ain't that the truth!! Bring in Sweet Lou and bring in Soriano in CF!!

 

Sounds like a upgrade from Dusty and Pierre to me! :o

[Derwood]

I'll be honest. This hiring is neither here nor there for me. I won't lose sleep over it. I care WAY more about the upcoming free agency period than who sits in the dugout looking fat and old

[CuseCubFan69]

The concept of Soriano in center is really intriguing. Offensively, it would do a lot. Would boost the CF OPS by 200-300 points. Would add an extra 40 HR's.

 

Guess what: HR's are a really efficient way to score rune! He also compares favorably to Pierre OBP-wise. Soriano was .355 this year with 67 walks, thats a lot. And his career IsoD is around 45. So I think he's safer to OBP >.325 than is true for Pierre.

 

Soriano also has a very strong arm. After Pierre, Murton, and Jones, none of whom could throw at all, putting Soriano in between Murton and Jones would force baserunners to at least pay attention before deciding they can freely take the extra base.

 

Soriano may be fast, but I don't think he was very good in left, based on friends who saw him play. Experience may help, and CF is perhaps the easiest. But if you signed him for center and he was poor there, you could have a really, really bad defensive outfield. So be it, those are the chances you gotta take!

 

I think Soriano in center might also work well with Pie coming along. If Pie continues to progress well, he could spend this year improving at Iowa; next year s a 4th outfielder, and 3 years from now Jones' contract will be up and Pie could replace him. Perhaps by taking center and Soriano moving to right. Or, perhaps in 2008 one could imagine Pie taking center, Soriano moving to right, and either Jones being traded or Jones being a 4th OF or semi-platoon with Murton.

 

One of the other factors with Soriano is where you'd hit him. He's mostly led off and he likes leading off. It would be kind of exciting to have a leadoff hitter with a .350-OBP and a .900-OPS leading off.

 

Given that Izturis/Theriot/Cedeno don't have much power, retaining Pierre in center would put us really at a power disadvantage. I think they kind of need to get some HR's either in center or at 2nd.

 

But if you got Soriano for center, and a Jones platoon for right, you could put together some pretty interesting lineups.

 

Soriano-Theriot-Lee-Aram-Murton-Barrett-Jones-Izturis-pitcher? Were Soriano to replicate (or come close) to his .367 OBP, you could have a very strong OBP-lineup 1-6. And you could have a lot of HR's 1, 3-7.

 

Makes too much sense to actually happen.

 

You wouldn't bat Murton 1 or 2? I'd do:

 

Murton

Soriano

Lee

ARam

Jones/righty

Barrett

Izturis

Theriot/Fontenot

[baseball7897]

The concept of Soriano in center is really intriguing. Offensively, it would do a lot. Would boost the CF OPS by 200-300 points. Would add an extra 40 HR's.

 

Guess what: HR's are a really efficient way to score rune! He also compares favorably to Pierre OBP-wise. Soriano was .355 this year with 67 walks, thats a lot. And his career IsoD is around 45. So I think he's safer to OBP >.325 than is true for Pierre.

 

Soriano also has a very strong arm. After Pierre, Murton, and Jones, none of whom could throw at all, putting Soriano in between Murton and Jones would force baserunners to at least pay attention before deciding they can freely take the extra base.

 

Soriano may be fast, but I don't think he was very good in left, based on friends who saw him play. Experience may help, and CF is perhaps the easiest. But if you signed him for center and he was poor there, you could have a really, really bad defensive outfield. So be it, those are the chances you gotta take!

 

I think Soriano in center might also work well with Pie coming along. If Pie continues to progress well, he could spend this year improving at Iowa; next year s a 4th outfielder, and 3 years from now Jones' contract will be up and Pie could replace him. Perhaps by taking center and Soriano moving to right. Or, perhaps in 2008 one could imagine Pie taking center, Soriano moving to right, and either Jones being traded or Jones being a 4th OF or semi-platoon with Murton.

 

One of the other factors with Soriano is where you'd hit him. He's mostly led off and he likes leading off. It would be kind of exciting to have a leadoff hitter with a .350-OBP and a .900-OPS leading off.

 

Given that Izturis/Theriot/Cedeno don't have much power, retaining Pierre in center would put us really at a power disadvantage. I think they kind of need to get some HR's either in center or at 2nd.

 

But if you got Soriano for center, and a Jones platoon for right, you could put together some pretty interesting lineups.

 

Soriano-Theriot-Lee-Aram-Murton-Barrett-Jones-Izturis-pitcher? Were Soriano to replicate (or come close) to his .367 OBP, you could have a very strong OBP-lineup 1-6. And you could have a lot of HR's 1, 3-7.

 

Makes too much sense to actually happen.

 

You wouldn't bat Murton 1 or 2? I'd do:

 

Murton

Soriano

Lee

ARam

Jones/righty

Barrett

Izturis

Theriot/Fontenot

 

I would rather have Soriano leading off. Soriano is more of a threat to steal a base than Murton is. Murton would benefit being in the 2 spot, because he has the ability to hit the ball anywhere on the field, and he makes contract the majority of the time.