Cubs (Boyd) vs Padres (King): Wild Card Game 1, 9:00pm CST

[Outshined_One]

Regarding the lack of swing/miss in the rotation, if this pitching staff were fully healthy, it would have three guys in Steele, Horton, and Brown who'd fulfill that criteria.

Granted, that opens another can of worms regarding pitcher health and whether the Cubs' approach to pitching has had anything to do with their injuries.

[gflore34]

19 minutes ago, Outshined_One said:

Regarding the lack of swing/miss in the rotation, if this pitching staff were fully healthy, it would have three guys in Steele, Horton, and Brown who'd fulfill that criteria.

Granted, that opens another can of worms regarding pitcher health and whether the Cubs' approach to pitching has had anything to do with their injuries.

Cabrera as well, sounds as if many here are ready to give up on him, I not.  The stuff is there, I'd imagine his struggles are also a contributing factor to Hottovoy' imminent termination.  Going forward Brown and Cabrera are the two I'd look to, don't have much faith Horton or Steele will ever throw another competitive pitch for the Cubs.

Edited 16 hours ago by gflore34

[gflore34]

As the game was progressing, except for being no-hit for 7 innings, I was resigned to the loss.  Honestly, it's probably much better to take the suspense out earlier than have to sit through the kick in the balls that was Phillies-Braves.  That was exactly akin to the Cubs bullpen blowing a late lead to Brewers, occurring in the post season makes it even more painful.

Edited 16 hours ago by gflore34

[chibears55]

38 minutes ago, UMFan83 said:

No but if part of an entire overhaul of pitching infrastructure, I would assume a new pitching coach would have some input on personnel decisions to put together a certain type of staff

 I think Hoyer prefers these type of pitchers and philosophy, and would just hire someone who shares the same thoughts. So, im not sure it matters too much who the pitching coach is because Hoyer will still look for the same type of pitchers.

I think the only shot at any change would be if Hoyer allows Counsell to choose his new coach and the two of them have more of an input on who and type of pitchers theyd like Hoyer to pursue and have at least a balance in philosophies on the pitching staff like he had in Milwaukee 

 

[gflore34]

For the pitching scientists, while King was very good, it did appear he hung a number of breaking balls the Cubs simply missed on.  Is this true?  Maybe, unlike Boyd, he did hang a number of pitches but, the weren't over the middle.

Edited 16 hours ago by gflore34

[s2obed]

34 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Cabrera as well, sounds as if many here are ready to give up on him, I not.  The stuff is there, I'd imagine his struggles are also a contributing factor to Hottovoy' imminent termination.  Going forward Brown and Cabrera are the two I'd look to, don't have much faith Horton or Steele will ever throw another competitive pitch for the Cubs.

so you're not ready to give up on Cabrera but you are giving up on Horton and Steele? That's an absurd take. 

Edited 16 hours ago by s2obed

[UMFan83]

19 minutes ago, chibears55 said:

 I think Hoyer prefers these type of pitchers and philosophy, and would just hire someone who shares the same thoughts. So, im not sure it matters too much who the pitching coach is because Hoyer will still look for the same type of pitchers.

I think the only shot at any change would be if Hoyer allows Counsell to choose his new coach and the two of them have more of an input on who and type of pitchers theyd like Hoyer to pursue and have at least a balance in philosophies on the pitching staff like he had in Milwaukee 

 

He needs to show he can adjust and adapt.  Pitching has been our weak spot and cause of ultimate demise for the 2 Cubs playoff teams he oversaw (assuming the Cubs don't win the WS this year) plus the 2023 team that finished 1 game shy of the playoffs after a pitching fueled late season collapse.  If he can't adapt, then that's a different discussion.

[gflore34]

1 minute ago, s2obed said:

so you're not ready to give up on Cabrera but you are giving up on Horton and Steele? That's an absurd take. 

When you consider Horton' extensive injury history coupled with this being his second Tommy John it's not that far of a reach.  Steele coming of a second Tommy John, experienced some set backs with noticeable drop in velocity?  Don't think that much of a reach.

[Andy]

2 hours ago, UMFan83 said:

They say that how you are playing at the end of the season doesn't typically carry over into the playoffs, but it sure looked like the same Cubs offense of the last week.  The pitching was different, but unfortunately that means it was worse since it was holding down the fort the last week or so.

There's ample contrary evidence for other teams, but every time the Cubs limp into the playoffs offensively, they keep limping.

[mul21]

26 minutes ago, s2obed said:

so you're not ready to give up on Cabrera but you are giving up on Horton and Steele? That's an absurd take. 

Considering Cabrera is the only one of the 3 without 2 elbow surgeries under his belt, it's not even a remotely controversial take.  We have no idea how Horton will recover and we don't know if the Cubs will even tender Steele a contract after the season, so his line of thinking isn't unreasonable at all.

[Andy]

28 minutes ago, s2obed said:

so you're not ready to give up on Cabrera but you are giving up on Horton and Steele? That's an absurd take. 

Horton and Steele may not ever actually be healthy enough to pitch for the Cubs, that's a different area of concern than whether Cabrera will be good enough for us to want him to pitch for the Cubs.

[Irrelevant Dude]

27 minutes ago, s2obed said:

so you're not ready to give up on Cabrera but you are giving up on Horton and Steele? That's an absurd take. 

And what gives you any confidence whatsoever in Ben Brown?  At least with Horton and Steele, they had injuries that were diagnosed and repaired.  With Brown, nobody really seems to know what the cause is.  Unless there is some breakthrough, I fully expect we're going to continue to see recurrences of the same or similar injuries.

[s2obed]

34 minutes ago, Irrelevant Dude said:

And what gives you any confidence whatsoever in Ben Brown?  At least with Horton and Steele, they had injuries that were diagnosed and repaired.  With Brown, nobody really seems to know what the cause is.  Unless there is some breakthrough, I fully expect we're going to continue to see recurrences of the same or similar injuries.

I never mentioned Brown so now sure why you bring him up... at any rate, personally I'm more confident in Horton/Steele contributing positively going forward than Cabrera. Plenty of pitchers have come back from a 2nd TJS. 

Jed needs to construct a better 2027 starting staff and acquire a true ace - anything from Horton/Steele should be considered a bonus, I'm guessing we all agree on that.

Edited 15 hours ago by s2obed

[Wilson A2000]

 

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

If Gausman wasn't healthy enough to go yesterday it's hard to believe he'll be effective today. Good luck, boys

[Irrelevant Dude]

11 minutes ago, s2obed said:

I never mentioned Brown so now sure why you bring him up

Sorry, that wasn't directed at you, I think it was the original post you were replying to.

[gflore34]

9 minutes ago, Irrelevant Dude said:

Sorry, that wasn't directed at you, I think it was the original post you were replying to.

I've little more faith in Brown as a possibility because he's not coming back from multiple elbow surgeries. However, as you pointed out, no seems to jack sh*t about how to deal with his injury.

[chibears55]

28 minutes ago, Wilson A2000 said:

 

Lol, so 1 extra day and hes fine???

Probably looking at 4 innings from Gausman and then a line of bullpen guys starting with Civale. 

More the reason despite the trust issue, why they should of just went with Imanaga tonight. 

 

[We Got The Whole 9]

The Bregman and Gausman injuries were just a whole bag of salt dumped onto a festering wound. This season set a whole new bar with injuries. 

 

And that was a great play he made that he was hurt on too. Some horsefeathers.

[mk49]

1 hour ago, chibears55 said:

Lol, so 1 extra day and hes fine???

Probably looking at 4 innings from Gausman and then a line of bullpen guys starting with Civale. 

More the reason despite the trust issue, why they should of just went with Imanaga tonight. 

 

Because he pitched on Sunday, though it was only 12 pitches?  I wanted Peterson for tonight.  Then, Shota tomorrow.

Just checked the Boyd's stats from last night.  GB% is 9.1% and HR/FB was 42.9%.  Ouch.

[UMFan83]

This feels like last year when our pitching staff was coming into the playoffs on fumes.  My expectations tonight are low

[chibears55]

Hoyer gets 5 pitchers in July to bolster up the pitching staff and only 1 will make a postseason appearance with a bum shoulder 🙄🙄🙄

[gflore34]

Here's what I didn't get Boyd said he didn't have the feel for his change up last night.  After giving up 2 HR's on that pitch why continue to throw it?

[javy knows my name]

2 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Here's what I didn't get Boyd said he didn't have the feel for his change up last night.  After giving up 2 HR's on that pitch why continue to throw it?

Because he nothing else to get righties out with

[gflore34]

4 minutes ago, javy knows my name said:

Because he nothing else to get righties out with

Nevertheless, you've got to try something else do you?  All he could do was hang it over the middle, served no purpose, it's crazy to try the same thing and expect different results.