Cubs (Boyd) vs Brewers (Gasser): 09/07/26, 1:10 PM

[mk49]

25 minutes ago, chibears55 said:

They spent 241 mil, 7th in payroll, its not about spending but more of who they're spending it on, and the lack of production theyre getting for the money.

Hoyer just dont know how to spend on what important or quality players 

Comparison of Cubs and Brewers bullpen payroll 

 

 

I don't know how they got the number, but it doesn't look right.  I mean Rea, Civale, Maton, Theilbar and Harvey should be already much more than $17m.  Or, did they include the payroll for the guys who are currently in the bullpen?

[Derwood]

Just need to win every playoff game 12-10. Easy peasy

[NorthsideAvenger]

Sometimes baseball is beyond stupid. 2006 Cards are proof.

Edited Tuesday at 02:42 AM by NorthsideAvenger

[gflore34]

6 hours ago, adambr2 said:

Lara has a 1.0 WAR so far in 141 major league at-bats and Pratt has a 1.5 WAR in 177 at-bats. 

So while they’re obviously not PCA, “replacement level at best” is clearly not the case. 

Yes, an over reaction on my part.  They're not top prospects but, may turn out to be solid players.

[Stratos]

9 hours ago, UMFan83 said:

Yep, probably kept him in too long.  Cubs starter has still not gotten an out in the 8th this season...

I don't blame CC there.  The pen sucks so push good SP performances as hard as they can.  

[Stratos]

If they shave down Zeferjahn's grotesquely large adam's apple maybe he would pitch better?

[Stratos]

9 hours ago, Illiterate Scholar said:

I might quibble with the infield being in with nobody out 

And the go-ahead run on 2nd.  Bring the corners in yes but the middle infield too?  It was a gamble and I guess just didn't work out.

[gflore34]

At this point what’s keeping Counsel or other teammates from tearing into the bullpen?  They can’t get the big strikeout and repeatedly make matters worse by walking batters.  It’s got to be extremely frustrating.  Hell, put Thornton and Thielbar on waivers and go with Miller and Cabrera, something has to change.

Edited Tuesday at 06:12 AM by gflore34

[Geographyhater8888]

10 hours ago, UMFan83 said:

I was going to point out that 3 years ago the World Series was contested by 2 terrible pitching staffs, but the Rangers and Diamondbacks each had 10+ more pitching fWAR than this year's Cubs

So did last years blue jays. 22nd at 11.2. None of those teams had 3 position players with more total war than their pitching staffs, and Swanson still only trails by .2 wins.

It just had to be the one year where the Cubs lead MLB in positional war by over 10 wins to also have the second worst Cubs pitching staff in at least 50 years. 

Edited Tuesday at 11:06 AM by Geographyhater8888

[gflore34]

8 minutes ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

So did last years blue jays. 22nd at 11.2. None of those teams had 3 position players with more total war than their pitching staffs. Swanson could still end up being the 4th. Tthere’s 17 games left to lose .3 fWAR and I believe in them. 

All they need is someone to be effective for a week is this possible?

[Geographyhater8888]

2 hours ago, gflore34 said:

All they need is someone to be effective for a week is this possible?

Sure. But not too effective. We know what happens to Cubs pitchers who are too effective like Ben Brown, Cade Horton and Justin Steele.

Edited Tuesday at 09:21 AM by Geographyhater8888

[Wilson A2000]

[We Got The Whole 9]

39 minutes ago, Wilson A2000 said:

I was nervous he was going to fall flat on his face TBH

[gflore34]

6 hours ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

Sure. But not too effective. We know what happens to Cubs pitchers who are too effective like Ben Brown, Cade Horton and Justin Steele.

It'd be truly amazing if Horton ever throws a pitch for the Cubs again.  Second Tommy John with his injury history?

[mul21]

7 hours ago, Stratos said:

I don't blame CC there.  The pen sucks so push good SP performances as hard as they can.  

I haven't read the whole game thread and I'm sure it was dissected ad nauseum during the game, but I was in the stands and was shocked to see Boyd come out for the 8th and then shocked again to see that he wasn't pulled after a not particularly competitive walk to the leadoff hitter.  I thought it was reasonable to give him the first guy in the 8th because of the lefty lefty matchup and I could see a righty warming up in the pen, but once that walk happens, he absolutely had no business still being in the game.

[Rcal10]

Just now, mul21 said:

I haven't read the whole game thread and I'm sure it was dissected ad nauseum during the game, but I was in the stands and was shocked to see Boyd come out for the 8th and then shocked again to see that he wasn't pulled after a not particularly competitive walk to the leadoff hitter.  I thought it was reasonable to give him the first guy in the 8th because of the lefty lefty matchup and I could see a righty warming up in the pen, but once that walk happens, he absolutely had no business still being in the game.

Boyd was at 87 pitches. There was no reason he shouldn’t come out in the 8th. Especially with that pen. Walter the walk the choice was Boyd against Ortiz ( a guy who isn’t good against lefties) or Zeferjohn against Bauer. A right handed pitcher struggling against lefties and a left handed bat who hits lefties well. So while you might have thought that was a good idea, there is actual data to support the decision that was made. It just didn’t work. 

[Rcal10]

28 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

It'd be truly amazing if Horton ever throws a pitch for the Cubs again.  Second Tommy John with his injury history?

Seems a bit over the edge negative to me, but who knows. Hope Horton amazes you. 

[Rcal10]

51 minutes ago, We Got The Whole 9 said:

I was nervous he was going to fall flat on his face TBH

I remember the early hot takes on Taylor. He has 12 or so AB and we had guys talking about how unimpressed they were with him. How he sucks. So it wasn’t just you who was nervous. He wasn’t my first choice of a righty bat of the bench either. But looks good now. 

[Rcal10]

13 hours ago, UMFan83 said:

I was going to point out that 3 years ago the World Series was contested by 2 terrible pitching staffs, but the Rangers and Diamondbacks each had 10+ more pitching fWAR than this year's Cubs

I am sure this is true. But in the end it is about run prevention. Where did those teams stack up in runs against compared to the rest of the league? Cubs are middle of the pack in that department, even with the worst pitching WAR in baseball. I would bet there are teams that won the WS that were worse in run prevention than the Cubs. 

[gflore34]

36 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

Seems a bit over the edge negative to me, but who knows. Hope Horton amazes you. 

The odds are already stacked against him with a second tommy john, throw in his injury history. I don't think it over the edge negative to say his chances are very slim.

[Rcal10]

15 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

The odds are already stacked against him with a second tommy john, throw in his injury history. I don't think it over the edge negative to say his chances are very slim.

Several pitchers have pitched well after 2 TJ surgeries. Tailon, Eovaldi and Daniel Hudson, to name 3. Sure, it is not ideal. But saying you would be amazed if he ever pitched again for the Cubs is just a step too far, IMO. To me it is probably 50/50 he is ever the same guy he was prior to this injury. So while he may not come back I don’t fell that someone with a 50/50 chance of coming back to what he was previous, is all that improbable. 

[Geographyhater8888]

24 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

The odds are already stacked against him with a second tommy john, throw in his injury history. I don't think it over the edge negative to say his chances are very slim.

What happens first, Horton throws a pitch or Kris Bryant swings a bat?

Edited Tuesday at 02:41 PM by Geographyhater8888

[gflore34]

37 minutes ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

What happens first, Horton throws a pitch or Kris Bryant swings a bat?

I'll add to the above - Or the Cubs' bullpen holds a lead? What happens first?

Edited Tuesday at 03:15 PM by gflore34

[Rcal10]

1 hour ago, gflore34 said:

I'll add to the above - Or the Cubs' bullpen holds a lead? What happens first?

Bullpen holds a lead, Horton throws a pitch. I’m not sure Bryant ever swings a bat in an actual mlb game. 

[gflore34]

3 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

Bullpen holds a lead, Horton throws a pitch. I’m not sure Bryant ever swings a bat in an actual mlb game. 

I'll go in the same order although, it's close. Have little to no confidence the collection of walk happy clowns the Cubs call a bullpen will ever hold a lead again. 

Bryant' condition being degenerative does greatly narrow the chances he'll ever play again.