Winter Doldrums Thread

[Backtobanks]

1 hour ago, Rcal10 said:

I said Bregman OR a high end pitcher. Not both. I said Imai and possibly Okamoto. That would be IF Imai or Okamoto’s numbers have been greatly exaggerated, as was Shoto’s when he came over. So both Imai AND Okamoto for $35M TOTAL (or something around there). Regardless, if you added $13M for Fairbanks you are limited yourself elsewhere. 

I quoted you accurately using the word "OR".  We'll see how exaggerated the numbers will be, but if we can't spend $10 - $15 million on an area of need, then why are we all pretending on Bregman "OR" a front-end pitcher?

[Rcal10]

33 minutes ago, Backtobanks said:

I quoted you accurately using the word "OR".  We'll see how exaggerated the numbers will be, but if we can't spend $10 - $15 million on an area of need, then why are we all pretending on Bregman "OR" a front-end pitcher?

Because, apparently, Jed doesn’t view another pen arm as good use of the money he has to spend. They do have $10M to $15M to spend, but a pen arm wasn’t what they wanted. Spending that money would have left him short on spending for what he obviously thinks are bigger needs.
If he has $25M to a stretch of $32M he didn’t want to put $13M into a pen arm. Jed has done well building pens cheaply. so he stuck to what he feels comfortable with. He has sucked at finding cheap bats. In the end, if he doesn’t spend at least $20M more, I will agree with you that he should have signed Fairbanks. But for now, I would much rather that money be spent elsewhere. 
I’m not saying I agree with it. I wish they spend more. But they don’t. So he has to prioritize. Spending 40% to 50% of their remaining money on Fairbanks was obviously not their priority. 

[Bertz]

 

🤷‍♂️

[Rcal10]

9 minutes ago, Bertz said:

 

🤷‍♂️

Put those two together and end up with Bregman and Cabrera and the off season outcome changes drastically for the better. 

[chibears55]

14 minutes ago, Bertz said:

 

🤷‍♂️

Astros and Orioles...

Be cool if the Cubs were actually trying to get him, adding him and Imai would really make the rotation solid and allow them to trade a SP for a prospect or a bat.

[Illiterate Scholar]

While we're all waiting on Imai for what seems like a natural fit, it'd be kinda funny if it was Bregman that Jed is truly focused on right now. The vibe from the Athletic guys and I guess Kaplan is that the Cubs might not love Imai so maybe that is what is really happening. 

I have concerns that 12-18 months of the 36 months of team control over Cabrera will be spent with him rehabbing from TJS, but we know the Marlins like Caisse (who is probably more valuable than he was last off-season?) so that fit has also always made sense.

 

[Dfan25]

Jed Hoyer seems to be enamored with Alex Bregman .  

[Rcal10]

31 minutes ago, chibears55 said:

Astros and Orioles...

Be cool if the Cubs were actually trying to get him, adding him and Imai would really make the rotation solid and allow them to trade a SP for a prospect or a bat.

If the Cubs got Cabrera I am pretty sure they wouldn’t also get Imai. I would say it is either one or the other. Not both. 

[Rcal10]

3 minutes ago, Dfan25 said:

Jed Hoyer seems to be enamored with Alex Bregman .  

I have said it all off season. I don’t see Bregman signing with the Cubs. Still don’t. . But I would be fine if they did get him. Might come down to either Imai and Okamoto or Cabrera and Bregman. Obviously the latter would cost the Cubs prospects. 

[chibears55]

2 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

If the Cubs got Cabrera I am pretty sure they wouldn’t also get Imai. I would say it is either one or the other. Not both. 

We can dream 🤷

Seems like it all we can do when it comes to the Cubs acquiring players 🙄🙄

[Bertz]

38 minutes ago, Illiterate Scholar said:

While we're all waiting on Imai for what seems like a natural fit, it'd be kinda funny if it was Bregman that Jed is truly focused on right now. The vibe from the Athletic guys and I guess Kaplan is that the Cubs might not love Imai so maybe that is what is really happening. 

I have concerns that 12-18 months of the 36 months of team control over Cabrera will be spent with him rehabbing from TJS, but we know the Marlins like Caisse (who is probably more valuable than he was last off-season?) so that fit has also always made sense.

 

Yeah I like Cabrera a lot and Cabrera+Bregman is a whale of an offseason.  But even beyond the usual extent that all pitchers are risky there's an elevated chance Cabrera's elbow pops next year.  But hey we do currently have the depth to cover something like that.

[Post Count Padder]

Yeah knowing this front office and the resources, it's one or the other. Not both Imai and Cabrera. I'm guessing that Jed really likes Bregman and is now just working to see what can get done while waiting on Imai.

[Geographyhater8888]

Bregman to DH? He isn’t a fit with the entire infield locked up so It can’t be ignored that this is winter number 2 Jed has shown interest and already floated him $115 million. It opens the door for Nico/Shaw being moved and maybe in a 3 way trade in Nico’s case to send a prospect back for a starting pitcher, 

2 years in a row now. 

[Rcal10]

6 minutes ago, Post Count Padder said:

Yeah knowing this front office and the resources, it's one or the other. Not both Imai and Cabrera. I'm guessing that Jed really likes Bregman and is now just working to see what can get done while waiting on Imai.

It isn’t even an issue with the FO, IMO. It doesn’t make any sense to sign Imai and then trade for Cabrera. Counting Steele, eventually, that would be 7 starters. And it wouldn’t add a bat. Just too complicated. Then they do what? Trade a pitcher for a bat? Why complicate things? Just sign or trade for one of the pitchers and then sign a bat. Maybe it is Imai and Okamoto both as free agents. Or Bregman and Cabrera (and they lose prospects)

[Rcal10]

3 minutes ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

Bregman to DH? He isn’t a fit with the entire infield locked up so It can’t be ignored that this is winter number 2 Jed has shown interest and already floated him $115 million. It opens the door for Nico/Shaw being moved and maybe in a 3 way trade in Nico’s case to send a prospect back for a starting pitcher, 

2 years in a row now. 

You have to think if they get Bregman, Shaw or Nico is traded. And even if neither are traded, Shaw can be the utility guy off the bench. If they do sign Bregman, he isn’t going to DH. If Cabrera becomes a reality my guess is Shaw is gone. 

[Geographyhater8888]

18 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

You have to think if they get Bregman, Shaw or Nico is traded. And even if neither are traded, Shaw can be the utility guy off the bench. If they do sign Bregman, he isn’t going to DH. If Cabrera becomes a reality my guess is Shaw is gone. 

Cabreras asking price would be Matt Shaw? Seems excessive.

Edited December 27, 2025 by Geographyhater8888

[Rcal10]

9 minutes ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

If they end up trading Shaw I’d hope it’s for someone more durable than Cabrera unless the marlins throw in more.

🤷I don’t even pretend to know how certain teams value certain players. Is 6 years of Shaw fair for 3 years of Cabrera? Maybe others can answer that question. Maybe they are just the lead pieces in a trade. To me, I would rather use Cassie in a Cabrera deal and keep Shaw as a bench/utility guy. Then he can move to second next year. I honestly don’t see Bregman, so I have a hard time seeing the cubs trade Shaw. But if they did get Bregman it does open up possibilities of a Shaw trade. 

[CubinNY]

7 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

I have said it all off season. I don’t see Bregman signing with the Cubs. Still don’t. . But I would be fine if they did get him. Might come down to either Imai and Okamoto or Cabrera and Bregman. Obviously the latter would cost the Cubs prospects. 

The Cubs make a nice foil for whomever Boras is negotiating with. 

[Stratos]

11 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

🤷I don’t even pretend to know how certain teams value certain players. Is 6 years of Shaw fair for 3 years of Cabrera? Maybe others can answer that question. Maybe they are just the lead pieces in a trade. To me, I would rather use Cassie in a Cabrera deal and keep Shaw as a bench/utility guy. Then he can move to second next year. I honestly don’t see Bregman, so I have a hard time seeing the cubs trade Shaw. But if they did get Bregman it does open up possibilities of a Shaw trade. 

I just can't see them trading Shaw if they signed Bregman.  Nico's probably leaving after next season so someone needs to play 2B in 2027 and beyond.  If they traded Shaw then they would have traded their 2 best position player prospects (with Cam Smith) over the last 2 offseasons.  With what Jed is trying to build it would be a really weird decision.

[Stratos]

12 hours ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

Bregman to DH? He isn’t a fit with the entire infield locked up so It can’t be ignored that this is winter number 2 Jed has shown interest and already floated him $115 million. It opens the door for Nico/Shaw being moved and maybe in a 3 way trade in Nico’s case to send a prospect back for a starting pitcher, 

2 years in a row now. 

I don't see how this team gets better in 2026 by signing Bregman and then trading Nico in a 3-way for a Cabrera-type SP, rather than just signing a good SP in FA.  Switching Bregman for Nico is a wash at best, if not a downgrade.  Switching e.g. Imai (FA SP) for Cabrera (traded SP) is also kind of a wash.  I don't see much money being saved either.  A different situation than last year where swapping out Bellinger for Tucker saved them a bunch of payroll space to acquire other players.

Just sign a good SP like Imai and take the comp pick for Nico walking next year.

[Stratos]

On 12/25/2025 at 10:04 AM, Rcal10 said:

If he has $25M to a stretch of $32M he didn’t want to put $13M into a pen arm. Jed has done well building pens cheaply

I think Jed's cheap pens have been mixed at best.  They did well last year but each of the previous 2 seasons had almost half a season struggling pens and blown games as a result.  I do like how they're building the pen so far this offseason though, a bunch of solid arms that aren't very expensive.

[Geographyhater8888]

6 hours ago, Stratos said:

I don't see how this team gets better in 2026 by signing Bregman and then trading Nico in a 3-way for a Cabrera-type SP, rather than just signing a good SP in FA.  Switching Bregman for Nico is a wash at best, if not a downgrade.  Switching e.g. Imai (FA SP) for Cabrera (traded SP) is also kind of a wash.  I don't see much money being saved either.  A different situation than last year where swapping out Bellinger for Tucker saved them a bunch of payroll space to acquire other players.

Just sign a good SP like Imai and take the comp pick for Nico walking next year.

Jed already floated Bregman $115 million last winter and is once again showing interest. It might not make sense but the rumors from last offseason was that Jed planned on flipping Nico for a starting pitcher if they had landed Bregman. He definitely made more sense last year though. 

Sign Bregman, keep all 3 infielders while still acquiring Cabrera improves the team and especially the lineup. You’ll still have your second baseman of the future when Nico walks. Shaw can still get at bats as a utility guy for a season. 
Trade Nico and if you turn him into a prospect to send to Miami or somewhere else you’d hope the Marlins throw in an another piece. I’d hope they have someone bigger in mind than Cabrera. Jed pursuing him again is why it’s a topic and I’d be surprised if it happens 

Edited December 28, 2025 by Geographyhater8888

[Geographyhater8888]

11 hours ago, CubinNY said:

The Cubs make a nice foil for whomever Boras is negotiating with. 

This is a possibility if Bregman doesn’t get the years he wants. Boras’s b tier clients are always the last to sign. 

[Geographyhater8888]

18 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

🤷I don’t even pretend to know how certain teams value certain players. Is 6 years of Shaw fair for 3 years of Cabrera? Maybe others can answer that question. Maybe they are just the lead pieces in a trade. To me, I would rather use Cassie in a Cabrera deal and keep Shaw as a bench/utility guy. Then he can move to second next year. I honestly don’t see Bregman, so I have a hard time seeing the cubs trade Shaw. But if they did get Bregman it does open up possibilities of a Shaw trade. 

I know as much as you do but Shaw for Cabrera is a reach. For the sake of improving the team for 2026 and beyond keeping all 3 infielders would be the best move unless we’re talking Joe Ryan. The consensus from other posters is Owen Cassie would be the main piece in a Cabrera trade.
 

Bregman is an upgrade in the lineup and had better numbers away from Fenway and isn’t a Crawford box/green monster merchant either, he had better career numbers away. Was on pace for a 5 fWAR if he didn’t miss time from injuries and will improve the lineup vs left handed pitchers too. Maybe the bat track data projects him to age well?

A +hitter to fill the void left by Tucker with the best of what’s available makes the team better. 

So if he doesn’t get the years he wants then I say go for it in this unlikely scenario.

Edited December 28, 2025 by Geographyhater8888

[Rcal10]

1 hour ago, Geographyhater8888 said:

I know as much as you do but Shaw for Cabrera is a reach. For the sake of improving the team for 2026 and beyond keeping all 3 infielders would be the best move unless we’re talking Joe Ryan. The consensus from other posters is Owen Cassie would be the main piece in a Cabrera trade.
 

I am clearly higher on Cabrera than you are. With an extra year of control over Ryan and Gore ( 2 that are always talked about along with Cabrera), I feel his trade cost would be similar to them. But, as I said, who knows.

But to your point of Shaw being too much for Cabrera. To me, if he is too much for Cabrera he is also too much for Ryan or Gore. I would like Cassie to be the main piece in any trade for one of those guys. 

Honestly, I don’t see Bregman at all. If they did get him they would have to go over the LT line. Even with Cabrera (cheapest contract), they can’t fit Bregman. And I agree with Stratos that if they traded Hoerner they aren’t even gaining anything by bringing Bregman in.

Now, IF they would go over the LT line this year, sure Bregman makes sense along with a trade for a pitcher using Cassie as the main piece. Makes the team better this year and allows them to plug in Shaw if/when Hoerner leaves. 

If the Cubs have 2 moves in them and plan on staying under the LT line I think the most they could do is a bat like Okamoto and then trade for one of the pitchers we have been mentioning all off season. But don’t use Shaw! Unless the contracts for Imai and Okamoto are lower AAV than what is being said, they can’t get both of them and stay under.