Giles blocks deal to Boston: turns out, he enjoys losing.

[SouthSideRyan]

if another team (or several other teams) also claimed him and he either rejects a trade to Boston or a deal w/Boston can't be worked out, can the Pads negotiate with the next team in line that claimed him or is he automatically taken off of waivers?

 

I'm fairly certain it's either winning team or nobody.

 

Yep, if they can't work out a deal, the Pads will either revoke the waivers on Giles and take him back or let him go to Boston for free. They can put him back on waivers after that, but those would be irrevocable, and first in priority to claim him, gets him.

[cubs121]

I can't remember where, but i'm pretty sure i just read somewhere that the Red Sox have claimed Giles. I'll try to find the article and post a link for it.

[cubs121]

found it.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20080807&content_id=3268154&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

[UK1679666180]

Damn Red Sox, they did this for only one reason.... To block him from the Rays.

[SCCubbieFAN]

I can't remember where, but i'm pretty sure i just read somewhere that the Red Sox have claimed Giles. I'll try to find the article and post a link for it.

 

that article also says he is in his 6th season w/the Pads which would make him a 10/5 guy, but in an earlier thread about a possible trade of Giles to the Cubs I think nilo pointed out that he signed/was traded to the Pads slightly less than 5 years ago.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I can't remember where, but i'm pretty sure i just read somewhere that the Red Sox have claimed Giles. I'll try to find the article and post a link for it.

 

that article also says he is in his 6th season w/the Pads which would make him a 10/5 guy, but in an earlier thread about a possible trade of Giles to the Cubs I think nilo pointed out that he signed/was traded to the Pads slightly less than 5 years ago.

this is his 6th season, but it hasn't been 5 full years yet (August 26)

[Amazing_Grace]

I'm wondering if Boston made the claim to block the Rays.

I think that's likely, considering they know he has previously expressed a lack of interest in ever playing there. He went to SD as cheaply as he did (at the time) for a reason, he wanted to be in that area. I don't think he'll change his mind and go to Boston.

With that said, if he does decide to enforce his no trade clause, then SD has to pull him back, right? Then if they try to put him on waivers again, it would be unrevocable. If Boston claimed him again, can he refuse without retiring? SD wouldn't technically be trading him, so his no trade clause would be irrelevant, right? It's probably a moot point, SD wouldn't put him on unrevocable waivers and get nothing for him.

 

I think that when another team claims someone on waivers, it's still considered a "trade" whether or not the team gets anything for it. If his no trade clause would apply now when Boston puts in a claim why wouldn't it apply then when Boston puts in a claim. After all, any trade in August is just a swap of guys who are on or have already cleared waivers. My guess is that if a scenario like this happened, Boston would have bought the rights to a player who had no obligation to play for them, and would be sitting on his butt somewhere in SD. However, Boston is probably going to be able to figure out whether or not Giles would actually refuse to play for them by just phoning his agent, and then wouldn't make the claim, unless they really wanted him not to play for Tampa.

[Jehrico]

I'm wondering if Boston made the claim to block the Rays.

I think that's likely, considering they know he has previously expressed a lack of interest in ever playing there. He went to SD as cheaply as he did (at the time) for a reason, he wanted to be in that area. I don't think he'll change his mind and go to Boston.

With that said, if he does decide to enforce his no trade clause, then SD has to pull him back, right? Then if they try to put him on waivers again, it would be unrevocable. If Boston claimed him again, can he refuse without retiring? SD wouldn't technically be trading him, so his no trade clause would be irrelevant, right? It's probably a moot point, SD wouldn't put him on unrevocable waivers and get nothing for him.

 

I think that when another team claims someone on waivers, it's still considered a "trade" whether or not the team gets anything for it. If his no trade clause would apply now when Boston puts in a claim why wouldn't it apply then when Boston puts in a claim. After all, any trade in August is just a swap of guys who are on or have already cleared waivers. My guess is that if a scenario like this happened, Boston would have bought the rights to a player who had no obligation to play for them, and would be sitting on his butt somewhere in SD. However, Boston is probably going to be able to figure out whether or not Giles would actually refuse to play for them by just phoning his agent, and then wouldn't make the claim, unless they really wanted him not to play for Tampa.

Because the first claim leads to either a trade or a revocation of waivers. The second claim isn't a trade and can't be revoked. The Pads aren't violating his no trade clause by releasing him the second waiver round.

[SouthSideRyan]

I'm wondering if Boston made the claim to block the Rays.

I think that's likely, considering they know he has previously expressed a lack of interest in ever playing there. He went to SD as cheaply as he did (at the time) for a reason, he wanted to be in that area. I don't think he'll change his mind and go to Boston.

With that said, if he does decide to enforce his no trade clause, then SD has to pull him back, right? Then if they try to put him on waivers again, it would be unrevocable. If Boston claimed him again, can he refuse without retiring? SD wouldn't technically be trading him, so his no trade clause would be irrelevant, right? It's probably a moot point, SD wouldn't put him on unrevocable waivers and get nothing for him.

 

I think that when another team claims someone on waivers, it's still considered a "trade" whether or not the team gets anything for it. If his no trade clause would apply now when Boston puts in a claim why wouldn't it apply then when Boston puts in a claim. After all, any trade in August is just a swap of guys who are on or have already cleared waivers. My guess is that if a scenario like this happened, Boston would have bought the rights to a player who had no obligation to play for them, and would be sitting on his butt somewhere in SD. However, Boston is probably going to be able to figure out whether or not Giles would actually refuse to play for them by just phoning his agent, and then wouldn't make the claim, unless they really wanted him not to play for Tampa.

Because the first claim leads to either a trade or a revocation of waivers. The second claim isn't a trade and can't be revoked. The Pads aren't violating his no trade clause by releasing him the second waiver round.

 

Those aren't the only two options. The waiving team can let the player go to the team at no cost a la Jose Canseco to the Yankees and Randy Myers to the Padres. I don't know how this affects NTCs though.

[mdwilla]

Say Giles invokes his no trade clause and the Padres put him through waivers again if the Cubs Claim him they get him for free ?

[SouthSideRyan]

Say Giles invokes his no trade clause and the Padres put him through waivers again if the Cubs Claim him they get him for free ?

 

Well they'd have to pay his contract, and assuming they were the team with the best priority to claim him, then yes they get him.

[davearm2]

I'm wondering if Boston made the claim to block the Rays.

I think that's likely, considering they know he has previously expressed a lack of interest in ever playing there. He went to SD as cheaply as he did (at the time) for a reason, he wanted to be in that area. I don't think he'll change his mind and go to Boston.

With that said, if he does decide to enforce his no trade clause, then SD has to pull him back, right? Then if they try to put him on waivers again, it would be unrevocable. If Boston claimed him again, can he refuse without retiring? SD wouldn't technically be trading him, so his no trade clause would be irrelevant, right? It's probably a moot point, SD wouldn't put him on unrevocable waivers and get nothing for him.

 

I think that when another team claims someone on waivers, it's still considered a "trade" whether or not the team gets anything for it. If his no trade clause would apply now when Boston puts in a claim why wouldn't it apply then when Boston puts in a claim. After all, any trade in August is just a swap of guys who are on or have already cleared waivers. My guess is that if a scenario like this happened, Boston would have bought the rights to a player who had no obligation to play for them, and would be sitting on his butt somewhere in SD. However, Boston is probably going to be able to figure out whether or not Giles would actually refuse to play for them by just phoning his agent, and then wouldn't make the claim, unless they really wanted him not to play for Tampa.

Because the first claim leads to either a trade or a revocation of waivers. The second claim isn't a trade and can't be revoked. The Pads aren't violating his no trade clause by releasing him the second waiver round.

Your first sentence is inaccurate. If a guy is claimed, there are three potential outcomes... not just the two you list.

 

1 - trade is worked out

2 - player is pulled back

3 - player is allowed to go outright to the team placing the claim

 

AFAIK, any player with a NTC can block #1 and #3, if the team placing the claim is not one he's interested in going to.

 

That is, you can't force a guy with a NTC out of town by trade *or* by the waiver process.

 

The whole point of the NTC is obviously to empower the player to have control over where he's assigned. The waiver process cannot circumvent the player's rights in this respect.

[BigbadB]

Personally, I don't see this trade working out. Giles has Boston on his list of teams he can't be traded to, IIRC. And while Boston is willing to pick up the remainder of his contract, San Diego will still want some talented prospects for Giles, and I'm not sure Boston will be willing to pick up the entire contract AND give up talented prospects as well.

 

The reason I don't see it working out is because Boston already has a pretty dense outfield, which cuts into Giles' playing time. Bay in left, Drew in right and Ellsbury and Crisp in CF. I'm not sure how keen Giles would be to DH, either, and Boston already has Ortiz at DH.

 

It is interesting that Giles hasn't made it public that he's blocking the trade at this point, so maybe he would like a chance at a World Series ring. But, you still have to get Padres management to sign off on lesser talent for basically their second best player.

[YearofDaCubs]

According to Olney, Giles would use his no-trade clause to avoid going to the Red Sox.

[E.J.]

According to Olney, Giles would use his no-trade clause to avoid going to the Red Sox.

 

Makes sense. Giles would be a bench player at best in Boston.

 

Boston is sneaky. They did this just to block the Rays, knowing that Giles had them on his no-trade list.

[ChiCubsFan]

I'd really like to know why Giles doesn't want to play in Boston.

[Guest]

I'd really like to know why Giles doesn't want to play in Boston.

 

He's from San Diego.

[ChiCubsFan]

I'd really like to know why Giles doesn't want to play in Boston.

 

He's from San Diego.

 

So? His list is 8 teams right? Why on earth would the Red Sox be one of them? There are so many worse teams to play for and worse cities to live in. You'd think he'd be tired of all the losing in Pitt and now SD and would want a chance for a world series.

[Guest]

I'd really like to know why Giles doesn't want to play in Boston.

 

He's from San Diego.

 

So? His list is 8 teams right? Why on earth would the Red Sox be one of them? There are so many worse teams to play for and worse cities to live in. You'd think he'd be tired of all the losing in Pitt and now SD and would want a chance for a world series.

 

There are other places he can go to get a chance at a World Series - Boston isn't the only option. Maybe he just doesn't like Boston.

[RedFlash]

According to Olney, Giles would use his no-trade clause to avoid going to the Red Sox.

 

Makes sense. Giles would be a bench player at best in Boston.

 

Boston is sneaky. They did this just to block the Rays, knowing that Giles had them on his no-trade list.

 

Didn't matter. Tampa Bay is on the list of teams he could block a trade to. So if Boston doesn't put a claim on Giles, and TB did, I doubt Giles would have accepted a trade to TB.

[Jehrico]

According to Olney, Giles would use his no-trade clause to avoid going to the Red Sox.

 

Makes sense. Giles would be a bench player at best in Boston.

 

Boston is sneaky. They did this just to block the Rays, knowing that Giles had them on his no-trade list.

 

Didn't matter. Tampa Bay is on the list of teams he could block a trade to. So if Boston doesn't put a claim on Giles, and TB did, I doubt Giles would have accepted a trade to TB.

Boston apparently felt it wasn't worth the chance.

 

Giles also gave a hometown discount when he signed with SD. His family is there, and he doesn't want to move them. If he wants to put his family over the quality of his teammates, then good for him.

[Mizzou]

This is surprising. He'd rather start on a crappy team than be on the bench of a team that has a shot to win the World Series? Winning certainly isn't one of his priorities.

[Jehrico]

This is surprising. He'd rather start on a crappy team than be on the bench of a team that has a shot to win the World Series? Winning certainly isn't one of his priorities.

Some guys just want to play for certain teams. I doubt you had any such disdain for Dawson when he resigned with us after the 87 season, did you?

[CubinNY]

Personally, I don't see this trade working out. Giles has Boston on his list of teams he can't be traded to, IIRC. And while Boston is willing to pick up the remainder of his contract, San Diego will still want some talented prospects for Giles, and I'm not sure Boston will be willing to pick up the entire contract AND give up talented prospects as well.

 

The reason I don't see it working out is because Boston already has a pretty dense outfield, which cuts into Giles' playing time. Bay in left, Drew in right and Ellsbury and Crisp in CF. I'm not sure how keen Giles would be to DH, either, and Boston already has Ortiz at DH.

 

It is interesting that Giles hasn't made it public that he's blocking the trade at this point, so maybe he would like a chance at a World Series ring. But, you still have to get Padres management to sign off on lesser talent for basically their second best player.

I want some lotto numbers, staat.

[Mizzou]

This is surprising. He'd rather start on a crappy team than be on the bench of a team that has a shot to win the World Series? Winning certainly isn't one of his priorities.

Some guys just want to play for certain teams. I doubt you had any such disdain for Dawson when he resigned with us after the 87 season, did you?

Well, I was five but I do remember talking to my buddies in kindergarten saying how stupid of a decision that was.

 

I see what you're saying, but it just strikes me as odd that a player who's always been on bad teams and who's near the end of his career wouldn't accept a trade to a team with a great chance to win it all.