College Football - Week of 9/1

[reggiemiller rules]

Okay assume that it's the same difficulty (and I think it is that or the SEC one is tougher).

 

They still have a tough South Carolina and Alabama games. Those teams are better than anyone left in the Big Ten. Not to mention they're lucky that they don't get Tennessee or Georgia this year. AND they have to play ANOTHER top ten team presumably in the SEC championship game if they make it.

 

The SEC gauntlet for any team is significantly harder than any conference schedule for another team. Even Kentucky on the SEC schedule is pretty damn good. The league's loaded and deserves all the ESPN hype it gets. It's much much much harder to run through the SEC unscathed than it is the Big Ten, Big XII or Pac 10. The difference is night and day.

 

And in LSU's case we haven't even considered the fact they play all of that and still got Va Tech.

 

Yeah I agree, the top teams in the Big Ten, Big XII, and Pac 10 may be able to match the top of the SEC. But the depth of the SEC is much deeper then any other conference in the nation. No conferences middle of the pack teams can compare with UK, Bama, or Georiga.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

We're calling Kentucky and Alabama good teams now?

[CDBears1259]

We're calling Kentucky and Alabama good teams now?

 

Well, Kentucky is supposedly much improved this year and they have been somewhat competitive in the past. As for Bama, consider the Saban factor and some returning talent.

[CDBears1259]

Good for them. Here in lies the problem. The SEC has annually used this "guantlet" as an excuse not to schedule decent non-conference games. A lot of their bowl games are "quasi" home games. Yet the Big Ten still took 2 out of 3 last year against the SEC. Also I wouldnt have a problem lining Purdue and Iowa up against SC and Alabama. When the SEC starts to prove how great they are by consistently scheduling good non-conference game, then I will believe the hype. So good for LSU and Tennessee for starting to improve their non-conference schedule. I guess If the SEC is so superior they should have no problems with Cal and Va Tech. If the SEC is so darn superior, maybe the SEC title game should just be the National title game and everyone else should just play for "Rest of the Nation Title"

 

Bitter? I could go on to try and defend the SEC, but something tells me I couldn't convince you otherwise. It's just old ass tired argument that no opposing views will see eye-to-eye on.

Edited August 31, 2007 by CDBears1259

[NewUserName]

This is usually one of those yearly debates along the lines of "Does Notre Dame belong in a BCS game"

 

Truthfully I think if the NCAA is going to keep the BCS system they need to get more control of Regular Season scheduling. I think a great idea would be for the NCAA to mandate every conference to go head to head against 2 other conferences each year. Make 1 of the conferences a BCS conference and 1 a non-BCS conference. Like this year you could have Big East/Big Ten , ACC/SEC and Big 12/Pac 10. It can rotate every year. Than line each of these conferences up against 1 non-BCS conference. Then let the University Pres, Coaches and ADs seed the teams in their conference. Than let 1 play 1 and so on. This would give BCS voters a better feel of how good each conference is. Its not perfect and still leaves a lot of room for debate. But like I said if we are going to keep the BCS system than a better way has to be made to come up with the most deserving teams. I dont think tweeking the system is the answer as much as forcing more games among the elite teams.

[reggiemiller rules]

We're calling Kentucky and Alabama good teams now?

 

I actually didnt mean Bama, I meant South Carolina. But yes UK has a very good quarterback and will be pretty good this year. Better then the middle of the pack Big Ten teams like Purdue and Indiana, and better then the middle Pac 10 ten teams.

[CubColtPacer]

A friend and I did the Big 10-SEC debate a few months ago. I'm an ND fan who has spent more time around the Big 10 than any other conference, and he is an SEC fan his whole life. We ranked both conferences and took 11 teams from each (for the SEC we knocked out I think the 7th ranked team, as close to the middle as we could get). We then compared accomplishments-who has been the better team over that time? When we finished hashing it out, we found it was a complete push. The SEC had a little better 3rd-5th teams over that time period, and the Big 10 was better in the 7-10 range. The other matchups were pushes. The results certainly surprised my friend (who ended up agreeing with the results).

 

The SEC might be better this year, but I think it's too early to tell. It probably won't be known until after the bowl games.

[Mephistopheles]

bama managed to beat hawaii last year and kentucky managed to beat clemson. theyre not great but theyre certainly solid teams. theyre no worse than last years ucla now are they....

[Derwood]

the "easiest" way to compare two conferences is to run a simply RPI rating on each team. the most basic is to look at the records of each of the teams a school played, and the records of the schools those teams played.

 

the NCAA scheduling is a total clusterhump. it's obnoxious that the Big 10 plays 12 straight weeks without a bye, while USC is playing 3 weeks later.

 

Here's what they SHOULD (but won't) do:

 

- EVERY team must be in a conference (I think there are only 2 or 3 who aren't anymore)

- No conference larger than 12 teams

- Every team plays 12 games over 13 weeks

- Every team plays 10 conference games (unless conference is smaller than 11 teams)

- Non-conference games are scheduled year to year (not 5 years in advance), with a rotating "conference vs. conference" schedule among BCS conferences. For example, this year, the Big 10 plays the SEC, with the #1 team from each conference playing, then the #2's, etc.

- Non-conference games are scheduled by the NCAA, not the athletic directors.

 

basically, take all the scheduling power out of the conference/school's hands and regulate and normalize it nation wide.

[NewUserName]

Good for them. Here in lies the problem. The SEC has annually used this "guantlet" as an excuse not to schedule decent non-conference games. A lot of their bowl games are "quasi" home games. Yet the Big Ten still took 2 out of 3 last year against the SEC. Also I wouldnt have a problem lining Purdue and Iowa up against SC and Alabama. When the SEC starts to prove how great they are by consistently scheduling good non-conference game, then I will believe the hype. So good for LSU and Tennessee for starting to improve their non-conference schedule. I guess If the SEC is so superior they should have no problems with Cal and Va Tech. If the SEC is so darn superior, maybe the SEC title game should just be the National title game and everyone else should just play for "Rest of the Nation Title"

 

Bitter? I could go on to try and defend the SEC, but something tells me I couldn't convince you otherwise. It's just old ass tired argument that no opposing views will see eye-to-eye on.

 

 

Yeah I was being a little hostile. Its not that I dont think the SEC is the best conference. They probably are year in year out the best conference. I am just saying that in any given year they are not superior to some other conferences. Even in that it really doesnt make a difference who is better. The problem I have is that SEC schools in the past have used this "Our Conference is Superior" excuse not to schedule better. I hope in the future they will do better scheduling. As long as ESPN has annointed them the Superior Conference though, They probably dont see the point.

[fiver]

Since we are on the topic, Auburn is going to not only beat Kansas State, but they will cover the 13.5 point spread tomorrow night.

[Derwood]

just for the sake of information, the SEC and Big 10's non-con games:

 

SEC

 

Florida: W. Kentucky, Troy, Florida Atlantic, Florida St.

Georgia: Oklahoma St., W. Carolina, Troy, GA Tech

Kentucky: E. Kentucky, Kent, Louisville, Florida Atlantic

S. Carolina: UL-Lafayette, SC State, N. Carolina, Clemson

Tennessee: California, So. Miss, Arkansas St., UL-Lafayette

Vanderbilt: Richmond, E. Michigan, Miami (OH), Wake Forest

Alabama: W. Carolina, Florida St., Houston, UL-Monroe

Arkansas: Troy, N. Texas, Chattanooga, Florida International

Auburn: Kansas St., S. Florida, New Mexico St., Tennessee Tech

LSU: VA Tech, Middle Tennessee, Tulane, LA Tech

Ole Miss: Memphis, Mizzou, LA Tech, Northwestern St.

Miss St.: Tulane, Gardner-Webb, UAB, W. Virginia

 

Big 10

 

Illinois: Mizzou, W. Illinois, Syracuse, Ball St.

Indiana: Indiana St., Akron, W. Michigan, Ball St.

Iowa: N. Illinois, Syracuse, Iowa St., W. Michigan

Michigan: Appalachian St., Oregon, Notre Dame, E. Michigan

Mich. St.: UAB, Bowling Green, Pitt, Notre Dame

Minnesota: Bowling Green, Miami (OH), Florida Atlantic, N. Dakota St.

Northwestern: Northeastern, Nevada, Duke, E. Michigan

Ohio State: Youngstown St., Akron, Washington, Kent St.

Penn State: Florida International, Notre Dame, Buffalo, Temple

Purdue: Toledo, E. Illinois, C. Michigan, Notre Dame

Wisconsin: Washington St., UNLV, The Citadel, N. Illinois

 

 

they are tied with 13 non-con games vs. BCS schools. someone else can count up 1-AA schools if they want to make that comparison

[fiver]

oh..also..Georgia is not only going to beat Oklahoma State tomorrow, but they also will cover the spread.

[fiver]

sorry..one more...Tennessee will beat Cal tomorrow and thus cover the spread.

[NewUserName]

sorry..one more...Tennessee will beat Cal tomorrow and thus cover the spread.

 

 

You got your 3 team parlay.

[soccer10k]

Good for them. Here in lies the problem. The SEC has annually used this "guantlet" as an excuse not to schedule decent non-conference games. A lot of their bowl games are "quasi" home games. Yet the Big Ten still took 2 out of 3 last year against the SEC. Also I wouldnt have a problem lining Purdue and Iowa up against SC and Alabama. When the SEC starts to prove how great they are by consistently scheduling good non-conference game, then I will believe the hype. So good for LSU and Tennessee for starting to improve their non-conference schedule. I guess If the SEC is so superior they should have no problems with Cal and Va Tech. If the SEC is so darn superior, maybe the SEC title game should just be the National title game and everyone else should just play for "Rest of the Nation Title"

 

Tennessee beat the crap out of Cal last year.

 

Also, sure the Big Ten took 2 of 3 against the SEC last year but their top 2 teams got absolutely waxed in their bowl games. Last year, and probably again this year, it's the top four (OSU, Wisc, UM, PSU) and then the rest is crap. Purdue and Minnesota were 5 and 6 in the Big 10 last year - do you really they would stand a chance against any of Tennessee/Georgia/Auburn/LSU/Arkansas (depending on who you consider to be #5 and #6 in the SEC in 06)? Of course not.

 

Oh, and the Big 10 went 2-5 in the bowls last year. Overrated.

[soccer10k]

- Non-conference games are scheduled year to year (not 5 years in advance), with a rotating "conference vs. conference" schedule among BCS conferences. For example, this year, the Big 10 plays the SEC, with the #1 team from each conference playing, then the #2's, etc.

 

I don't know if they should necessarily rank the teams but having something like the ACC-Big 10 challenge they have in basketball would be wonderful.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

So, would it be worth my time next Saturday to drive the 30 miles and go watch Hawaii play La. Tech?

[SouthSideRyan]

sorry..one more...Tennessee will beat Cal tomorrow and thus cover the spread.

 

Nate Longshore ftw.

 

Derwood, I counted 10 I-AA for SEC, 6 for Big Ten

 

And you missed South Florida as a BCS team.

[Exile on Waveland]

Good for them. Here in lies the problem. The SEC has annually used this "guantlet" as an excuse not to schedule decent non-conference games. A lot of their bowl games are "quasi" home games. Yet the Big Ten still took 2 out of 3 last year against the SEC. Also I wouldnt have a problem lining Purdue and Iowa up against SC and Alabama. When the SEC starts to prove how great they are by consistently scheduling good non-conference game, then I will believe the hype. So good for LSU and Tennessee for starting to improve their non-conference schedule. I guess If the SEC is so superior they should have no problems with Cal and Va Tech. If the SEC is so darn superior, maybe the SEC title game should just be the National title game and everyone else should just play for "Rest of the Nation Title"

 

Tennessee beat the crap out of Cal last year.

 

Also, sure the Big Ten took 2 of 3 against the SEC last year but their top 2 teams got absolutely waxed in their bowl games. Last year, and probably again this year, it's the top four (OSU, Wisc, UM, PSU) and then the rest is crap. Purdue and Minnesota were 5 and 6 in the Big 10 last year - do you really they would stand a chance against any of Tennessee/Georgia/Auburn/LSU/Arkansas (depending on who you consider to be #5 and #6 in the SEC in 06)? Of course not.

 

Oh, and the Big 10 went 2-5 in the bowls last year. Overrated.

 

I think the SEC is the best conference year-in and year-out, though the Big Ten is generally close. So, you know where I'm coming from. However, I'd like to note a few things:

 

First, Michigan lost to USC by 14. USC is a completely different ballgame. Last three times USC has played an SEC team: won at Arkansas 50-14 last season, beat Arkansas 70-17 in 2005, won at Auburn 23-0 in 2003. No, Michigan wasn't terribly competitive with the Trojans last season, but the SEC has actually faired much worse (and two of the above three games featured good SEC teams).

 

Second, while Iowa was "crap" last year -- though they nearly knocked off Texas in their bowl -- until proven incorrect, that must be considered a hiccup. They're a solid team that has gone 2-1 against the SEC in bowls the last for years (beating Florida and LSU, while dropping one to Florida).

[Exile on Waveland]

So, would it be worth my time next Saturday to drive the 30 miles and go watch Hawaii play La. Tech?

 

I would think so, yes. Lots of passing yards and points.

[Derwood]

sorry..one more...Tennessee will beat Cal tomorrow and thus cover the spread.

 

Nate Longshore ftw.

 

Derwood, I counted 10 I-AA for SEC, 6 for Big Ten

 

And you missed South Florida as a BCS team.

 

Big East?

[NewUserName]

Good for them. Here in lies the problem. The SEC has annually used this "guantlet" as an excuse not to schedule decent non-conference games. A lot of their bowl games are "quasi" home games. Yet the Big Ten still took 2 out of 3 last year against the SEC. Also I wouldnt have a problem lining Purdue and Iowa up against SC and Alabama. When the SEC starts to prove how great they are by consistently scheduling good non-conference game, then I will believe the hype. So good for LSU and Tennessee for starting to improve their non-conference schedule. I guess If the SEC is so superior they should have no problems with Cal and Va Tech. If the SEC is so darn superior, maybe the SEC title game should just be the National title game and everyone else should just play for "Rest of the Nation Title"

 

Tennessee beat the crap out of Cal last year.

 

Also, sure the Big Ten took 2 of 3 against the SEC last year but their top 2 teams got absolutely waxed in their bowl games. Last year, and probably again this year, it's the top four (OSU, Wisc, UM, PSU) and then the rest is crap. Purdue and Minnesota were 5 and 6 in the Big 10 last year - do you really they would stand a chance against any of Tennessee/Georgia/Auburn/LSU/Arkansas (depending on who you consider to be #5 and #6 in the SEC in 06)? Of course not.

 

Oh, and the Big 10 went 2-5 in the bowls last year. Overrated.

 

I think the SEC is the best conference year-in and year-out, though the Big Ten is generally close. So, you know where I'm coming from. However, I'd like to note a few things:

 

First, Michigan lost to USC by 14. USC is a completely different ballgame. Last three times USC has played an SEC team: won at Arkansas 50-14 last season, beat Arkansas 70-17 in 2005, won at Auburn 23-0 in 2003. No, Michigan wasn't terribly competitive with the Trojans last season, but the SEC has actually faired much worse (and two of the above three games featured good SEC teams).

 

Second, while Iowa was "crap" last year -- though they nearly knocked off Texas in their bowl -- until proven incorrect, that must be considered a hiccup. They're a solid team that has gone 2-1 against the SEC in bowls the last for years (beating Florida and LSU, while dropping one to Florida).

 

 

The Rose Bowl is also a "Home" game for USC. I think if USC played a game in Chicago against Michigan in late November the outcome would be a lot different. I would venture to say the same for Florida against OSU, even though last years game was probably closer to OSU than Florida.

 

Also soccer I did say in a later post that the SEC is probably the best conference year in and year out. I just dont think they are as superior as they think they are. In a later post I also said that as long as the NCAA is going to keep this crap BCS, then they need to take more control of scheduling to help eliminate the crap scheduling that a lot of big time schools do. In my post I never say that the SEC isnt the best conference. I just have heard several SEC coaches use this Superior conference excuse for not scheduling good teams. So your whole counter arguement wasnt even directed at anything I wrote. I didnt say the Big Ten, Pac 10 or anyone was better.

 

 

Lastly if we are going to use Bowl games as a judge of whos the better conference the Big Ten and SEC are 11-11 since 1999 against each other. Most of these games of course being in SEC territory. I havent checked the SEC's record against other conferences in bowl games since then. I would use this to show that maybe just maybe the SEC isnt quite as superior as their coaches, their fans and ESPN would have everyone believe.

[chuckywang]

So pumped for Duke vs. UConn tomorrow!!

[soccer10k]

The Rose Bowl is also a "Home" game for USC. I think if USC played a game in Chicago against Michigan in late November the outcome would be a lot different. I would venture to say the same for Florida against OSU, even though last years game was probably closer to OSU than Florida.

 

Also soccer I did say in a later post that the SEC is probably the best conference year in and year out. I just dont think they are as superior as they think they are. In a later post I also said that as long as the NCAA is going to keep this crap BCS, then they need to take more control of scheduling to help eliminate the crap scheduling that a lot of big time schools do. In my post I never say that the SEC isnt the best conference. I just have heard several SEC coaches use this Superior conference excuse for not scheduling good teams. So your whole counter arguement wasnt even directed at anything I wrote. I didnt say the Big Ten, Pac 10 or anyone was better.

 

 

Lastly if we are going to use Bowl games as a judge of whos the better conference the Big Ten and SEC are 11-11 since 1999 against each other. Most of these games of course being in SEC territory. I havent checked the SEC's record against other conferences in bowl games since then. I would use this to show that maybe just maybe the SEC isnt quite as superior as their coaches, their fans and ESPN would have everyone believe.

 

Yeah, it probably would be closer in a more neutral location but USC dominated Michigan in that game and was clearly the superior team.

 

I also agree with you, like my response to Derwood's post, that the NCAA should regulate some of the OOC scheduling. Something like the ACC-Big 10 challenge would be wonderful or rotating the conferences that play each other every year.

 

And I just used the bowl games because you said the Big Ten took 2 of 3 from the SEC last year in bowl games.