Trade deadline target

[Geographyhater8888]

15 hours ago, squally1313 said:

We’re just throwing shota in the DFA pile (now that we decided Happ can begrudgingly stay, I guess he can have his spot?) huh?  4.40 ERA/FIP can’t be a back end of the rotation guy behind Boyd, brown, and a TOR acquisition?

Not the spirit of your post but it cracks me up how people demand $400 million slugger production from Happ for some bizarre reason, because he’s one of of our top hitters. He is. Unfortunately his production entailed a 3/$60 million contract that he’s more than lived up to  

He wouldn’t stick out like a sore thumb during these bad slumps with a Juan Soto  in the middle of the order to take the pressure and spot light off of him, which isn’t at all his fault.

Edited yesterday at 12:56 PM by Geographyhater8888

[squally1313]

Ian Happ has been better than Riley Greene this year (and since the beginning of last year) how is that an efficient use of resources

[squally1313]

But hey, maybe Greene can maintain his .430 BABIP, it would only be the highest BABIP in a non-COVID season since 2000 by 24 points. 

[Bull]

I’m wondering if, hear me out, maybe we should focus on both starting and relief pitching as we look at trades.

[mul21]

10 minutes ago, Bull said:

I’m wondering if, hear me out, maybe we should focus on both starting and relief pitching as we look at trades.

I think most would agree with you.  The people focusing on adding bats are a bit puzzling to me because those guys have mostly proven records and will regress to the mean and be fine.  The pitching has been sub par for years now and all the injuries are only making it worse.

[Rcal10]

12 minutes ago, mul21 said:

I think most would agree with you.  The people focusing on adding bats are a bit puzzling to me because those guys have mostly proven records and will regress to the mean and be fine.  The pitching has been sub par for years now and all the injuries are only making it worse.

I agree. Which is the basis of my disagreement with Peanut regarding then Cubs needing this “superstar” bat. For starters his definition of “superstar bat” is very gray. Cubs have enough bats, and if they do win the WS a few of those guys on this current roster would most likely put  up very good numbers. Several are very capable of it. They would then be considered this teams superstar bats. 
Cubs issue is pitching. Even if Boyd and Cabrera come back healthy and pitching to form of last year, and Imanaga settles in between what he was at the start of the season and what he has been his last few starts, (let’s say 3.75-4.0 era)they need another starter. A solid pen arm would help too. The season is far from lost. But they are really disappointing me right now. 

[squally1313]

Cubs ranking across baseball by position since the beginning of 2025:

• Catcher: 9th
• 1B: 6th
• 2B: 2nd
• SS: 13th
• 3B: 24th
• LF: 6th
• CF: 1st
• RF: 3rd
• OF Total: 2nd
• DH: 19th

 

• SP: 21st
• RP: 21st
• Overall pitching: 22nd

[chibears55]

3 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

I agree. Which is the basis of my disagreement with Peanut regarding then Cubs needing this “superstar” bat. For starters his definition of “superstar bat” is very gray. Cubs have enough bats, and if they do win the WS a few of those guys on this current roster would most likely put  up very good numbers. Several are very capable of it. They would then be considered this teams superstar bats. 
Cubs issue is pitching. Even if Boyd and Cabrera come back healthy and pitching to form of last year, and Imanaga settles in between what he was at the start of the season and what he has been his last few starts, (let’s say 3.75-4.0 era)they need another starter. A solid pen arm would help too. The season is far from lost. But they are really disappointing me right now. 

Pitching has to be Hoyer number 1 priority no doubt,  but i think if the bats are still a bit iffy and depending on how much production they get from Ballesteros and Shaw in the DH spot from now til the deadline, Hoyer might look to add a more productive bat to fill that role. 

Obviosly theyll be a need if 1 or both those guys are used to get pitching 

[mul21]

46 minutes ago, squally1313 said:

Cubs ranking across baseball by position since the beginning of 2025:

• Catcher: 9th
• 1B: 6th
• 2B: 2nd
• SS: 13th
• 3B: 24th
• LF: 6th
• CF: 1st
• RF: 3rd
• OF Total: 2nd
• DH: 19th

 

• SP: 21st
• RP: 21st
• Overall pitching: 22nd

Top 6 at 5 spots and top 10 at 6 seems good no?  It's almost like having pitching that can carry you through offensive slumps is as important as having an offense that can bail you out when the pitching isn't as good as expected on a particular day.

[Bertz]

Sonny Gray had a pretty rough start to his season but since he came off the IL he's been pretty vintage.  He's also got a pretty hefty salary this season, so you could probably get a deal done without absurd prospect cost.

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

6 minutes ago, Bertz said:

Sonny Gray had a pretty rough start to his season but since he came off the IL he's been pretty vintage.  He's also got a pretty hefty salary this season, so you could probably get a deal done without absurd prospect cost.

Yeah, this one is a no brainer

[Bull]

3 minutes ago, mul21 said:

Top 6 at 5 spots and top 10 at 6 seems good no?  It's almost like having pitching that can carry you through offensive slumps is as important as having an offense that can bail you out when the pitching isn't as good as expected on a particular day.

I’m guessing this is using WAR. Others have highlighted better than I am able to the valuation of defense there. So maybe not as impressive as it sounds. Or keep that valuation in mind when you look at pitching. in that case it matters what kind of WAR you’re using. FWAR is fielding independent, bWAR uses runs/9 or something. 
 

If that’s bWAR, how bad is this pitching!?

I’m guessing it’s fWAR, and the pitching plays better because of defense.

 

[squally1313]

2 minutes ago, Bull said:

I’m guessing this is using WAR. Others have highlighted better than I am able to the valuation of defense there. So maybe not as impressive as it sounds. Or keep that valuation in mind when you look at pitching. in that case it matters what kind of WAR you’re using. FWAR is fielding independent, bWAR uses runs/9 or something. 
 

If that’s bWAR, how bad is this pitching!?

I’m guessing it’s fWAR, and the pitching plays better because of defense.

 

It is fWAR. Purely wRC:

• Catcher: 6th
• 1B: 8th
• 2B: 5th
• SS: 17th
• 3B: 24th
• LF: 6th
• CF; 7th
• RF: 3rd
• Total outfield: 2nd
• DH: 19th

I find the baseballreference interface atrocious, so if there's even an option to pull down their version of pitching WAR, I have no idea how to do it. Cubs are 12th in ERA over that stretch (and have the 2nd lowest BABIP), so, to your point, they're getting some defensive benefit. 

[PeanutPunch33]

4 hours ago, mul21 said:

I think most would agree with you.  The people focusing on adding bats are a bit puzzling to me because those guys have mostly proven records and will regress to the mean and be fine.  The pitching has been sub par for years now and all the injuries are only making it worse.

Well the Cubs are missing like 4 starting pitchers due to injuries and Brown is starting to look like a guy.  Is this rotation really that bad when everyone is healthy?  On top of that, they just swung a massive trade in the off-season for this supposedly great pitcher and it hasn't panned out (yet).

It's time for Jed to consider alternative ways to improve the team or at least be open minded to it.  Prime Jacob DeGrom isn't going to help this team hit better with guys in RISP or put one in the seats in the 8th inning when the team needs a big hit.  

Personally doesn't make sense to me why this team would pay an arm and a leg for another SP when this offense looks like it will barely be able to score 2 runs a game in October, always assuming they can even get there.  

Edited 20 hours ago by PeanutPunch33

[Rcal10]

4 minutes ago, PeanutPunch33 said:

Well the Cubs are missing like 4 starting pitchers due to injuries and Brown is starting to look like a guy.  Is this rotation really that bad when everyone is healthy?  On top of that, they just swung a massive trade in the off-season for this supposedly great pitcher and it hasn't panned out (yet).

It's time for Jed to consider alternative ways to improve the team or at least be open minded to it.  Prime Jacob DeGrom isn't going to help this team hit better with guys in RISP or put one in the seats in the 8th inning when the team needs a big hit.  

Personally doesn't make sense to me why this team would pay an arm and a leg for another SP when this offense looks like it will barely be able to score 2 runs a game in October, always assuming they can even get there.  

Who is going to fix the offense. Who is available and 100% certain to be better than anyone they currently have in their line up? I can answer that. NO ONE. Not even Greene. If they make the playoffs and slump they won’t win. If they play to their capabilities they have enough offense. They need pitching. 

[squally1313]

The Cubs are third in baseball in runs scored since the beginning of last year. We have the 8th highest wRC with RISP. In high leverage situations it's 5th. You keep making up problems that just don't exist over an actually appropriate sample size. 

[PeanutPunch33]

2 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

Who is going to fix the offense. Who is available and 100% certain to be better than anyone they currently have in their line up? I can answer that. NO ONE. Not even Greene. If they make the playoffs and slump they won’t win. If they play to their capabilities they have enough offense. They need pitching. 

By that logic, what's the point of ever making a move for a position player?  There isn't an Aaron Judge that's going to be available any time soon, so they have to take a chance on a younger or more unproven player that can develop into a future star.  

The Mariners have probably the best rotation in baseball.  5 deep.  Yet, they still stink this year.  This team values pitching and defense too much at the expense of pure offense and slugging.  There has to be a more balanced approach.  

[PeanutPunch33]

1 minute ago, squally1313 said:

The Cubs are third in baseball in runs scored since the beginning of last year. We have the 8th highest wRC with RISP. In high leverage situations it's 5th. You keep making up problems that just don't exist over an actually appropriate sample size. 

And you are intentionally using a time frame where Kyle Tucker was playing as an MVP candidate here, to mask how mediocre this offense is.  2024 and 2026 are more appropriate reference points.  They missed the playoffs in 2024 and might miss the playoffs this year.  

[mul21]

1 minute ago, PeanutPunch33 said:

Well the Cubs are missing like 4 starting pitchers due to injuries and Brown is starting to look like a guy.  Is this rotation really that bad when everyone is healthy?  On top of that, they just swung a massive trade in the off-season for this supposedly great pitcher and it hasn't panned out (yet).

It's time for Jed to consider alternative ways to improve the team or at least be open minded to it.  Prime Jacob DeGrom isn't going to help this team hit better with guys in RISP or put one in the seats in the 8th inning when the team needs a big hit.  

A. Yes. The numbers tell the story dating to last year with mostly the same guys.  B. When will everyone be healthy?

[Bertz]

How is 1st in defense and 6th in runs scored not balanced?

[PeanutPunch33]

I don't see why this has to be an "either/or" btw.  Go and get a pitcher and get a hitter.  I want to watch better baseball and there are many holes on this team beyond the rotation. 

[squally1313]

2 minutes ago, PeanutPunch33 said:

And you are intentionally using a time frame where Kyle Tucker was playing as an MVP candidate here, to mask how mediocre this offense is.  2024 and 2026 are more appropriate reference points.  They missed the playoffs in 2024 and might miss the playoffs this year.  

The Cubs are 6th in runs this year. They are 6th in wOBA. They are 7th in xwOBA. They are 6th in wRC. 

Kyle Tucker has taken 7% of the Cubs PAs since the beginning of 2025. If you think his whopping 136 wRC in 7% of the plate appearances is propping up an otherwise bad offense, I don't really know what to tell you, math wise. 

 

[mul21]

7 minutes ago, PeanutPunch33 said:

And you are intentionally using a time frame where Kyle Tucker was playing as an MVP candidate here, to mask how mediocre this offense is.  2024 and 2026 are more appropriate reference points.  They missed the playoffs in 2024 and might miss the playoffs this year.  

They were 11th in position player WAR and 23rd in pitcher WAR in 2024.  You're not going to win this argument.  The pitching is, and has been, a bigger problem and even to the point you made, it's been propped up by defense significantly or it would be even worse.

[NorthsideAvenger]

I just saw the ERA's of Cubs starters this month and 🤮.

[squally1313]

Since the beginning of 2025, here is the list of Cubs players who have gotten at least 200 PAs and have been above average hitters (wRC>100), besides Kyle Tucker

1. Busch (134)
2. Happ (120)
3. Suzuki (119)
4. Kelly (115)
5. Amaya (115)
6. Ballesteros (115)
7. PCA (108)
8. Hoerner (107)
9. Bregman (103)

Here are the below average hitters with over 200 PAs:

1. Dansby (95)
2. Shaw (93)

If you sort by PAs, 10 of the top 12 hitters are above average. This is all, as noted, completely setting aside how good defensively the group collectively is.