Bagent exposure in primetime, Bears are 10 point dogs to Chargers

[Hairyducked Idiot]

 

Watch the play that starts at 9:35.

The play call is a screen.

The defense blitzes. The blitz defeats the screen easily.

The protection does not block the blitz well and there's pressure instantly.

Does our undrafted rookie QB in his first start throw the screen anyway for a incomplete, loss, or worse?  

Does he eat the sack? Fumble? Get hurt?

No. He instantly reads all this and throws the hot slant baked into the play.  Which is actually reasonably well covered but he beats the coverage with a hard, accurate throw to leverage.

Hot. Damn.  

Maybe next week defenses adjust to all this and force him to throw downfield, resulting in more air punt interceptions and it all falls apart for him.  Maybe they find some tricky fake looks and induce him to make bad throws, or they start jumping some of these routes.

But this is the kind of operation we need from the next QB we bring in, and we need to keep bringing in new ones until we get it.

[We Got The Whole 9]

I know the gameplan limited the impact he could have but damn our rookie RT handled Crosby really well with one arm, Technician.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

10 hours ago, jersey cubs fan said:

It’s not like Fields has never had back to back decent games. He just came off two quite good ones. 

I will remind you that in one of those two good games, the Broncos defense adjusted to what Fields was doing and the end of the game became an absolutely miserable affair for the offense.

Playing with a lead in the second half against the Raiders, the Bears offense put up drives of 8:16, 6:29 and then finally 0:52 (but forced LV to use all their timeouts) before they knelt out the clock.  During that second half, the Bears offense committed no turnovers and only one play of negative yardage: a -1 yard run early in the third.

Playing with the lead against Denver, the Bears started with a drive of 7:26.  Then they went 1:04 and 2:21 (fumble-6 from Fields), allowing Denver to tie the game, and then finally lost their last chance to salvage it with a Fields interception.

Fields "good" game involved a rather spectacular 4th-quarter pants-pooping in which he failed to do the "easy" thing that Bagent did:  Take easy plays and control the clock. 

 

[jersey cubs fan]

If bagent did what fields did in that game chicago would be orgasmic 

[Hairyducked Idiot]

36 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

If bagent did what fields did in that game chicago would be orgasmic 

Probably, but I dunno if "Chicago sports fans get orgasmic" is a metric I'm gonna plant my flag on 

 

[minnesotacubsfan]

11 minutes ago, Hairyducked Idiot said:

Probably, but I dunno if "Chicago sports fans get orgasmic" is a metric I'm gonna plant my flag on 

 

all you would have to do is go back and look at your own doom-boner posts to understand it, and we have nearly a decade of them

Edited October 25, 2023 by minnesotacubsfan

[minnesotacubsfan]

2 hours ago, Hairyducked Idiot said:

Bagent did:  Take easy plays and control the clock. 

 

the guy cant throw a horsefeathers hail mary

 

HELLO MCFLY!!??

 

 

 

 

[Old Style]

 

This is your savior? Lol. 

[jersey cubs fan]

16 minutes ago, Old Style said:

 

This is your savior? Lol. 

Kyle watched tape, plus a YouTube video. He did his research. 

[Hairyducked Idiot]

7 minutes ago, jersey cubs fan said:

Kyle watched tape, plus a YouTube video. He did his research. 

And I said that he needs to show he can throw the ball down the field. He tried exactly three times in the Vikings game iirc.  One was a hospital floater that almost got Moore killed, one was underthrown by 10 yards and got a PI, and one was the worst air punt I've ever seen..

I expect the Chargers to come out jumping routes like crazy next week, and if he can't punish that by hitting passes in the 15-25 yard intermediate zone (and make the throws from the pocket to the outside, not just when rolling out) then it will all fall apart fast.

I like him more as a proof of concept than as a savior, showing how dysfunctional the QB makes the offense look and not the other way around.

But in the meantime, as far as AirY/A, I"m not exactly going crazy over a stat that can't tell the difference between Mahomes (4.0 AirY/A for the season), Gardner Minshew (3.9) and Justin Fields (4.0).

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I will also note that Fields himself has three games this season with an AirY/A of under 3.0:  2.5 vs GB, 2.9 vs KC and 2.8 vs MIN

[UMFan83]

1 hour ago, Hairyducked Idiot said:

I will also note that Fields himself has three games this season with an AirY/A of under 3.0:  2.5 vs GB, 2.9 vs KC and 2.8 vs MIN

Seems more of a function of Getsy calling plays than Fields unable to make the throws though.  We know Fields can make the throws, if he sees them and actually pulls the trigger he is has been very efficient with the down field throws (I think), but since he can't be trusted to pull the trigger either due to processing time or a bad line Getsy has to call quick screens and other short plays to generate offense.  With Bagent, we simply do not know if he can effectively throw downfield.

Anyways you know all this, just rationalizing why Bagents AirY/A matters and Fields' doesnt.

[jersey cubs fan]

Today in completely unnecessary sports writing:

 

[jersey cubs fan]

I don’t pay much attention to which writers are the biggest jock sniffers and which carry the water for management. But this is just silly on a bunch of levels. The bears suck. This season has been nothing short of a disaster. Last year was terrible. Eberflus has been awful. I don’t care what nicknames he gives guys to keep it light. 

[raw]

1 hour ago, jersey cubs fan said:

I don’t pay much attention to which writers are the biggest jock sniffers and which carry the water for management. But this is just silly on a bunch of levels. The bears suck. This season has been nothing short of a disaster. Last year was terrible. Eberflus has been awful. I don’t care what nicknames he gives guys to keep it light. 

They've won 2 out of 3!

 

****Pay no attention to the losing streak behind the curtain.

[BigbadB]

Bagent was starting with 2 backup OLinemen starting and one of the best DE's in the game. I would have fully expected Bagent's air yards to be one of the lowest in the league. He had to have training wheels on just because of his NFL experience and such an iffy pass protection. With that said, I thought he was excellent at not freaking out and taking sacks when the pressure closed in. They will probably have to take the training wheels off this week if Bosa and Mack are playing, because those guys will expose this OLine even more. They will need to design more plays that are closer to the first down marker. Using all of those receivers last week makes it a bit harder for the Chargers to scheme the offense. The Raiders seemed to try to take Moore out of the equation more last week, but Moore might be the guy Bagent needs to target heavily this week and just let his legs bail out the offense. 

 

[jumbo]

21 hours ago, raw said:

Fields probably isn't capable of that same Bagent gameplan. But he also shouldn't be. You'd be completely neutering Fields with that type of gameplan, whereas that's all Bagent projects to be able to do. 

But yeah, there's the floor/ceiling thing with Fields. Vs. Washington, he passed for 120 yards more than Bagent last week, but also doubled his rushing total and his offense put up 17 more points. Then we saw pressure completely destroy what he wanted to do and they couldn't beat an otherwise mediocre defensive team that put up 12 offensive points. And as was said, the frequency that these type of games happen is the biggest issue.

But we also can't act like Bagent's style of play can consistently win you games at the NFL level. You have to be able to threaten the defense down the field. 

The hard part for me with the Minnesota game is that Fields wasn't able to pull off the quick game at all. And that's one of the few ways out against the blitz heavy gameplan. 

I agree with your point that Fields is at his best when he's pushing the ball down the field. But when Minnesota's heavy blitz took that away he couldn't execute at all. 

Bagent can't do what Fields is good at. Fields can't do what Bagent is good at. I've seen lots of quotes asking for Bagent's processing in Fields body. Hard to disagree with that, but let's see how we feel after the Chargers game. 

[jumbo]

27 minutes ago, BigbadB said:

Bagent was starting with 2 backup OLinemen starting and one of the best DE's in the game. I would have fully expected Bagent's air yards to be one of the lowest in the league. He had to have training wheels on just because of his NFL experience and such an iffy pass protection. With that said, I thought he was excellent at not freaking out and taking sacks when the pressure closed in. They will probably have to take the training wheels off this week if Bosa and Mack are playing, because those guys will expose this OLine even more. They will need to design more plays that are closer to the first down marker. Using all of those receivers last week makes it a bit harder for the Chargers to scheme the offense. The Raiders seemed to try to take Moore out of the equation more last week, but Moore might be the guy Bagent needs to target heavily this week and just let his legs bail out the offense. 

 

I saw a clip by Schmitz, I think, full of plays with Darnell holding his left arm against his body and relying completely on his right arm. He would bring up his left when Crosby tried inside, but it was pretty obvious that he was trying to operate without using his left arm. Pretty tough dude and an admirable performance given his injury while facing Crosby, and even #9, the rookie with a bull rush. Spacing on his name 

[raw]

2 hours ago, BigbadB said:

Bagent was starting with 2 backup OLinemen starting and one of the best DE's in the game. I would have fully expected Bagent's air yards to be one of the lowest in the league. He had to have training wheels on just because of his NFL experience and such an iffy pass protection. With that said, I thought he was excellent at not freaking out and taking sacks when the pressure closed in. They will probably have to take the training wheels off this week if Bosa and Mack are playing, because those guys will expose this OLine even more. They will need to design more plays that are closer to the first down marker. Using all of those receivers last week makes it a bit harder for the Chargers to scheme the offense. The Raiders seemed to try to take Moore out of the equation more last week, but Moore might be the guy Bagent needs to target heavily this week and just let his legs bail out the offense. 

 

That may just be Bagent's game. Like Kyle said, he did try to go downfield vs. Minnesota and it was wildly unsuccessful for the most part. So unsuccessful that the team didn't even put him on the field for a Hail Mary attempt. It's hard to say that those were training wheels. In fact, Bagent said publicly to the media that he didn't want any restrictions and that he could run the whole playbook.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

He doesn't have to start throwing 50 yard go routes.

But he will soon, probably immediately, have to prove he can punish corners who try to jump the short routes by hitting throws 15-20 yards down the sideline from the pocket.  Something kinda like a slightly longer version of the one he tried to hit Scott on against Minnesota (which according to one of those QB school videos was the wrong read but not a terrible throw).

 

[Outshined_One]

I hate how this team is just an extended version of Groundhog Day at the QB position.  The team drafts a promising young QB in the first round with questionable decision-making skills to go along with physical talent, only for said QB to regress and frequently crap the bed in meaningful situations, and then a noodle-armed unheralded backup comes along and appears mildly competent, yet unable to throw the ball longer than 15 yards without an empty pocket and a running start.

I'd love for Bagent to show out and demonstrate he has the in-game arm strength to be a good quality starting QB in the NFL, but we've seen this story so many times over the last 25 years.

[minnesotacubsfan]

narrators voice: Bagent in fact did turn out to suck ,and after leaving Chicago, Fields turned around his career in Atlanta

[jersey cubs fan]

37 minutes ago, minnesotacubsfan said:

narrators voice: Bagent in fact did turn out to suck ,and after leaving Chicago, Fields turned around his career in Atlanta

The groundhogs day phenomenon tells us he won’t turn his career around elsewhere. 

[gflore34]

38 minutes ago, minnesotacubsfan said:

narrators voice: Bagent in fact did turn out to suck ,and after leaving Chicago, Fields turned around his career in Atlanta

This means one of Williams, Maye, McCarthy, etc. is the Bears QB and Bagent is the backup.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

It's fascinating to me how much "Bust QBs put it together for a second team" just isn't really a thing.  Alex Smith hung around the 49ers forever, started to be ok, then went to KC and was pretty good.  Before that you have to go back to like Steve Young?