Bears Week 6 vs Vikings, Noon CT, FOX

[Wilson A2000]

35 minutes ago, Brian707 said:

Oh yes, and that 2011 team was on the verge of great things.  7-3 and rolling along, Cutler decides to make a tackle on an interception 

Bad Soldier Field turf made Knox fall down and Cutler intercepted if I remember correctly 

[BigSlick]

Which play did Fields get hurt on? I want to calibrate my judgment of how poorly he played while knowing when he got hurt

[jersey cubs fan]

2 hours ago, UMFan83 said:

Didn’t Jay Cutler miss like 2 months with a dislocated thumb?  I’m guessing we really don’t know the severity until the MRI. 

Cutler broke his thumb

[Bobson Dugnutt]

Bagent v. Hoyer should be thrilling.

[UMFan83]

I always find the concept of QB-WR chemistry to be interesting.  It took a while for Fields to feel comfortable looking for Moore and finding where to give the ball to him and when he did Moore blew up for 2 weeks before a regression yesterday.  Tyler Scott had 5 targets this year in 5 games and was an afterthought in the offense.  Fields did give him a target yesterday, but when Bagent, who has likely thrown to Scott quite a bit in practice, came into the game he threw to Scott 4 times in 1.5 quarters, catching 2 of them for 12 years and drawing a huge ~40 yard PI call in the Bears only TD drive in the game.  Not saying we should be throwing to Scott more necessarily but it makes me think when you are wondering why a rookie WR has not done much it could be just that the QB is simply not looking his way.

Edit: Should also mention that Bagent also gave Velus his first target of the season, but I don't think Velus has run many routes this year either way. 

Edited October 16, 2023 by UMFan83

[Hairyducked Idiot]

This is what I was worried about with fields' big games.  You found something that worked and then ran it again five days later in the short week.  What happens when defenses had time to adapt and forced you to do something else?

You have to be good at a few different things because NFL defenses are pretty good at taking one thing away and forcing you to do something else.

Whenever he sees the field again, whether it be next week or next month, maybe he can adapt.  I'm not optimistic but I won't rule it out.

I only like Bagent for giving a demonstration of what an actual NFL dropback and release should look like.  I don't actually want him to be anything more than a backup long-term and he's barely got the arm for that.

 

The defense low-key had an acceptable game 

 

[UMFan83]

If Fields misses 3-4 weeks, I'm not sure if his Bears career can be salvaged unless he comes back and demonstrates conclusively that he's an elite QB for the rest of the season.

If the Bears go 0-4 or 1-3 in his absence, they are going to be right in the thick of the number 1 pick discussion.  If the Panthers continue to be the worst team in the league they'll be in that same discussion.  If the Bears are 1-9 or 2-8, Flus's time will be pretty much over and they will be looking for a reset.  Fields has shown flashes of being a great QB, but not nearly consistently enough to feel comfortable moving forward with him.  He has also missed time in all 3 of his seasons due to his style of QB play.  A 1-9 Bears team with likely 2 top 5 picks in the one of the deepest QB classes in years (apparently) is not going to commit to Fields for next year much less long term.

I know all of this is obvious to most, but just spelling out how this injury to Fields is probably the beginning of the end.

[jersey cubs fan]

5 minutes ago, UMFan83 said:

If Fields misses 3-4 weeks, I'm not sure if his Bears career can be salvaged unless he comes back and demonstrates conclusively that he's an elite QB for the rest of the season.

If the Bears go 0-4 or 1-3 in his absence, they are going to be right in the thick of the number 1 pick discussion.  If the Panthers continue to be the worst team in the league they'll be in that same discussion.  If the Bears are 1-9 or 2-8, Flus's time will be pretty much over and they will be looking for a reset.  Fields has shown flashes of being a great QB, but not nearly consistently enough to feel comfortable moving forward with him.  He has also missed time in all 3 of his seasons due to his style of QB play.  A 1-9 Bears team with likely 2 top 5 picks in the one of the deepest QB classes in years (apparently) is not going to commit to Fields for next year much less long term.

I know all of this is obvious to most, but just spelling out how this injury to Fields is probably the beginning of the end.

They don’t have to commit much to bring back fields next year. He’s due very little money in the final year of his contract. They could end up with 2 high picks but not top two and in that scenario you’re probably better off drafting blue chippers early and a later round qb. Make the team better every year and churn through QBs until you find one. 

[BigSlick]

I'm as low as I've ever been on Fields after yesterday. I was sticking it out even after the first 3 weeks, but even accounting for everything - the bad snaps, the weak blocking, the poor play calling - Fields looked indecisive, football slow, and inaccurate. At a certain point it has to be unacceptable. I'm not totally out on him, but the pendulum has swung from Optimism to Pessimism.  Here's hoping the injury isn't serious enough to take away a significant portion of this season, because the next 11 weeks are crucial for evaluation. 

 

The Bears are the only team - truly the only team in the entire NFL where hitting 100 yards passing is an open question every week. That just can't be the reality in the modern NFL, we're way past that. And somehow this is always the goddamn case for this team. Ugh. 

Edited October 16, 2023 by BigSlick

[Hairyducked Idiot]

If Bagent gets a full start, I would set the o/u on turnovers at 3.5.  He doesn't have the arm to hit the windows he wants to hit against NFL ones.

 

I'd set it higher if it wasn't for the likelihood they rein him in after the first couple of picks.

 

Switching from fields to him is like switching from driving into a ditch to driving into oncoming traffic 

[CubinNY]

What is sports talk saying? also, I like Goony's idea of plugging away until they find a usable guy. I don't think Fields is that guy.

[UMFan83]

1 minute ago, Hairyducked Idiot said:

If Bagent gets a full start, I would set the o/u on turnovers at 3.5.  He doesn't have the arm to hit the windows he wants to hit against NFL ones.

 

I'd set it higher if it wasn't for the likelihood they rein him in after the first couple of picks.

 

Switching from fields to him is like switching from driving into a ditch to driving into oncoming traffic 

I've read the scouting reports and they all mention strong arm strength (not elite, but above average NFL arm strength) but his throws looked like they had noticeably less zip than the ones I've seen from Fields.  But his accuracy and ball placement were considered weaknesses for him and that's a huge problem if he can't fix it.  His ceiling is serviceable NFL backup and that's fine.

[CubinNY]

56 minutes ago, BigSlick said:

I'm as low as I've ever been on Fields after yesterday. I was sticking it out even after the first 3 weeks, but even accounting for everything - the bad snaps, the weak blocking, the poor play calling - Fields looked indecisive, football slow, and inaccurate. At a certain point it has to be unacceptable. I'm not totally out on him, but the pendulum has swung from Optimism to Pessimism.  Here's hoping the injury isn't serious enough to take away a significant portion of this season, because the next 11 weeks are crucial for evaluation. 

 

The Bears are the only team - truly the only team in the entire NFL where hitting 100 yards passing is an open question every week. That just can't be the reality in the modern NFL, we're way past that. And somehow this is always the goddamn case for this team. Ugh. 

I listened to the first half of the Philly/Jets game on my way back home from the airport. Philly had 4 runs and the rest passes in the first half. All those runs were QB scrambles.  

Edited October 16, 2023 by CubinNY

[Brian707]

10 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

What is sports talk saying? also, I like Goony's idea of plugging away until they find a usable guy. I don't think Fields is that guy.

Mainly this is probably the beginning of the end for FIelds and they want Eberflus gone. He is horrible, they had 3 extra days off and they were unprepared like with the GB game.

Also why lie again? This time with Whitehair, claiming he wasn't benched because of poor snaps. This was just from 1130-1230 today when I listened.

Edited October 16, 2023 by Brian707

[BigSlick]

By the way, it's so Bears that the week when momentum has really moved towards using that 1st overall pick on a QB, a guy people have been raving about and saying things about how he's a generational talent....he goes and has a terrible game 

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I said this was a tipping point game and boy was it.  If fields is out for any real length of time, then going 1-2 with Carolina goes from a tunny dream scenario to shockingly plausible 

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Bears are hoping fields can avoid surgery and waiting for the swelling to go down to assess the severity.  "Doubtful" for next week.

 

[Outshined_One]

1 hour ago, jersey cubs fan said:

They don’t have to commit much to bring back fields next year. He’s due very little money in the final year of his contract. They could end up with 2 high picks but not top two and in that scenario you’re probably better off drafting blue chippers early and a later round qb. Make the team better every year and churn through QBs until you find one. 

I'm pretty much fine with the Bears exercising Fields' fifth year option and bringing him back in 2024 regardless of how this season goes. Even if he sucks, he can either be a backup or he can be a placeholder.

The idea of a later round QB, on the other hand, has no appeal to me as anything other than a lottery ticket. If Fields gets his act together and can be a competent starter for the remainder of 2023, fine, go for it. However, if he continues to stink, my preference would be to get his replacement with one of their first round picks, especially since the upcoming FA class is not pretty.

[CubinNY]

7 minutes ago, Outshined_One said:

I'm pretty much fine with the Bears exercising Fields' fifth year option and bringing him back in 2024 regardless of how this season goes. Even if he sucks, he can either be a backup or he can be a placeholder.

The idea of a later round QB, on the other hand, has no appeal to me as anything other than a lottery ticket. If Fields gets his act together and can be a competent starter for the remainder of 2023, fine, go for it. However, if he continues to stink, my preference would be to get his replacement with one of their first round picks, especially since the upcoming FA class is not pretty.

Fields is not getting his act together. He hasn't had it together since he was in Columbus playing second-tier BCS schools. Poor coaching is probably to blame. I think fans have to hope they tank hard at this point and are in line for a top pick. If not I wouldn't spend a 1st rounder on a QB. Not that I would spend a late round of one either. The best case is they fire the lot of the coaching staff and find someone who can get the most out of Fields or a tippy top QB in the draft.  But the staff HAS to go. 

[Tryptamine]

I feel like this team has so much more talent than we've seen. It's not elite levels of talent, but it's certainly more than this dumpster fire they've shown to be so far. 

[BigSlick]

34 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

Fields is not getting his act together. He hasn't had it together since he was in Columbus playing second-tier BCS schools. Poor coaching is probably to blame. I think fans have to hope they tank hard at this point and are in line for a top pick. If not I wouldn't spend a 1st rounder on a QB. Not that I would spend a late round of one either. The best case is they fire the lot of the coaching staff and find someone who can get the most out of Fields or a tippy top QB in the draft.  But the staff HAS to go. 

We don't have to hope they tank, they're tanking. They're going to have two first round picks in the top 5 picks of the draft. 

 

I'm not super enthused about keeping Fields and having him start in front of a top QB pick like Williams because the vibes....will be all sorts of off there. What do you do if Fields has a pretty good season? Ideally this is a smart move - if we're talking cold calculations of talent and resources, but dealing with actual human beings...I dunno. You probably still have to do it, though. 

 

The worst option to me though is hoping some later round QB hits, eventually. Thats just not a way to get an elite QB talent. 

Edited October 16, 2023 by BigSlick

[UMFan83]

40 minutes ago, CubinNY said:

Fields is not getting his act together. He hasn't had it together since he was in Columbus playing second-tier BCS schools. Poor coaching is probably to blame. I think fans have to hope they tank hard at this point and are in line for a top pick. If not I wouldn't spend a 1st rounder on a QB. Not that I would spend a late round of one either. The best case is they fire the lot of the coaching staff and find someone who can get the most out of Fields or a tippy top QB in the draft.  But the staff HAS to go. 

Thats a little harsh since he lit up Clemson in the CFP for 6 TDs on busted ribs.  But yeah obviously there's still a big difference between 2020 Clemson and the NFL.

I'm no expert but I like several of the QBs in this draft and not in a "hey look Will Levis could be something one day" sort of way.  Who knows how many will pan out and who knows where they'll be drafted but I would be willing to bet there's at least 2 franchise QBs in this draft and 1-2 more solid NFL starters with upside.  That depth might actually hurt the Bears if they try to package one of the picks but they'll still be in a very good spot.

[jersey cubs fan]

4 hours ago, Outshined_One said:

I'm pretty much fine with the Bears exercising Fields' fifth year option and bringing him back in 2024 regardless of how this season goes. Even if he sucks, he can either be a backup or he can be a placeholder.

The idea of a later round QB, on the other hand, has no appeal to me as anything other than a lottery ticket. If Fields gets his act together and can be a competent starter for the remainder of 2023, fine, go for it. However, if he continues to stink, my preference would be to get his replacement with one of their first round picks, especially since the upcoming FA class is not pretty.

They don’t have to exercise his 5th year option. He’s under contract for 2024. If they don’t get the top guy in the draft, whoever they do get can compete with Fields.

I prefer QBs start as backups. Probably half the first round flameouts turn to crap because of circumstances rather than ability. Make the team better. Don’t force QBs to carry your team until they are established stars. 

[Hairyducked Idiot]

If you want a placeholder QB while a rookie sits, then bring in a veteran.  You can't subject your team to Justin Fields if you aren't dreaming on his ceiling.

[raw]

Yeah, the thing about this season being such a disaster, I don't really think you can bring back Fields and give him a 3rd offense in 4 years. It's either Fields is 100% sure the guy (and you probably have to suck it up with the current staff), or you have to move on from him along with the coaches. Whether they pick 1 or not, they are going to pick very high in this draft, and probably twice. Hopefully, this will be the highest they pick for the foreseeable future so you gotta take a QB. Whether it's Williams, Maye or you have to trade down a few picks and take a McCarthy, you can't pass up on the top QB prospects with what could very well be 3 different top 5 picks.