2015 Rotation

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

Sounds like what was said about CC Sabathia. And Dan Haren. Also Jake Peavy, Mark Buehrle, Roy Oswalt and Josh Beckett, and to lesser extents, AJ Burnett, CJ Wilson, John Lackey, Livan Hernandez, Brad Penny, etc.

[TruffleShuffle]

The rumor Mooney mentioned was Castro/Wheeler. Which I wouldn't feel comfortable with, but would understand it, I guess.

 

Wheeler is electric, but he's one injury away from setting the franchise back a bit after losing Castro. I think it makes sense for both sides to fill their holes through free agency. There are plenty of starting pitchers and shorstops available for only money this winter. Lester, Scherzer, Shields, Liriano, Maeda, etc for us and Hardy, Lowry, Hanley for them. Makes more sense for each organization than giving up Starlin and Wheeler.

 

They are available for "only money," but in the case of some of those names it will be a [expletive] load of money (like 25% of the Cubs' present payroll capacity), so if someone like Scherzer or Lester signs and then blows out his elbow or shoulder, that's a pretty big problem.

[davell]

The rumor Mooney mentioned was Castro/Wheeler. Which I wouldn't feel comfortable with, but would understand it, I guess.

 

Wheeler is electric, but he's one injury away from setting the franchise back a bit after losing Castro. I think it makes sense for both sides to fill their holes through free agency. There are plenty of starting pitchers and shorstops available for only money this winter. Lester, Scherzer, Shields, Liriano, Maeda, etc for us and Hardy, Lowry, Hanley for them. Makes more sense for each organization than giving up Starlin and Wheeler.

 

They are available for "only money," but in the case of some of those names it will be a [expletive] load of money (like 25% of the Cubs' present payroll capacity), so if someone like Scherzer or Lester signs and then blows out his elbow or shoulder, that's a pretty big problem.

 

Our lineup may already be set though. What else is there to spend it on? We damn near HAVE to take a shot on an older ace to even get our payroll past 80 mill this year, unless we Hendry the [expletive] out of the offseason, squandering 10 mill on backup position players, 10 mill on the pen, and get 2 guys who are starters for 10 mill or so. And that's not at all what I see happening.

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

http://photos.vanityfair.com/2014/08/17/53f106809b1e228549e7ba55_bb-yeah-science.gif

I don't know what that means, pig [expletive]

[Sammy Sofa]

Watch better shows than your dragon nonsense.

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

Sounds like what was said about CC Sabathia. And Dan Haren. Also Jake Peavy, Mark Buehrle, Roy Oswalt and Josh Beckett, and to lesser extents, AJ Burnett, CJ Wilson, John Lackey, Livan Hernandez, Brad Penny, etc.

Glavine and Maddux, Glavine's probably a better comp, numbers-wise, but both thrived on velocity change, like Hamels.

[Sammy Sofa]

Let's discuss other pitchers and see if we find some others people WOULD be willing to trade Castro for. Like others here, I wouldn't be opposed to moving him for the right pitcher; just not old-ass Hamels.

[SABR Gamer]

Let's discuss other pitchers and see if we find some others people WOULD be willing to trade Castro for. Like others here, I wouldn't be opposed to moving him for the right pitcher; just not old-ass Hamels.

 

Exactly.

[Cubswin11]

I seriously would rather trade him for Harvey or Fernandez and roll the dice they come back from TJS than trade him for Hamels with his contract and likely impending decline.

[Guest]

Watch better shows than your dragon nonsense.

 

the show sucks ass, pig [expletive]. it's a [expletive] book series.

[Sammy Sofa]

Yeah, I hear it's along the lines of that Outlander series.

[davell]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

[seanimal]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

yeah, he's not really anything close to an ideal piece in a castro trade

[Guest]

Yeah, I hear it's along the lines of that Outlander series.

Ok that was pretty good. Essentially because i forced myself to watch the first episode of that show even after the opening credits made it look unwatchable.

[rawaction]

I seriously would rather trade him for Harvey or Fernandez and roll the dice they come back from TJS than trade him for Hamels with his contract and likely impending decline.

 

Fernandez probably. Not sure about Harvey. Definitely rather do a deal like that than a Hamels deal though. The Cubs are probably going to trade Castro at some point. They probably aren't going to get full value for him. And it will suck when that happens, but it shouldn't happen this offseason.

[Guest]

I seriously would rather trade him for Harvey or Fernandez and roll the dice they come back from TJS than trade him for Hamels with his contract and likely impending decline.

 

Fernandez probably. Not sure about Harvey. Definitely rather do a deal like that than a Hamels deal though. The Cubs are probably going to trade Castro at some point. They probably aren't going to get full value for him. And it will suck when that happens, but it shouldn't happen this offseason.

They could never get full value for him because he is the most valuable player in baseball. People here wouldn't trade him for Kershaw.

[SouthSideRyan]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

That's 4 years of control. How long do you expect a trade acquisition to be signed for?

[KingCubsFan]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

That's 4 years of control. How long do you expect a trade acquisition to be signed for?

Isn't he a free agent after 2017? You'd be getting three years, one of which would be a rehab year coming back from TJS.

[rawaction]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

That's 4 years of control. How long do you expect a trade acquisition to be signed for?

Isn't he a free agent after 2017? You'd be getting three years, one of which would be a rehab year coming back from TJS.

 

After 2018. And he may come back this year. He should be back to 100% by midseason next year.

[SouthSideRyan]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

That's 4 years of control. How long do you expect a trade acquisition to be signed for?

Isn't he a free agent after 2017? You'd be getting three years, one of which would be a rehab year coming back from TJS.

 

2018, and I'm not saying I expect him to pitch in 2013 form next year, but calling it a rehab year seems to be selling him pretty short.

[davell]

FWIW, Harvey hits arb next year, has Boras as his agent and almost definitely is hitting FA.

 

With him coming off TJS next year, he's far from an ideal guy to trade for.

 

That's 4 years of control. How long do you expect a trade acquisition to be signed for?

 

Crap. Can't read. I'd be fine with 4 years.

[davell]

I still don't think we're going to trade one of those guys though. Alcantara and/or Almora seem to be the most likely to be dealt, in my opinion.

[Guest]

I seriously would rather trade him for Harvey or Fernandez and roll the dice they come back from TJS than trade him for Hamels with his contract and likely impending decline.

 

Fernandez probably. Not sure about Harvey. Definitely rather do a deal like that than a Hamels deal though. The Cubs are probably going to trade Castro at some point. They probably aren't going to get full value for him. And it will suck when that happens, but it shouldn't happen this offseason.

They could never get full value for him because he is the most valuable player in baseball. People here wouldn't trade him for Kershaw.

 

This strawman is absolutely necessary in order for your argument to work at all.

 

Unfortunately, it is a strawman, and it doesn't.

[Guest]

I seriously would rather trade him for Harvey or Fernandez and roll the dice they come back from TJS than trade him for Hamels with his contract and likely impending decline.

 

Fernandez probably. Not sure about Harvey. Definitely rather do a deal like that than a Hamels deal though. The Cubs are probably going to trade Castro at some point. They probably aren't going to get full value for him. And it will suck when that happens, but it shouldn't happen this offseason.

They could never get full value for him because he is the most valuable player in baseball. People here wouldn't trade him for Kershaw.

 

This strawman is absolutely necessary in order for your argument to work at all.

 

Unfortunately, it is a strawman, and it doesn't.

Hey, you guys built him, leave me out of it.

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

Sounds like what was said about CC Sabathia. And Dan Haren. Also Jake Peavy, Mark Buehrle, Roy Oswalt and Josh Beckett, and to lesser extents, AJ Burnett, CJ Wilson, John Lackey, Livan Hernandez, Brad Penny, etc.

Glavine and Maddux, Glavine's probably a better comp, numbers-wise, but both thrived on velocity change, like Hamels.

 

That list is not a list of fireballers. Haren and Buehrle especially never threw any harder than Hamels does, and age came for them just the same. If you want to believe that Hamels is the new Tom Glavine and he's going to age really really gracefully, that's your prerogative, but you probably shouldn't be so shocked that other people think father time is coming for him.