2015 Rotation

[Guest]

This is such a terrible, terrible position, I wish just about anyone else was arguing it.

 

Starlin just homered.

[rocket]

I like how after all these years we just assume our prospects will fill in with no issues

[davell]

The rumor Mooney mentioned was Castro/Wheeler. Which I wouldn't feel comfortable with, but would understand it, I guess.

[Gilby]

The rumor Mooney mentioned was Castro/Wheeler. Which I wouldn't feel comfortable with, but would understand it, I guess.

 

Wheeler is electric, but he's one injury away from setting the franchise back a bit after losing Castro. I think it makes sense for both sides to fill their holes through free agency. There are plenty of starting pitchers and shorstops available for only money this winter. Lester, Scherzer, Shields, Liriano, Maeda, etc for us and Hardy, Lowry, Hanley for them. Makes more sense for each organization than giving up Starlin and Wheeler.

[XZero771679666304]

I like how after all these years we just assume our prospects will fill in with no issues

 

Yeah, the assumption that they can trade Castro and Russell will just slide in and replace or improve upon that production is one of the flaws in Sulley's argument. I mean that's certainly possible, but counting on it at this point is foolishness.

 

Everything that needs to be said (Castro is only 24, great contract, lots of trade value) has been said multiple times now.

[Guest]

Rubio confirms my idea that Hamels and cash for Castro is a very good trade.

 

for the phillies

Man this [expletive] is like the cult of Orton but for Castro. [expletive].

 

Not even remotely. Your opinion of Castro's value is way off.

You have to be kidding me. People generally either way over value him like you, or way undervalue him, (ie he sucks because he doesn't hit 25 home runs a year). Few people get it right, he's a good young player with value that is nearly immediately replaceable.

 

Why do you continue to act like Addison Russell has anything to do with Starlin Castro's trade value?

 

We can replace Castro, sure. But Castro's trade value is for the teams that don't have an Addison Russell in the minors. Most of those teams would be willing to give up something a lot more valuable than a 30+ year old pitcher on a market-value contract.

 

You need to pick a better target for your weird boner. Hell, I'd sooner trade Castro straight up for a guy like Syndergaard than I would for Hamels. And there are even better options out there than him (giving up Castro+ for Stanton is an easy target).

I doubt that there's any pitcher that these crazy cultists would trade Castro for, Kershaw included.

[Guest]

I like how after all these years we just assume our prospects will fill in with no issues

WHY DO YOU HATE RUSSELL? PLEASE STOP DISPARAGING OUR FAVORITE PROSPECT THAT YOU WOULD OTHER WISE HAVE A WET DREAM OVER FOR THE SAKE OF AN ARGUMENT.

[Guest]

Everyone loves him and then when there's an argument to be made Russell is Ronnie [expletive] Cedeno.

[Guest]

[expletive] cultists I spit on your Addison Russell cynicism.

[Cubswin11]

Everyone loves him and then when there's an argument to be made Russell is Ronnie [expletive] Cedeno.

No, everyone still loves him but they seem to understand the odds of him turning into Cedeno (or worse) are probably just as likely as him turning into better than Castro.

[SABR Gamer]

[expletive] cultists I spit on your Addison Russell cynicism.

 

I said I loved Russell in my post.

 

Why does having Russell mean it's okay to accept less than fair value for Castro?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Forget it, he's rolling.

http://www.sondrakistan.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Animal_House_Rolling.jpg

[CyHawk_Cub]

:shrug: I'm not especially tied to Starlin in any way, but I'd just prefer the FO got more than a 30+ yo pitcher w/ a 4 WAR ceiling, with a pitcher's floor of "####ed up shoulder, out of baseball." I highly doubt the Phillies would kick back enough money to make the relative values work out. Go hard after Lester & Shields, except actually land at least one of them. If those guys can't be brought in, then consider trades. JMO.

[bukie]

with a pitcher's floor of "####ed up shoulder, out of baseball."

 

That is every pitcher's floor, and why I wouldn't trade a cost-controlled, 24 year old all star SS for any of them.

[davell]

http://nypost.com/2014/08/17/mets-have-pitching-cubs-hitting-so-why-hasnt-a-deal-happened/

 

Decent Joel Sherman piece, mentioning Mets would have to give up more than a one for one of Wheeler or Syndergaard for Starlin.

[Guest]

with a pitcher's floor of "####ed up shoulder, out of baseball."

 

That is every pitcher's floor, and why I wouldn't trade a cost-controlled, 24 year old all star SS for any of them.

Yep, you wouldn't trade Castro for any [expletive] pitcher in baseball.

 

THAT IS REALLY [expletive] CRAZY

[Guest]

:shrug: I'm not especially tied to Starlin in any way, but I'd just prefer the FO got more than a 30+ yo pitcher w/ a 4 WAR ceiling, with a pitcher's floor of "####ed up shoulder, out of baseball." I highly doubt the Phillies would kick back enough money to make the relative values work out. Go hard after Lester & Shields, except actually land at least one of them. If those guys can't be brought in, then consider trades. JMO.

Fucked up shoulder? He had inflammation a while back. Dude's out pitch is a changeup.

[Guest]

Everyone loves him and then when there's an argument to be made Russell is Ronnie [expletive] Cedeno.

No, everyone still loves him but they seem to understand the odds of him turning into Cedeno (or worse) are probably just as likely as him turning into better than Castro.

Then you really don't love him at all. What the holy [expletive] are you crazy fucks talking about? Is this the land of the idiot apes all of a sudden?

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

[CyHawk_Cub]

:shrug: I'm not especially tied to Starlin in any way, but I'd just prefer the FO got more than a 30+ yo pitcher w/ a 4 WAR ceiling, with a pitcher's floor of "####ed up shoulder, out of baseball." I highly doubt the Phillies would kick back enough money to make the relative values work out. Go hard after Lester & Shields, except actually land at least one of them. If those guys can't be brought in, then consider trades. JMO.

[expletive] up shoulder? He had inflammation a while back. Dude's out pitch is a changeup.

 

He's still a pitcher, at the other side of, or near the end of, his prime. And I don't think it's realistic to think he'd be anything more than a 4 WAR value, at market rates, as others have said. And I was stating a pitcher's floor in general, not just for Hamels.

 

Like I said, I'm not opposed to trading Castro at all. Just not for Hamels.

[Guest]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

http://cdn.thestandard.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/disco-stu.jpg?8c6885

[Guest]

more like: THE GENERALS WERE DUE Edited August 17, 2014 by Stannis

[Guest]

That is to say, don't take all the money you've made franchising your name and bet it against the globetrotters.

[Sammy Sofa]

Cole Hamels turns 31 before Opening Day next year. The last 3 years, guess how many 31+ pitchers reached 10 fWAR(a 3.3 win pace)? One.

He'll be worth 4 this year, just like the 3 before that.

 

http://photos.vanityfair.com/2014/08/17/53f106809b1e228549e7ba55_bb-yeah-science.gif