Yankees Sign Masahiro Tanaka

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I'd rather have an 90-win team full of pre-arb MLB studs and laugh at the teams who need Tanaka as badly as we do. But we don't, so back up the truck.

[imb]

I hope they pay him even MORE than what's being reported.

 

On second glance, it appears it was just tim [expletive] his pants lmao.

 

I say give Tanaka the money, but man, Felix's deal was pretty SEISMIC (/david) when it happened, and it's like one offseason later and more than that is being attached to a guy some scouts are like "yeah he's a good mid-rotation guy."

 

Eh, they kinda have to do it at this point, unfortunately.

 

Oh, I'm not arguing that we dont have to Buffalo Bills it to get these guys to come here. It's what we should have done with Sanchez last offseason. You cant be a 60-win team and offer a guy the same contract as a world series contender and hope for it to work out.

[Cubswin11]

I hope they pay him even MORE than what's being reported.

 

On second glance, it appears it was just tim [expletive] his pants lmao.

 

I say give Tanaka the money, but man, Felix's deal was pretty SEISMIC (/david) when it happened, and it's like one offseason later and more than that is being attached to a guy some scouts are like "yeah he's a good mid-rotation guy."

 

Eh, they kinda have to do it at this point, unfortunately.

 

Oh, I'm not arguing that we dont have to Buffalo Bills it to get these guys to come here. It's what we should have done with Sanchez last offseason. You cant be a 60-win team and offer a guy the same contract as a world series contender and hope for it to work out.

THIS IS PRECISELY WHY WE NEED TO TAKE MOAR FLIERS!!!

[Boris]

Oh my gosh, there are actually fans not wanting to spend [expletive] money now? Good grief.

[imb]

I'm sorry but that thread is killing me

 

Here are a couple different examples:

 

Halladay: 3 yrs / $60M

Cliff Lee: 5 yrs / $120M

 

Both better bets than Felix at 7/$175. It is not impossible to get great players for less than exorbitant prices.

 

Also let's not forget Tim used Clayton Kershaw, still on his rookie contract, as an example of how you can acquire great players without paying them lots of money in an extension.

[SouthSideRyan]

Give him 49% ownership of the team as well.

 

If we sign him to that contract he'll have more money that @poortomricketts. (Getting them in before the tv deal)

[cbbryan]

"Never played in MLB" only bothers me for hitters. It's hard to see how they'll react to better stuff.

 

Tanaka's a pitcher. They know *exactly* how hard he throws, exactly how consistently he hits his location, and exactly how much movement he has on his pitches. I bet they can do a pretty good job of figuring out how that projects in MLB.

 

 

I would agree that a pitcher worries me less, but not that it doesn't bother me at all.

 

Daisuke Matsuzaka was suppose to be a superstar and was underwhelming. There's no way his return value for the Red Sox was anywhere close to the $51M post and $51M the Red Sox have paid in salary since he joined MLB.

 

Is it that far fetched that Tanaka could possibly end the same way. I'm not saying he will, just that the risk is there.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Matsuzaka was exactly as good as advertised until he got hurt. Which is always a risk with pitchers, MLB or not.

[Sammy Sofa]

"Never played in MLB" only bothers me for hitters. It's hard to see how they'll react to better stuff.

 

Tanaka's a pitcher. They know *exactly* how hard he throws, exactly how consistently he hits his location, and exactly how much movement he has on his pitches. I bet they can do a pretty good job of figuring out how that projects in MLB.

 

 

I would agree that a pitcher worries me less, but not that it doesn't bother me at all.

 

Daisuke Matsuzaka was suppose to be a superstar and was underwhelming. There's no way his return value for the Red Sox was anywhere close to the $51M post and $51M the Red Sox have paid in salary since he joined MLB.

 

Is it that far fetched that Tanaka could possibly end the same way. I'm not saying he will, just that the risk is there.

 

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

[imb]

Matsuzaka was flukey as hell that second year. It's likely the injury was already taking it's toll and it just didn't show up in his ERA yet.

[cbbryan]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent.

 

It wouldn't worry me as much if I thought the Cubs would throw money at the problem if it didn't work out the way they hoped. But if he's a bust, I have the feeling the Cubs would allow it to hamper future negotiations. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my fear.

 

And just for the record, I'd love for Tanaka to be a Cub no matter the cost. I'm just worried about what happens to the team as a whole and the approach going forward if Tanaka where to bomb.

[Guest]

That seems like a pretty silly concern considering the exact same guys were in the front office that got burned by Matsuzaka.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Well, it comes down to the same issue: If not him, who?

 

If the development plan doesn't come together like we hope, then we're screwed regardless.

 

If it does, then we'll be full up on offense and mid-roster pitching. If we're going to spend money, it's going to be on a pitcher, and it's going to be a risk that he could armsplode the first day of his first Spring Training.

[Sammy Sofa]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent.

 

It wouldn't worry me as much if I thought the Cubs would throw money at the problem if it didn't work out the way they hoped. But if he's a bust, I have the feeling the Cubs would allow it to hamper future negotiations. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my fear.

 

And just for the record, I'd love for Tanaka to be a Cub no matter the cost. I'm just worried about what happens to the team as a whole and the approach going forward if Tanaka where to bomb.

 

It's just an inherent risk when you sign a big FA, especially a pitcher. The Cubs are in the position where they need to spend to acquire someone like him. He's young, they desperately need starting pitching, they have money to spend, there's this rumored TV deal..it's all good.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

"Never played in MLB" only bothers me for hitters. It's hard to see how they'll react to better stuff.

 

Tanaka's a pitcher. They know *exactly* how hard he throws, exactly how consistently he hits his location, and exactly how much movement he has on his pitches. I bet they can do a pretty good job of figuring out how that projects in MLB.

 

On the other hand, there have been enough pitching busts to make one think maybe that's not true, either.

 

Just pointing it out. Nothing more.

 

Pitching busts as large contracts, or pitching busts coming over from Japan? The former, sure, that's the nature of having to add pitchers externally. The latter, not at all. Even the poster boy for Japanese pitching busts, Dice-K, was a good pitcher that then had an arm injury, which brings us back to the former.

 

Not at all? Hideki Irabu? Kei Igawa?

 

Oh, no. They can happen.

[davell]

If we DO sign Tanaka, I'd love it for two reasons. One, we addressed our biggest need with exactly what we're looking for and two, if we give him a gigantic deal, it means we've got more money to spend soon. Theo is waaaaay too smart to spend a large percentage of the team's future salary on one guy. If he does this, it means he expects to be able to do it again.

[jersey cubs fan]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent. .

 

Yeah, it really destroyed the organization and took them decades to recover.

 

 

 

They didn't lose their ass. That's asinine.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent.

 

It wouldn't worry me as much if I thought the Cubs would throw money at the problem if it didn't work out the way they hoped. But if he's a bust, I have the feeling the Cubs would allow it to hamper future negotiations. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my fear.

 

And just for the record, I'd love for Tanaka to be a Cub no matter the cost. I'm just worried about what happens to the team as a whole and the approach going forward if Tanaka where to bomb.

 

It's just an inherent risk when you sign a big FA, especially a pitcher. The Cubs are in the position where they need to spend to acquire someone like him. He's young, they desperately need starting pitching, they have money to spend, there's this rumored TV deal..it's all good.

 

I agree with this. He's the proper guy to get.

 

However, this board always thinks we should spend whatever it takes to get everybody. But I always try to point out that you can't have everybody, so you better be really happy with the one or two we eventually get. (I know about the Dodgers, we aren't them).

 

So, when people wanted Albert Pujols, that's your ticket. You don't get him and three others the next three years. I really, really don't believe anybody would be happy with Albert and the remainder of his contract just a few years in.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent. .

 

Yeah, it really destroyed the organization and took them decades to recover.

 

 

 

They didn't lose their ass. That's asinine.

 

Somehow we managed to lose our ass on that deal, because it contributed to making Epstein scared of free agency and cost us a bunch of years.

[Boris]

The party is spreading into quantum theory. Everyone is starting to get pumped.

 

http://imgur.com/xexQgqO

[jersey cubs fan]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent.

 

It wouldn't worry me as much if I thought the Cubs would throw money at the problem if it didn't work out the way they hoped. But if he's a bust, I have the feeling the Cubs would allow it to hamper future negotiations. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's my fear.

 

And just for the record, I'd love for Tanaka to be a Cub no matter the cost. I'm just worried about what happens to the team as a whole and the approach going forward if Tanaka where to bomb.

 

It's just an inherent risk when you sign a big FA, especially a pitcher. The Cubs are in the position where they need to spend to acquire someone like him. He's young, they desperately need starting pitching, they have money to spend, there's this rumored TV deal..it's all good.

 

I agree with this. He's the proper guy to get.

 

However, this board always thinks we should spend whatever it takes to get everybody. But I always try to point out that you can't have everybody, so you better be really happy with the one or two we eventually get. (I know about the Dodgers, we aren't them).

 

So, when people wanted Albert Pujols, that's your ticket. You don't get him and three others the next three years. I really, really don't believe anybody would be happy with Albert and the remainder of his contract just a few years in.

Well it sure is good that we have your lone voice of reason to temper our overzealous nature.

[Guest]

"Never played in MLB" only bothers me for hitters. It's hard to see how they'll react to better stuff.

 

Tanaka's a pitcher. They know *exactly* how hard he throws, exactly how consistently he hits his location, and exactly how much movement he has on his pitches. I bet they can do a pretty good job of figuring out how that projects in MLB.

 

On the other hand, there have been enough pitching busts to make one think maybe that's not true, either.

 

Just pointing it out. Nothing more.

 

Pitching busts as large contracts, or pitching busts coming over from Japan? The former, sure, that's the nature of having to add pitchers externally. The latter, not at all. Even the poster boy for Japanese pitching busts, Dice-K, was a good pitcher that then had an arm injury, which brings us back to the former.

 

Not at all? Hideki Irabu? Kei Igawa?

 

Oh, no. They can happen.

 

The fact that you have to go back 7 years to find those examples kind of proves the point. Since then you've had Kuroda, Darvish, Iwakuma, Uehara, Tazawa, even Fujikawa was effective before his arm injury. The offensive environment is very different than it was when Igawa, Irabu, and even Matsuzaka made the jump.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

The thing I'm really interested in, is that while Theo was in Boston they noticed a pattern with Japanese pitchers who had lasted at least four years in MLB. They noticed that of the 13 that pitched more than four seasons, there was a strong decline on average after the the first three years.

 

He obviously knows these facts since he and his guys are the ones that did the research. So, if he wants Tanaka, it must be a good sign that he's really confident in him. I hope.

[Clem Fandango]

Give him 49% ownership of the team as well.

 

If we sign him to that contract he'll have more money that @poortomricketts. (Getting them in before the tv deal)

 

You should probably make @richtomricketts as a contingency if the TV deal goes through and start having twitter wars with @poortomricketts.

[cbbryan]

Matsuzaka was sidelined by injuries. If that's your concern, fine, but to say he was "underwhelming" like he was a bust in terms of performance isn't accurate; he kicked ass his first two years and then got hurt.

 

Injuries are part of my concern, sure. No matter the reason, the BoSox lost their ass on Matsuzaka. A total of 2 quality seasons for more than $102M spent. .

 

Yeah, it really destroyed the organization and took them decades to recover.

 

 

 

They didn't lose their ass. That's asinine.

 

So $102M for 2 seasons is a great investment? It's not about whether the organization was ruined, it's about the return on their investment. They lost their ass because they didn't get a big enough return on a $102M investment.

 

Also, don't ignore the second part of my post that stated it wouldn't bother me so much if I thought it wouldn't affect future spending by the Cubs. In the BoSox situation it didn't, they continued to spend money on big FAs even after the Dice-K deal. Do you think the Cubs, based on past practice, would do the same thing? I certainly don't.