Re: Cubs on verge of signing Lieber

[Bull]

abuck called him somewhat expensive? I think I've read it all now.

 

:lol:

 

Apparently you need to look up salaries of MLB players buddy.

 

it kind of is when you could get equal production for 10% of the cost by giving the job to gallagher.

 

the lieber signing alone isn't going to break the cubs. it doesn't really improve them either. but you combine lieber's 3.5 million with dempster's 5 million, marquis' 6 million, eyre's 4 million, and blanco's 3 million that's around 21-22 million that could be easily replaced by cheaper players and spent on 1 or 2 very good players.

 

jon lieber was a pointless signing. it wasn't a horrible signing that's going to cost the cubs the season, but it's jim hendry's usual pointless signing done for the sole purpose that he doesn't trust rookies to fill less-important jobs.

 

How could you know that?

You know, I could get a good look at a T-Bone steak by sticking my head up a bulls ass, but wouldn't you rather take the butcher's word?[/quote]

 

I love that line!!! May i use it in the future. It is not copyright protected is it?

 

It's from Tommy Boy

[ThePenguin11]

abuck called him somewhat expensive? I think I've read it all now.

 

:lol:

 

Apparently you need to look up salaries of MLB players buddy.

 

it kind of is when you could get equal production for 10% of the cost by giving the job to gallagher.

 

the lieber signing alone isn't going to break the cubs. it doesn't really improve them either. but you combine lieber's 3.5 million with dempster's 5 million, marquis' 6 million, eyre's 4 million, and blanco's 3 million that's around 21-22 million that could be easily replaced by cheaper players and spent on 1 or 2 very good players.

 

jon lieber was a pointless signing. it wasn't a horrible signing that's going to cost the cubs the season, but it's jim hendry's usual pointless signing done for the sole purpose that he doesn't trust rookies to fill less-important jobs.

 

How could you know that?

You know, I could get a good look at a T-Bone steak by sticking my head up a bulls ass, but wouldn't you rather take the butcher's word?

 

 

That makes no sense.

 

A Tommy Boy quote. I thought it was funny.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

So's your face always makes sense.

[Post Count Padder]

So's your face always makes sense.

That's stupid.

[SouthSideRyan]

So's your face always makes sense.

That's stupid.

 

So's your face!

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Heyooooooo!

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

how do you know the fairy isn't a crazy glue sniffer? "Building model airplanes" says the little fairy; well, we're not buying it. He sneaks into your house once, that's all it takes. The next thing you know, there's money missing off the dresser, and your daughter's knocked up. I seen it a hundred times

[KatJ]

Lieber's xERA the past 3 years have been 3.75, 4.10 and 4.09 so he really hasn't regressed that much. He has had problems with strand rates each of the last two seasons which might indicate some problems pitching out of the stretch or just might be randomness.

 

I'd say there is a decent chance he puts up at least as good of numbers as Marquis and better than Dempster.

 

Personally, I really like Lieber, always have. If he didn't get that (was it?) elbow injury when he was a Cub during his FA season (in part thanks to Baylor's demonstration of how to burn a pitcher's arm with an egregiously large amount of innings), Lieber might well have been a career Cub. But at the time the front office couldn't risk a 2 yr deal, while the Yankees could and did.

 

This rotation (especially Z) can be really good, but all too often the K zone has been elusive for these guys. Liebs will not get into that situation, but we're going to need a speedy and agile OF because he is a fly-out guy. (A tallish CF wouldn't hurt either.) At any rate, I think this deal is a good idea for at least the first half (remember Lieber has enjoyed success for most pre-ASGs in his career - it's almost as notorious as Maddux's second halves), and he can eat some innings if the young guns suck or get injured.

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

[XZero771679666304]

Lieber's xERA the past 3 years have been 3.75, 4.10 and 4.09 so he really hasn't regressed that much. He has had problems with strand rates each of the last two seasons which might indicate some problems pitching out of the stretch or just might be randomness.

 

I'd say there is a decent chance he puts up at least as good of numbers as Marquis and better than Dempster.

 

Personally, I really like Lieber, always have. If he didn't get that (was it?) elbow injury when he was a Cub during his FA season (in part thanks to Baylor's demonstration of how to burn a pitcher's arm with an egregiously large amount of innings), Lieber might well have been a career Cub. But at the time the front office couldn't risk a 2 yr deal, while the Yankees could and did.

 

This rotation (especially Z) can be really good, but all too often the K zone has been elusive for these guys. Liebs will not get into that situation, but we're going to need a speedy and agile OF because he is a fly-out guy. At any rate, I think this deal is a good idea for at least the first half (remember Lieber has enjoyed success for most pre-ASGs in his career - it's almost as notorious as Maddux's second halves), and he can eat some innings if the young guns suck or get injured.

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

 

Actually, Lieber is a ground ball pitcher. Not extreme, but he does have a gb/fb ratio of about 1.5/1, IIRC.

[KatJ]

It seems that the Cubs have a theme of bringing back their old pitchers, and those pitchers have a theme of not being worth a damn.

 

I expect to see Matt Clement back in a Cubs uniform around 2015.

 

Then again, if it keeps Dempster out of the rotation, can it really be that bad?

 

Terry Mulholland, circa 1998, was not a bad deal. He wasn't Cy Young, but he was an effective innings-eating horse whom the opposition wouldn't steal on out of the stretch.

 

There are probably more, But, bottom line is generalizing in this case is not helpful, or even accurate. JMO.

[KatJ]

Lieber's xERA the past 3 years have been 3.75, 4.10 and 4.09 so he really hasn't regressed that much. He has had problems with strand rates each of the last two seasons which might indicate some problems pitching out of the stretch or just might be randomness.

 

I'd say there is a decent chance he puts up at least as good of numbers as Marquis and better than Dempster.

 

Personally, I really like Lieber, always have. If he didn't get that (was it?) elbow injury when he was a Cub during his FA season (in part thanks to Baylor's demonstration of how to burn a pitcher's arm with an egregiously large amount of innings), Lieber might well have been a career Cub. But at the time the front office couldn't risk a 2 yr deal, while the Yankees could and did.

 

This rotation (especially Z) can be really good, but all too often the K zone has been elusive for these guys. Liebs will not get into that situation, but we're going to need a speedy and agile OF because he is a fly-out guy. At any rate, I think this deal is a good idea for at least the first half (remember Lieber has enjoyed success for most pre-ASGs in his career - it's almost as notorious as Maddux's second halves), and he can eat some innings if the young guns suck or get injured.

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

 

Actually, Lieber is a ground ball pitcher. Not extreme, but he does have a gb/fb ratio of about 1.5/1, IIRC.

 

Is he? I must be thinking of somebody else - wonder who?

[KatJ]

We bash Hendry for publically diminishing the trade value of some players that are on the trading block, and bash him for not saying things that would diminish the trade value of other players that are on the trading block.

 

What's that exactly?

 

That Marquis and Dempster are going to have to compete for rotation spots with the Seans and Hart.

 

I've criticized Hendry's talk about Dempster going to the rotation because I very much doubt its sincerity and I don't think it's fooling anybody. Telling bad lies just makes the organization look silly and sleazy and it irritates fans.

 

Question: why is Dempster still a Cub? If he blew his second year as a closer, wouldn't he be worse as a starter? He should be hidden in middle relief with a run cushion (or if the Cubs are losing by 4+ runs), or not on the roster.

[Butterscup1679666578]

When did he "blow" as a closer?

[KatJ]

When did he "blow" as a closer?

 

Demps' 2006 and 2007 esp. left much to be desired. And IMO, closers are closers because (1) they don't have the talent that starters do, or (2) they have the "stuff", but not the endurance. Dempster is borderline candidate at best for the closing spot, and IMO has no business in a starting rotation unless there is a dire emergency (e.g., the Wood-Prior debacle that the team endured for two years).

[imb]

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

His medical report was so bad that it scared off a bunch of teams and he was only able to get a 1-year deal with a $1 million base. This kind of garbage can probably be put to rest now.

[Cubzfan64]

We bash Hendry for publically diminishing the trade value of some players that are on the trading block, and bash him for not saying things that would diminish the trade value of other players that are on the trading block.

 

What's that exactly?

 

That Marquis and Dempster are going to have to compete for rotation spots with the Seans and Hart.

 

I've criticized Hendry's talk about Dempster going to the rotation because I very much doubt its sincerity and I don't think it's fooling anybody. Telling bad lies just makes the organization look silly and sleazy and it irritates fans.

 

Question: why is Dempster still a Cub? If he blew his second year as a closer, wouldn't he be worse as a starter? He should be hidden in middle relief with a run cushion (or if the Cubs are losing by 4+ runs), or not on the roster.

 

What the Cubs should have done (and a number of people suggested it on the forum at the time so it isn't hindsight), is either traded him during the 2nd half of 2005 or in the offseason that year while his value was at roughly it's peak.

 

Instead, the Cubs took a guy who had arm trouble, somewhere around a career 5.0 ERA and a tendancy to give up HR's and inexplicably believed that he had miraculously become a great pitcher in 2005 and was their new answer to the closer role - only to see him spend the next two years reverting back to what he was previously.

 

When they picked him up originally, I think everyone bought into the "low risk, high reward" idea - nothing wrong with that, in fact I think it WAS low risk and high potential for reward. Unfortunately the organization once again failed to evaluate their players well and missed out on that "reward" they could have gotten by moving him after 2005. Instead, we have a guy who's getting paid too much for his production.

 

I know all MLB teams have situations like this, but it irks me to no end to see an organization that can't seem to evaluate talent well enough to buy low and sell high at least more than 10% of the time.

 

*sigh*

[Handlebar McSkullet]

When did he "blow" as a closer?

 

Demps' 2006 and 2007 esp. left much to be desired. And IMO, closers are closers because (1) they don't have the talent that starters do, or (2) they have the "stuff", but not the endurance. Dempster is borderline candidate at best for the closing spot, and IMO has no business in a starting rotation unless there is a dire emergency (e.g., the Wood-Prior debacle that the team endured for two years).

 

he had three blown saves.... THREE!!!! my goodness, with this team recent history of ratty closers you would think people would appreciate dempster more.

[Cubzfan64]

When did he "blow" as a closer?

 

Demps' 2006 and 2007 esp. left much to be desired. And IMO, closers are closers because (1) they don't have the talent that starters do, or (2) they have the "stuff", but not the endurance. Dempster is borderline candidate at best for the closing spot, and IMO has no business in a starting rotation unless there is a dire emergency (e.g., the Wood-Prior debacle that the team endured for two years).

 

he had three blown saves.... THREE!!!! my goodness, with this team recent history of ratty closers you would think people would appreciate dempster more.

 

2006/2007: Combined 3-17 record, an 81% save rate, an ERA of around 4.8 and opponents hitting 0.250 against him. To me that's definitely not a great closer or even a good closer - it's an average closer at best imho - the only stat there that's not too bad is the 0.250 BAA.

[imb]

welcome, brian!

[Butterscup1679666578]

When did he "blow" as a closer?

 

Demps' 2006 and 2007 esp. left much to be desired. And IMO, closers are closers because (1) they don't have the talent that starters do, or (2) they have the "stuff", but not the endurance. Dempster is borderline candidate at best for the closing spot, and IMO has no business in a starting rotation unless there is a dire emergency (e.g., the Wood-Prior debacle that the team endured for two years).

 

oh, I'm definitely not saying he should be anywhere near the rotation, but I don't think it's fair to say that Dempster "blew" as a closer.

[abuck1220]

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

His medical report was so bad that it scared off a bunch of teams and he was only able to get a 1-year deal with a $1 million base. This kind of garbage can probably be put to rest now.

 

so you're saying he wasn't just a huge wuss that refused to pitch through pain that he completely imagined?

[Skyballer]

So does this mean the Dumpster goes Bye-Bye?

[SouthSideRyan]

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

His medical report was so bad that it scared off a bunch of teams and he was only able to get a 1-year deal with a $1 million base. This kind of garbage can probably be put to rest now.

 

He plagarized it and only told San Diego the real story.

[nilodnayr]

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

His medical report was so bad that it scared off a bunch of teams and he was only able to get a 1-year deal with a $1 million base. This kind of garbage can probably be put to rest now.

 

He plagarized it and only told San Diego the real story.

 

Don't forget, and to spite the cubs he only signed for a meager salary.

[XZero771679666304]

 

As for Prior, good riddance. I suspected two years ago that he was resting his arm and biding his time to get to the West Coast. I hope he gets shelled.

 

His medical report was so bad that it scared off a bunch of teams and he was only able to get a 1-year deal with a $1 million base. This kind of garbage can probably be put to rest now.

 

He plagarized it and only told San Diego the real story.

 

It was all a part of his diabolical plot. He also covered up the part where the medical staff discovered that he is in fact the antichrist.