MacPhail: Deal is dead (p. 297), stop posting, go outside

[wrigley23]

so soriano has more of a chance of hitting a leadoff home run than for roberts to lead off w/ a walk or hit & then proceeds to get hit in? OK...gotcha. And soriano's legs are an issue at the top. Last time I checked, you have to run to first after you hit the ball. His lower body issues are a major issue but more critical at the top where he's asked to get on base to be driven in vs drive someone in ahead of him. Some of you are so unobjective & stubborn it's unflattering. And I'm giving my opinion so it's not wrong. Opinions aren't wrong. They are a personal belief. The intolerance of other's opinions here is very disappointing. The rubbing it in other's face nonsense us also unappealing.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

so soriano has more of a chance of hitting a leadoff home run than for roberts to lead off w/ a walk or hit & then proceeds to get hit in? OK...gotcha. And soriano's legs are an issue at the top. Last time I checked, you have to run to first after you hit the ball. His lower body issues are a major issue but more critical at the top where he's asked to get on base to be driven in vs drive someone in ahead of him. Some of you are so unobjective & stubborn it's unflattering. And I'm giving my opinion so it's not wrong. Opinions aren't wrong. They are a personal belief. The intolerance of other's opinions here is very disappointing. The rubbing it in other's face nonsense us also unappealing.

 

What you don't get is that when Soriano leads off with a HR, the chance of scoring a run is 100%. Even when Roberts leads off with a hit or walk, he isn't guaranteed to score a run. So, there is a great deal of value in being able to hit a homerun.

[David]

so soriano has more of a chance of hitting a leadoff home run than for roberts to lead off w/ a walk or hit & then proceeds to get hit in? OK...gotcha. And soriano's legs are an issue at the top. Last time I checked, you have to run to first after you hit the ball. His lower body issues are a major issue but more critical at the top where he's asked to get on base to be driven in vs drive someone in ahead of him. Some of you are so unobjective & stubborn it's unflattering. And I'm giving my opinion so it's not wrong. Opinions aren't wrong. They are a personal belief. The intolerance of other's opinions here is very disappointing. The rubbing it in other's face nonsense us also unappealing.

 

Oh, the ironing.

 

Oh, and opinions can be wrong. You talk about objectivity, yet people have refuted your arguments with objective facts and legitimate arguments, but you have yet to respond with anything but your own subjective opinion and regurgitations of what you hear the "experts" (most of whom are stubborn themselves and completely close-minded to anything that conflicts with conventional wisdom) say. Your only response when you get called out is that it's your opinion (which can't be wrong - what a beautiful thing) and that the Cubs (and Steve Stone) agree with you (despite the fact that nobody in the organization has said a thing to back up your argument - you're making the inference based on the Cubs' pursuit of Roberts - I get it). It must be great to take a stance in a debate that can't be refuted or argued with.

[Derwood]

just want to say that the Red Sox used to lead off with Kevin Youkilis. how many steals did he have again?

[CubinNY]

I prefer that this thread go back to 80's gay dance bands

 

Come on every body

 

:clapping:

:yahoo: :yahoo:

 

Oh oh

Wee-ell-Now!

 

Relax don't do it

When you want to go to it

Relax don't do it

When you want to come

Relax don't do it

When you want to come

When you want to come

 

Relax don't do it

When you want to to go to it

Relax don't do it

When you want to come

Relax don't do it

When you want to suck to it

Relax don't do it

When you want to come

Come-oh oh oh

[Post Count Padder]

just want to say that the Red Sox used to lead off with Kevin Youkilis. how many steals did he have again?

I used that arguement a few pages back and even mentioned Hatteberg along with Youk. It went unnoticed.

[98navigator]

so soriano has more of a chance of hitting a leadoff home run than for roberts to lead off w/ a walk or hit & then proceeds to get hit in? OK...gotcha. And soriano's legs are an issue at the top. Last time I checked, you have to run to first after you hit the ball. His lower body issues are a major issue but more critical at the top where he's asked to get on base to be driven in vs drive someone in ahead of him. Some of you are so unobjective & stubborn it's unflattering. And I'm giving my opinion so it's not wrong. Opinions aren't wrong. They are a personal belief. The intolerance of other's opinions here is very disappointing. The rubbing it in other's face nonsense us also unappealing.

 

Wow, you are really exaggerating. Aramis, with his various lower body ailments, manages to run after he hits the ball. I'm sure Sori will be fine. It's also unappealing to read you calling people out constantly. Your posts usually smack of arrogance; "my point of view is backed up by X, Y, and Z from MLB so they must be right and everyone else is wrong." Now you want nice-nice. Whatever.

 

Oh yeah, you can have your opinion but that doesn't mean it is right. Opinions are only as good as the facts behind them.

[Derwood]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

[Rob]

just want to say that the Red Sox used to lead off with Kevin Youkilis. how many steals did he have again?

I used that arguement a few pages back and even mentioned Hatteberg along with Youk. It went unnoticed.

 

Any and all attempts to refute his logic have gone unnoticed by him. He merely responds with more rhetoric.

[David]

How do you draw the line between realllllly stubborn and trolling for responses? It's a thin line. It almost seems like it can't be serious. The posts are TOO perfect.

 

amirite?

[98navigator]

How do you draw the line between realllllly stubborn and trolling for responses? It's a thin line. It almost seems like it can't be serious. The posts are TOO perfect.

 

amirite?

 

I hear ya

[rawaction]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

 

HRs are rally killers.

[DeuceBaseman]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

 

A HR is also better when there are people on base. And Soriano would be up with people on base more often in the 5 hole. These arguments arent about whether Soriano gives us value in the leadoff spot. Of course he gives us value there because he is a great player. But guys like him should be batting lower so that those HRs are not all solo shots. I think we need to move him out of the leadoff spot (only if we get a legit leadoff hitter like Roberts) so that he is more valuable to us.

[17 Seconds]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

 

A HR is also better when there are people on base. And Soriano would be up with people on base more often in the 5 hole. These arguments arent about whether Soriano gives us value in the leadoff spot. Of course he gives us value there because he is a great player. But guys like him should be batting lower so that those HRs are not all solo shots. I think we need to move him out of the leadoff spot (only if we get a legit leadoff hitter like Roberts) so that he is more valuable to us.

 

But he would not hit as many home runs batting lower. That's the point.

 

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

[DeuceBaseman]

But he would not hit as many home runs batting lower. That's the point.

 

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

 

You don't know that. 500 at bats (ie. 1 year) doesnt tell everything. There is no reason to think that Soriano cant hit the same amount of HR's in the 5 hole as in the 1 hole. And if you say he needs protection, then bat him 4th with Aramis behind him. Aramis doesnt need protection. And Soto is good protection.

[Derwood]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

 

A HR is also better when there are people on base. And Soriano would be up with people on base more often in the 5 hole. These arguments arent about whether Soriano gives us value in the leadoff spot. Of course he gives us value there because he is a great player. But guys like him should be batting lower so that those HRs are not all solo shots. I think we need to move him out of the leadoff spot (only if we get a legit leadoff hitter like Roberts) so that he is more valuable to us.

 

that's not my point. my point is that there is absolutely no way you can say that a walk by Roberts >>> a HR by Soriano when leading off an inning. okay, you can say it, but you're 100% wrong

[17 Seconds]

But he would not hit as many home runs batting lower. That's the point.

 

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

 

You don't know that. 500 at bats (ie. 1 year) doesnt tell everything. There is no reason to think that Soriano cant hit the same amount of HR's in the 5 hole as in the 1 hole. And if you say he needs protection, then bat him 4th with Aramis behind him. Aramis doesnt need protection. And Soto is good protection.

 

Ugh. It's not about him batting 5th specifically, it's about him batting in the middle of the lineup as an RBI guy. He has way more than 500 at bats doing that, and his numbers (eespecially sluggin) have decreased dramatically.

 

For the 57th time, look at his career numbers with runners on and risp. Simply by looking at those you could guess that he wouldn't be well suited as a middle of the order guy. I don't even know why I'm wasting my time explaining this AGAIN when it'a obvious you'll continue to REFUSE to acknowledge all the evidence that shows you're wrong. I'm done with this nonsense.

[17 Seconds]

But he would not hit as many home runs batting lower. That's the point.

 

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

 

You don't know that. 500 at bats (ie. 1 year) doesnt tell everything. There is no reason to think that Soriano cant hit the same amount of HR's in the 5 hole as in the 1 hole. And if you say he needs protection, then bat him 4th with Aramis behind him. Aramis doesnt need protection. And Soto is good protection.

 

Ugh. It's not about him batting 5th specifically, it's about him batting in the middle of the lineup as an RBI guy. He has way more than 500 at bats doing that, and his numbers (eespecially sluggin) have decreased dramatically.

 

For the 57th time, look at his career numbers with runners on and risp. Simply by looking at those you could guess that he wouldn't be well suited as a middle of the order guy. I don't even know why I'm wasting my time explaining this AGAIN when it'a obvious you'll continue to REFUSE to acknowledge all the evidence that shows you're wrong. I'm done with this nonsense.

[17 Seconds]

Anyways, here are a couple tidbits from Sullvian's most recent article. Mostly nothing new, but interesting anyways.

 

Of course, the move can be seen as a harbinger of another trade, this one involving Brian Roberts, with Cedeno going to Baltimore, probably along with Matt Murton and a pitching prospect.

 

But nothing appears imminent, and Hendry insisted the signing was "not necessarily" a precursor to a bigger move.

 

The fact that he said "not necessarily" makes me think that maybe it actually is a precursor to another trade. You'd think he'd just say "no" if he didn't have plans to deal Cedeno.

 

 

Hendry still may be looking for another outfielder. Despite the lack of movement on a Roberts deal, the Cubs are still interested in getting him in camp before the end of spring training.

 

Again, it's not much, but at least it's not about Soriano leading off.

[17 Seconds]

Anyways, here are a couple tidbits from Sullvian's most recent article. Mostly nothing new, but interesting anyways.

 

Of course, the move can be seen as a harbinger of another trade, this one involving Brian Roberts, with Cedeno going to Baltimore, probably along with Matt Murton and a pitching prospect.

 

But nothing appears imminent, and Hendry insisted the signing was "not necessarily" a precursor to a bigger move.

 

The fact that he said "not necessarily" makes me think that maybe it actually is a precursor to another trade. You'd think he'd just say "no" if he didn't have plans to deal Cedeno.

 

 

Hendry still may be looking for another outfielder. Despite the lack of movement on a Roberts deal, the Cubs are still interested in getting him in camp before the end of spring training.

 

Again, it's not much, but at least it's not about Soriano leading off.

[DeuceBaseman]

that's not my point. my point is that there is absolutely no way you can say that a walk by Roberts >>> a HR by Soriano when leading off an inning. okay, you can say it, but you're 100% wrong

 

I never said that a walk by Roberts is better than a Soriano HR. The other guy did. But I'd rather have a walk by Roberts followed by a Soriano HR a few at bats later, than a Soriano HR to start the inning. And to Dex: I'm sorry but I just don't think that a few random past at bats with Soriano in the middle of the order tells the whole story. I think that if you give him time and have him bat the whole year in the #5 spot then he will do just as good as the #1 spot. He just needs to start there and bat there the whole year, and he will be fine. If any adjustments need to be made he can make them, just like the move to the OF.

[MADD_DOG_31]

everyone repeat after me:

 

A HR IS THE BEST POSSIBLE OUTCOME OF ANY AT BAT IN ANY SITUATION

 

some of you need to write this on the blackboard 100 times every day this week

 

HRs are rally killers.

 

and walks clog the bases :grin:

[17 Seconds]

that's not my point. my point is that there is absolutely no way you can say that a walk by Roberts >>> a HR by Soriano when leading off an inning. okay, you can say it, but you're 100% wrong

 

If any adjustments need to be made he can make them, just like the move to the OF.

 

HE DOESN'T HIT WELL WITH RUNNERS ON BASE.

[Clem Fandango]

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

 

They're Tyler Durden

[17 Seconds]

I seriously don't understand why you and wrigley23 don't continue to completely ignore that his performance drops dramatically when batting lower. And please don't say it's a coincidence because we've been over this 2243452 times, you just fail to acknowledge it.

 

They're Tyler Durden

 

It wouldn't surprise me.