SI and ESPN report Matsuzaka signs for 6/52

[RynoRules]

A 5 year 40 million dollar offer is very fair considering he's never pitched a single major league inning. The Red Sox at least made a fair offer considering they had to spend 51 million for his rights.

 

Boras just seems clueless that it isn't a free-market situation. It's not like the Red Sox low-balled him with a 2-4 million dollar contract. They're willing to give him 8 million a year guaranteed.

 

If he doesn't like that, let him play for his 2 million or a little more in Japan and hope that they don't further overwork his arm and reduce his value for when he can negotiate on the open market.

 

Then if I were him I'd accept a 1 year 10 and go free agent after that or is he not allowed to do that?

 

Why on Earth would Boston do that? That's essentially 61 mill for 1 year. He ain't Michael Jordan.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

8 million a year is not a "low-ball" offer considering this guy has never pitched a single major league inning.

 

again, i disagree. matsuzaka has shown what he can do against major league-caliber talent in the WBC. when guys like gil meche are getting $11m/year, ted lilly $10m/year, and jason marquis $7m/year, offering matsuzaka money equivalent to marquis is lowballing him. hard.

 

Yes, but those guys are FA. Matsuzaka is not. It's a world of difference. Considering he has two choices, play for Boston or return to Japan and hope his team posts him again next season, eight million isn't a bad offer.

 

Furthermore, it's not like Boston sucks and are desperate for Daisuke.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

this smells even more like boston was just trying to block the yankees from getting his rights.

 

Exactly. It's not their fault. That would imply that this was a mistake or accidental. This was their plan all along. They'd sign him if by some off-chance he took a very reasonable deal, but in reality their intent was just to keep the Yanks from getting him.

 

I disagree. The Red Sox desperately need pitching and could use an ace. I don't think their intent was just to stop the Yankees, but, you know, improve a team that came in third place.

[shnsajax]

If I am not mistaken, this is exactly the kind of offer that he was projected to recieve before the posting period ended from any team. The offer is more than fair. Boston is not lowballing him by any stretch of the means, this is just typical Boras.

 

He is not an arbi guy, and he is not a FA. To me this is more like signing a draft pick who is going to get a major league contract.

[CuseCubFan69]

If I am not mistaken, this is exactly the kind of offer that he was projected to recieve before the posting period ended from any team. The offer is more than fair. Boston is not lowballing him by any stretch of the means, this is just typical Boras.

 

He is not an arbi guy, and he is not a FA. To me this is more like signing a draft pick who is going to get a major league contract.

 

I don't blame Boras for the high posting fee and I don't see why Matsuzaka has to be responisble for Bostons bid. That was their choice to bid in the 50's not his.

[Radar3454]

I think Boston is offering a very fair deal considering the leverage they have. To suggest Matsuzaka HAS to go back to Japan b/c of the offer is crazy to me. He has to decide if he would rather take less than he would be worth as a FA but still a significant offer or go back to Japan and go thru the posting process again next year or wait until he can be a FA which I believe is next April.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

If I am not mistaken, this is exactly the kind of offer that he was projected to recieve before the posting period ended from any team. The offer is more than fair. Boston is not lowballing him by any stretch of the means, this is just typical Boras.

 

He is not an arbi guy, and he is not a FA. To me this is more like signing a draft pick who is going to get a major league contract.

 

I don't blame Boras for the high posting fee and I don't see why Matsuzaka has to be responisble for Bostons bid. That was their choice to bid in the 50's not his.

 

But I don't see how 5/40 isn't a fair offer for someone who can't negotiate with other teams and has never pitched a single major league inning.

[1908]

Considering he has two choices, play for Boston or return to Japan and hope his team posts him again next season, eight million isn't a bad offer.

He has a third choice: Play two more years in Japan and become one of the top FA prizes of the 2008 off season. He'll be 28 if he takes that path. The big loser would be Seibu if that happens, not Daiske. And possibly the Red Sox after he signs with the Yankees.

[UMFan83]

I guarentee you this deal 'magically' still gets done. As you guys know, agents and GMs often use the media for 'leverage' in their negotiations.

[cubweiser03]

The only thing Boston is offering Mats financially that him staying in Japan is 2 years of MLB salary that he otherwise wouldnt have right now. Lets say Mats makes $5M in the next 2 years in Japan, under what we are learning is Boston is offering him those 2 years at say $15M. So $10M benefit is what they are really offering him compared to his current situation. The shorter the contract he signs the better it is for Mats and the easier it is for him to make up this $10M on the open market. Right now on the open market he is worth way more than $7M-$8M. A 4 year $32M contract might make sense for him. 6 years i dont think is in his favor. If Boston would do a $7M-$8M for 4 years thats $80 million for 4 years. If Boston didnt up the years 6 and 7 to at least $12M or $13M id tell em to go to hell.

 

This market is freaking crazy, getting locked in to a $8M contract for 6 years would be nuts.

[BRASKYS SCOTCH]

Scott Boras will squeeze the seconds out of his window of time to get a deal done that would potentially maximize his client's contract. There will be some last-minute give-and-take between BoSox and Matsuzake, and a deal will get done.

[CuseCubFan69]

If I am not mistaken, this is exactly the kind of offer that he was projected to recieve before the posting period ended from any team. The offer is more than fair. Boston is not lowballing him by any stretch of the means, this is just typical Boras.

 

He is not an arbi guy, and he is not a FA. To me this is more like signing a draft pick who is going to get a major league contract.

 

I don't blame Boras for the high posting fee and I don't see why Matsuzaka has to be responisble for Bostons bid. That was their choice to bid in the 50's not his.

 

But I don't see how 5/40 isn't a fair offer for someone who can't negotiate with other teams and has never pitched a single major league inning.

 

Personally I think it's too low and as 1908 said, he has a choice to stay in Japan and come out in 2 years so, he does have options and IMO Boston thought they could force him into a below market deal.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

The only thing Boston is offering Mats financially that him staying in Japan is 2 years of MLB salary that he otherwise wouldnt have right now. Lets say Mats makes $5M in the next 2 years in Japan, under what we are learning is Boston is offering him those 2 years at say $15M. So $10M benefit is what they are really offering him compared to his current situation. The shorter the contract he signs the better it is for Mats and the easier it is for him to make up this $10M on the open market. Right now on the open market he is worth way more than $7M-$8M. A 4 year $32M contract might make sense for him. 6 years i dont think is in his favor. If Boston would do a $7M-$8M for 4 years thats $80 million for 4 years. If Boston didnt up the years 6 and 7 to at least $12M or $13M id tell em to go to hell.

 

This market is freaking crazy, getting locked in to a $8M contract for 6 years would be nuts.

 

It's not that simple, though. Boston is offering 40 million in guaranteed cash.

 

If Matsuzaka goes back to Japan and hurts himself, what would he be able to get?

[1908]

But I don't see how 5/40 isn't a fair offer for someone who can't negotiate with other teams and has never pitched a single major league inning.

Never pitching a single inning in MLB didn't stop Boston from offering that $50+M posting fee. Kinda difficult for them to sell the you're-a-risky-unknown argument after they made a bid like that, don't you think?

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Considering he has two choices, play for Boston or return to Japan and hope his team posts him again next season, eight million isn't a bad offer.

He has a third choice: Play two more years in Japan and become one of the top FA prizes of the 2008 off season. He'll be 28 if he takes that path. The big loser would be Seibu if that happens, not Daiske. And possibly the Red Sox after he signs with the Yankees.

 

Of course he's taking a risk himself in that third choice - injury or something else limiting the amount of money he gets in 2008.

[Guest]

Considering he has two choices, play for Boston or return to Japan and hope his team posts him again next season, eight million isn't a bad offer.

He has a third choice: Play two more years in Japan and become one of the top FA prizes of the 2008 off season. He'll be 28 if he takes that path. The big loser would be Seibu if that happens, not Daiske. And possibly the Red Sox after he signs with the Yankees.

 

Of course he's taking a risk himself - injury or something else limiting the amount of money he gets in 2008.

Never stopped Boras from recommending that course of action, though.

[MembersOnlyJacket]

Take a look back 5 years ago. Ichiro, the highest rated everyday player ever to come out of Japan recieved a 3 year/15 million contract. 5 years later, the Red Sox are offering $40 million gauranteed to a pitcher who has never thrown a ML pitch. That offer is fair.

 

However, if you are Boras, you sit there and see stupid signings for 10-12 million by the Cubs and Rangers for pitchers who are mediocre at best. He's probably playing that card. But, you can't treat this as though it is free agency. Boston offered tons of money just to negociate and pay at the end. $15 million per season is ridiculous and 3x what Ichiro got just 5 years ago.

 

If I was Boston, I'd try to back load some deal with no more than $10 mill/year for the average value of the contract.

[BigbadB]

What a stupid way to do the posting anyway. There should be a minimum posting fee, and then all teams who meet it should be able to make offers.

 

It's not stupid to the team that gets the money for posting a player.

 

pretty sure seibu is going to be upset if boston fails to reach a deal with matsuzaka. a revamped posting system would prevent something like this from happening. seibu would set a minimum bid, like a "reserve" on an auction. then, they're guaranteed to receive at least that much if a team reaches a deal with their player.

 

Not a bad idea, but MLB would need protection from collusion on the other side. I don't think Seibu should receive $10m (pretending that's the minimum bid) simply because the player didn't sign a deal.

 

The whole system is flawed, but I really don't have any answer to correcting it.

[cubweiser03]

The only thing Boston is offering Mats financially that him staying in Japan is 2 years of MLB salary that he otherwise wouldnt have right now. Lets say Mats makes $5M in the next 2 years in Japan, under what we are learning is Boston is offering him those 2 years at say $15M. So $10M benefit is what they are really offering him compared to his current situation. The shorter the contract he signs the better it is for Mats and the easier it is for him to make up this $10M on the open market. Right now on the open market he is worth way more than $7M-$8M. A 4 year $32M contract might make sense for him. 6 years i dont think is in his favor. If Boston would do a $7M-$8M for 4 years thats $80 million for 4 years. If Boston didnt up the years 6 and 7 to at least $12M or $13M id tell em to go to hell.

 

This market is freaking crazy, getting locked in to a $8M contract for 6 years would be nuts.

 

It's not that simple, though. Boston is offering 40 million in guaranteed cash.

 

If Matsuzaka goes back to Japan and hurts himself, what would he be able to get?

 

Drunk on Sake? Yes guaranteed cash does have value especially for a pitcher. Im sure if he wanted he could get a 6 year deal in Japan too, not sure how much though. No where near $40 or $48M boston would give him though. Its an interesting situation. Also i wonder how much $ the yankees are offering that Iguama guy they posted $20M for.

[1908]

Considering he has two choices, play for Boston or return to Japan and hope his team posts him again next season, eight million isn't a bad offer.

He has a third choice: Play two more years in Japan and become one of the top FA prizes of the 2008 off season. He'll be 28 if he takes that path. The big loser would be Seibu if that happens, not Daiske. And possibly the Red Sox after he signs with the Yankees.

Of course he's taking a risk himself in that third choice - injury or something else limiting the amount of money he gets in 2008.

Injury's always a risk. I wouldn't bet on his performance declining over the next couple years given his age and history, though. I suspect he'd put up better numbers in Japan over the next two years.

[Balsa]

What a stupid way to do the posting anyway. There should be a minimum posting fee, and then all teams who meet it should be able to make offers.

 

It's not stupid to the team that gets the money for posting a player.

 

pretty sure seibu is going to be upset if boston fails to reach a deal with matsuzaka. a revamped posting system would prevent something like this from happening. seibu would set a minimum bid, like a "reserve" on an auction. then, they're guaranteed to receive at least that much if a team reaches a deal with their player.

 

How about each team places a blind bid for negotiating rights, and the top five bidders must pay the team that amount whether they sign him or not. Then, they talk to the player and his agent and decide on that contract.

[Vinestal]

I think for him the best thing to do would be to go back and play 2 more years in Japan. I dont think he saw the senerio where someone would pay 51 mil to negotiate. If that had not happened he'd have gotten a much more lucrative offer.

Its my opinion that Boston never intended to sign him but they are trying to make it look like they wanted to by low balling him. In my opinion the amount they are offering is about 4 mil a year off what he should get in this market. I think at the very least you can expect numbers better than Lilly's or Meche's and I think hes much much better than that.

Go back to Japan hit the free agent market in a couple years, thats what I'd do.

[snoodmonger]

this smells even more like boston was just trying to block the yankees from getting his rights.

 

Exactly. It's not their fault. That would imply that this was a mistake or accidental. This was their plan all along. They'd sign him if by some off-chance he took a very reasonable deal, but in reality their intent was just to keep the Yanks from getting him.

 

This is a guy who has had hopesand dreams of performing in the majors since he was a kid, and now he got jerked around just so the Red Sox could play a stupid game to prevent their rivals from getting him.

 

I REALLY wanted Matsuzaka to play this year. I was looking forward to it, I didn't care which team it was for. The guy got his hopes up and now they're gonna be crushed. How would you feel if your dream as to come play here and you find out that the Boston Red Sox bid $51 million for your rights first and foremost.

 

1) It'd give you great expectations that people take you seriously

2) You'd realize that you'd arrived in the majors, cause if someone wants you THAT bad, you're getting in.

 

Nope, sorry, we're gonna short change you, take it or go back to Japan. IN YOUR FACE, NEW YORK!

 

This really pisses me off, I used to have a little respect for the Red Sox, this just makes me completely hate them. I really hope the Sox make me eat my words and sign him before his deadline is up, he doesn't deserve to be shut out like this. God knows what it could do to his mental state. What if some of the Japanese fans don't welcome him back with open arms. He did just try and put Japan on the backburners for bigger and better things, and a lot of them were upset he's leaving, now he's gotta walk back in like nothing happened. Sorry, I just feel for the guy. Really wish/hope he gets signed. maybe thats just me though

 

It's hard to feel real sorry for a guy who might turn down 8 mil/yr to fulfill his dream.

 

That's plenty of money. If he really wants to play, take the money and suit up.

[soccer10k]

I bet he gets signed right before the deadline to a 5/55 deal.

[Cubzfan64]

Personally I think this is still posturing on both sides part - Boston spent a ton of cash just to talk to this guy and I wouldn't be surprised if there were some *wink wink* things said to imply that they would pay good salaries to Drew and Lugo (who are also Boras players).

 

I think Boston is expecting Boras to blink first - or in this case, I think they expect D. Mat to press the issue with Boras and sign. It would be a MAJOR embarrasment to him to have to return to Japan - remember, there are some cultrual issues here too and he does not want to feel shame in having to go back to Japan for another year.

 

This is going to come down to the last second imho and the Red Sox will hope Boras (who doesn't really hold many cards here) gives in a little bit.

 

To be honest, I don't blame either side for what's going on - I would have been surprised if they had signed by now.