"Sometimes it's easier to play on the road"

[jjgman21]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

I remember Dawson and Dunston being well received by the fans, as well.

 

not exactly accurate. Dunston was pretty much hated by Cub fans until 1989 when he stopped sucking so bad.

[abuck1220]

did you guys hear all those racists booing jones? i don't even think it was because he was thrown out trying to stretch a single into a double down 5-0...i think it was because he's black.

[Mizzou]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

I remember Dawson and Dunston being well received by the fans, as well.

 

not exactly accurate. Dunston was pretty much hated by Cub fans until 1989 when he stopped sucking so bad.

Is that the year that the Shawon-o-meter made its debut? I was only 7 then, so I don't remember.

[Sammy Sofa]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

I remember Dawson and Dunston being well received by the fans, as well.

 

not exactly accurate. Dunston was pretty much hated by Cub fans until 1989 when he stopped sucking so bad.

Is that the year that the Shawon-o-meter made its debut? I was only 7 then, so I don't remember.

 

Hey, I'd stop booing a guy if his cannon arm could knock me out cold at any given moment.

[Soriano12]

did you guys hear all those racists booing jones? i don't even think it was because he was thrown out trying to stretch a single into a double down 5-0...i think it was because he's black.

 

Please tell me thats sarcasm

[Sammy Sofa]

did you guys hear all those racists booing jones? i don't even think it was because he was thrown out trying to stretch a single into a double down 5-0...i think it was because he's black.

 

Please tell me thats sarcasm

 

You really have to ask?

[NCCubFan]

I think it's time to play the Lee Elia rant now. God, that was classic.

http://www.speakeasy.org/~bucky/elia_tirade.html

[SouthSideRyan]

You know what I'm starting to think?

 

I'm starting to think there hasn't been more than maybe one or two racist letters for any of those guys.

 

Society is getting to the point where it isn't necessary to drop an "n-bomb" to be accused of racism.

 

I'm not so naive as to believe that there haven't been any truly racist letters received... but I am beginning to think that if somebody writes Dusty a letter and calls him a s***head, they're trying to spin that into "He's hated because he's black." instead of the more accurate "He's hated because he sucks"

 

I think there's a lot of idiots out there that think the racist letters to LaTroy and Corey(First I've heard of those) are what helped get them sent out of town, and are now going to stupidly do it to everyone they want gone. Sure it would be great to get rid of Dusty, but not like that.

[SouthSideRyan]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

[ConstableRabbit]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

[cubfan1955]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

[ConstableRabbit]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

 

 

I am by no means advocating or defending those who sent racist death threats, but I have to ask:

 

Were they fans of his team?

[cubfan1955]

I'm not sure. He was playing in Atlanta and the KKK was going strong in the south back then so I'd just venture a guess that some of them were Braves fans. I would also guess racists have their priorities. Hate over baseball team.

[NorthsideAvenger]

The article by Nightengale, is simply a "cop out." It's purpose is to give the people something to talk about, while distracting said people from acknowledging the truth. The Cubs suck.

 

Mabry suck..... White guy

Bynum sucked....Black guy

Perez sucked.....Latino guy

 

Suckiness knows no color. Suckiness doesn't discriminate in colors. Crappy players come in all colors. And for Nightengale to EVEN suggest that racism has played a part, well......he should be put on a sabbaticial so that he can get a clearer view at what he writes.

 

The Cubs cuurently suck, due to EVERYBODY ineptitude, not just one person.

[Tracer Bullet]

if anybody knows what a racist sounds like, it's dusty "white players can't handle the heat" baker.

 

this is just stupid...

 

Chicago Cubs manager Dusty Baker, sitting in his Wrigley Field office, slowly opens a letter, and cringes.

It begins with a nasty racial epithet, but Baker keeps reading. He finishes the letter, slowly crumbles it in a ball and tosses it in the trash bin. Oh well, he says, at least they're getting friendlier. This one didn't include a death threat.

 

"It's not easy, I ain't lying," says Baker, in the final season of a four-year contract, "but come on, dude, I'm not going to let them beat me up.

 

"I was already strong and tough when I got here. Now, I'm stronger and tougher. They aren't going to run me out of town."

 

oh, poor dusty baker. all these racists are trying to run him out of town, not because a 95 mil payroll team is 20 games under, but because they hate black people.

 

The true fans have been great, but it's changed there and become hostile," she says. "I can't subject a 7-year-old to people booing his dad or hearing that kind of language. You want him to go somewhere where there's no negativity.

 

"But you can't always protect him. Someone mentioned to him at the park the other day, 'I heard that your dad will be fired.' He has no clue."

 

newsflash...people want him fired because he sucks, not because he's black. quit trying to play the victim.

 

I probably should read the whole thread before responding to this, but this is over the top. If someone wants to write a story about the racist letters that Dusty and some players are getting, how is that Dusty's fault? And you think people are writing letters (some of which include death threats) that include racial epithets not b/c Dusty's black, but b/c he sucks? If he was white but sucked would he still get racial slurs in the mail? Do you think when Dempster blows a save he gets death threats that include racial remarks? Think Rusch has received a lot of racial slurs this year? I'm guessing no (though he gets plenty of fat jokes).

 

Does it matter why he receives these kinds of letters? If the team were playing .500 ball and someone thought they should be better, Dusty still might be receiving these kinds of letters. I can't believe you're telling Dusty to stop playing the victim when he's receiving racial hate mail.

[fromthestretch]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

I remember Dawson and Dunston being well received by the fans, as well.

 

not exactly accurate. Dunston was pretty much hated by Cub fans until 1989 when he stopped sucking so bad.

 

The point is that for the majority of his career he was loved by the fans, despite the fact that he was a medicore player.

[Tracer Bullet]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

 

So it's ok to send these letters and use racial slurs if they only do it to players/coaches that suck and cheer players they think are good? I'm sorry, but in my book, if you send letters to people that include racial epithets, you're a racist.

 

And just b/c all those guys were loved by many/most Cubs fans doesn't mean they didn't receive some racist remarks in the mail and on the field too. I have no idea if they did, but I sure wouldn't be surprised.

[Electron Blue]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

 

So it's ok to send these letters and use racial slurs if they only do it to players/coaches that suck and cheer players they think are good? I'm sorry, but in my book, if you send letters to people that include racial epithets, you're a racist.

 

And just b/c all those guys were loved by many/most Cubs fans doesn't mean they didn't receive some racist remarks in the mail and on the field too. I have no idea if they did, but I sure wouldn't be surprised.

 

I think his point is that people who wrote to Aaron were truly racist, thus "worthy" of a story in USA Today. In comparison, today's Dusty-writers are just morons reacting moronically to a bad baseball team.

 

Granted, no one is excused ("true" racist or not, it's all despicable), but at least a story about Hank Aaron's struggle with racism could actually address the issue. Nightengale's article, like everyone around here has opined, is BS.

[Tracer Bullet]

That's an excellent point...besides Sandberg, I think it's safe to say that the most beloved Cubs players, at least out of those still with us, are Ernie Banks and Billy Williams. Obviously, there are racist "fans" out there, but that article felt a little too close to being a blanket condemnation of the city and the fanbase.

 

Not to mention that the most popular Cubs(Zambano, Lee) are minorities.

 

Interesting how no one sends racist hate mail to players who don't suck.

 

 

I'm not psychologist, but it seems to me that these morons are going more along the lines of "hey you suck, AND you're black." Wouldn't a true racist hate anyone who was not in their preferred ethnic group, regardless of how good they were?

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

 

So it's ok to send these letters and use racial slurs if they only do it to players/coaches that suck and cheer players they think are good? I'm sorry, but in my book, if you send letters to people that include racial epithets, you're a racist.

 

And just b/c all those guys were loved by many/most Cubs fans doesn't mean they didn't receive some racist remarks in the mail and on the field too. I have no idea if they did, but I sure wouldn't be surprised.

 

I think his point is that people who wrote to Aaron were truly racist, thus "worthy" of a story in USA Today. In comparison, today's Dusty-writers are just morons reacting moronically to a bad baseball team.

 

Granted, no one is excused ("true" racist or not, it's all despicable), but at least a story about Hank Aaron's struggle with racism could actually address the issue. Nightengale's article, like everyone around here has opined, is BS.

 

Yeah, I get the point. I just don't agree that there is such a thing as "true" racists. Doesn't matter if you send these letters to guys only when they're struggling or even when they're good, it's still racism.

 

And the article may be BS, but I don't think it's right to blame Dusty or any of the players receiving these letters (or say they're using this as an excuse). I'm not saying you're doing this, but others on the board have been. If Cubs players are receiving these types of letters, I think it's news and I want to know about it. It makes me embarrassed to be a Cubs fan and thus somewhat associated with these people, but I'm still glad it's being brought to the public.

[CuseCubFan69]

Do any other teams players get these type letters? If not, Chicago does have a problem.

[Banedon]

Well this all gave Dusty a chance to name-drop Hank Aaron again...

 

Asked Monday if the letters would affect his feelings on wanting to stay and manage in Chicago, Baker replied: "No, I don't think so. You realize that some people feel the way they feel. It's sad that you have to get those, but on the other hand, it's something I experienced, indirectly, when I was with Hank Aaron before. So that sort of prepared me for now.

[Soriano12]

Probably the most hated Cub over the past 10 years has to be Todd Hundley.

 

Yes..hated more than Hawkins IMO.

 

I can't post 99% of the stuff I heard fans yelling at him in the stands.

 

 

Bottom line, Cubs fans are prejudiced against bad baseball..not skin color.

[halplm]

The thing that bugs me most about Dusty playing the race card... are his own blatantly racist comments, which the media still gives him a pass on...

 

We're going to be paying for hiring Baker for a LONG time...

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Yes, the ones that sent death threats to Hank Aaron as he approached the Babe's homerun total were true racists. He was good and they still hated him. As far as I know, and I could be wrong, but I don't remember hearing of Banks, Williams, Jenkins, Dawson or Sosa getting any death threats. Well, Sammy might have after he fell out favor but you get the point.

 

What the hell does that mean? Anyone who uses race is a racist by definition, whether or not they're sending hate mail or celebrating one's accomplishments. What's the difference between "you suck, " or "that is actually pretty good"?

[Tracer Bullet]

Probably the most hated Cub over the past 10 years has to be Todd Hundley.

 

Yes..hated more than Hawkins IMO.

 

I can't post 99% of the stuff I heard fans yelling at him in the stands.

 

 

Bottom line, Cubs fans are prejudiced against bad baseball..not skin color.

 

So are you saying Dusty's a liar or saying that writing racial slurs in a letter (some of which include death threats) doesn't indicate prejudice based on skin color? I hate what Dusty has done to this team and I've yelled many things at the TV while watching him that I wouldn't want my mother to hear me yell, but none of them had anything to do with race. They all had to do with his inability to properly manage a baseball team.

 

I have no problem with fans booing or yelling things that attack Dusty's skills as a manger. I have a big problem with people yelling or writing racials slurs while attacking his skills as a manger. I have just as big a problem with people defending this as anything but racism. Using a racial slur to attack someone who is bad at something (rather than solely for being of a particular race) doesn't make it not racism.