Week 8: Bears @ Ravens noon on CBS

[Soul]

Something seems to have changed.  I don’t recall that many successful reclamation projects at QB in the past.  Maybe coaches have figured out how to bring a guy back to square one and do a career reset after failing.

[WrigleyField 22]

21 minutes ago, BigSlick said:

I'm also on team "give young QBs more time" but there's a reason why teams don't give QBs as much time as they used to: contracts. Because of draft slotting and how contracts work, you pretty much *have* to know what you have with your QB by the end of year 3 or you're kind of boned.

 

I'd say at least 6 times out of 10 it's not the contract thats the issue. You just can't develop QBs or coach O. 

 

Like a lot of these failed QBs at some point were making average starter money and eventually average backup money, and those contracts will quickly turn into like bottom 10 starter if they're of any length. It wasn't the potential contract holding back the team, it was the coaching holding back the QB.  I say 6 out of 10 because there's still plenty of true flame outs, but at any given time I think like half the league is just gonna ruin their QB. 

 

Bears have a guy at top who is explicitly not a QB ruiner. The leash is long. 

[WrigleyField 22]

37 minutes ago, Soul said:

Something seems to have changed.  I don’t recall that many successful reclamation projects at QB in the past.  Maybe coaches have figured out how to bring a guy back to square one and do a career reset after failing.

We're still pretty new to the current economics of rookie deal lengths and size and like half of that time teams were adjusting to their willingness to adapt to college passing concepts, which now makes scouting easier.  So a lot of the first round guys are legit and you can develop them but teams suck at it and the leash is still short.

[BigSlick]

Well I guess we aren’t moving into 2nd place in the North tonight.

the Lions are a legit ass team. Yeah they dropped a couple to two good teams but man. They’re good. 
 

[Soul]

54 minutes ago, BigSlick said:

Well I guess we aren’t moving into 2nd place in the North tonight.

the Lions are a legit ass team. Yeah they dropped a couple to two good teams but man. They’re good. 
 

If that defense stays healthy they will be a tougher out this year.  They’re good.

[bukie]

Through 7 weeks, the best 4 teams have been the Lions, Seahawks, Rams and Colts, and then a significant dropoff to the rest (Chiefs are 5 on an island, then Packers and Texans, then a bunch of meh teams with varying records)

[jersey cubs fan]

2 hours ago, BigSlick said:

I'm also on team "give young QBs more time" but there's a reason why teams don't give QBs as much time as they used to: contracts. Because of draft slotting and how contracts work, you pretty much *have* to know what you have with your QB by the end of year 3 or you're kind of boned.

 

Nah, you can always just pick up the 5th year option. 
 

it has a lot more to do with coach/gm job security than contracts.

[BigbadB]

It all comes down to Caleb learning how to be an NFL QB. Watching Flacco go into Cincy and in week 2 just abusing the opponent like he's been there all year is what I expect Caleb to eventually do once he's comfortable in the system. 

Someone mentioned in the game log that they wondered if Caleb was instructed not to run downfield when the pocket was collapsing. There could be something to that. Maybe Ben wants him to not bail on his pocket protection too soon. He actually seemed like he tried to stay in the pocket when it was collapsing on Sunday. Goff is strictly a pocket passer that only runs if there is a 20 yard cushion and a clear path to that cushion. Goff has been a great fit for the offense Ben has instituted in Detroit.

[BigbadB]

20 minutes ago, BigbadB said:

It all comes down to Caleb learning how to be an NFL QB. Watching Flacco go into Cincy and in week 2 just abusing the opponent like he's been there all year is what I expect Caleb to eventually do once he's comfortable in the system. 

Someone mentioned in the game log that they wondered if Caleb was instructed not to run downfield when the pocket was collapsing. There could be something to that. Maybe Ben wants him to not bail on his pocket protection too soon. He actually seemed like he tried to stay in the pocket when it was collapsing on Sunday. Goff is strictly a pocket passer that only runs if there is a 20 yard cushion and a clear path to that cushion. Goff has been a great fit for the offense Ben has instituted in Detroit.

A big difference between Goff running Ben's offense and Caleb running Ben's offense was Goff had several years of NFL experience coming into Ben's system, while Caleb had one disastrous year under incompetent Shane Waldron. 

[BigbadB]

Beginning of the season, I expected no one to beat the Ravens. Lamar is a top QB, Henry and Hill are an amazing complement to one another. Zay Flowers, Rashod Bateman and Hopkins coupled with two bonafide pass catching TE's to go with what was expected to be a decent defense and to see them at 1-5 is arguably one of the top stories of the year.

The defense will have their work cut out for them this week. Ravens really can't afford to lose another one right now. Really need Jarrett and Booker back this week. I wouldn't even hate some sort of trade for a defensive lineman now that some teams are ready for a fire sale. The blitz might work well on Cooper Rush, but could prove to be ineffective with Lamar's legs and the field spreading pass catchers. 

Trade deadline is November 4th, so two weeks from today. I guess DL, CB and RB are the three spots one could most consider as upgradeable if the team feels like making a playoff run. 

 

[Banedon]

18 hours ago, minnesotacubsfan said:

I might be too if Loveland wasnt a huge black hole in this offense

I think both of these guys might have expanded roles later on in the season as the offense grows.  That also could be wishful thinking on my part.

[jersey cubs fan]

33 minutes ago, BigbadB said:

Beginning of the season, I expected no one to beat the Ravens. Lamar is a top QB, Henry and Hill are an amazing complement to one another. Zay Flowers, Rashod Bateman and Hopkins coupled with two bonafide pass catching TE's to go with what was expected to be a decent defense and to see them at 1-5 is arguably one of the top stories of the year.

The defense will have their work cut out for them this week. Ravens really can't afford to lose another one right now. Really need Jarrett and Booker back this week. I wouldn't even hate some sort of trade for a defensive lineman now that some teams are ready for a fire sale. The blitz might work well on Cooper Rush, but could prove to be ineffective with Lamar's legs and the field spreading pass catchers. 

Trade deadline is November 4th, so two weeks from today. I guess DL, CB and RB are the three spots one could most consider as upgradeable if the team feels like making a playoff run. 

 

I don’t trust Poles to make an in season trade. I don’t want him to do it

[gflore34]

1 hour ago, Banedon said:

I think both of these guys might have expanded roles later on in the season as the offense grows.  That also could be wishful thinking on my part.

The offense as whole hasn't clicked yet, probably won't until game 12 or so, once it does.  I don't if us Bears fans are going to able to handle it, having never seen such things before.

[WrigleyField 22]

Also, this is the offense not clicking. At some point it's ALL gonna cone together and fire on all cylinders at once

 

[BigSlick]

On Dan Bernstein's podcast they mentioned that last year (all of last year) they had only 20 big pass plays (20+ yards), this year they've already surpassed that in 6 games. Wild. 

Matt Abbattacola also intimated what I suspected, that they're specifically coaching Caleb to not scramble for yards but look for big plays downfield. Now, I dunno how much credence you give him ("people I've talked to" ok, who's that?), but it certainly looks that way, and is appropriately awkward. He just isn't doing the things that come naturally to him. And if that's the case, I'd say, stop it. He's historically been more effective when he's just feeling it on the scramble, and he is quite nifty with his legs. He doesn't generally take big shots (though obviously its a concern long term). 

I'm less worried about what Caleb is doing while scrambling than what he's doing in the pocket, in rhythm. 

On the other hand, Ben Johnson is 1000000% a smarter, more qualified offensive genius than me. So I should probably just put my faith in him, no matter how bleh it may look in the early term. 

[NorthsideAvenger]

To me, this feels like one of those games the Bears should not win but does. If they lose, it would not be the first or the last time I am wrong. 

[BigSlick]

It really does feel like the "come back to earth" game that we've seen the Bears experience in previous years. We beat up a few bums, and then we play some team that maybe fell on some tough times but has a legit offense, and the beat the everloving horsefeathers out of us. The Niners game last year is one such example I can think of. (Chargers game in '23 may apply, he Cowboys game in '22 when they dropped 49 on us, and on and on) 

Would love for this to not be a repeat of that phenomenon. 

[Soul]

Are we really going to just hand Santos his job back?  I’d rather stick with Moody, then grab some other guy off the street if he reverts and starts missing kicks.  There have been several success stories of teams signing kickers who immediately perform at a high level.  It’s a “plug n play” position.

[Banedon]

1 minute ago, Soul said:

Are we really going to just hand Santos his job back?  I’d rather stick with Moody, then grab some other guy off the street if he reverts and starts missing kicks.  There have been several success stories of teams signing kickers who immediately perform at a high level.  It’s a “plug n play” position.

Seems like a situation where they can stick with Moody, and have Santos be "injured" as long as they need to.  If Moody starts sucking, you bring Santos back. 

[gflore34]

Just now, Soul said:

Are we really going to just hand Santos his job back?  I’d rather stick with Moody, then grab some other guy off the street if he reverts and starts missing kicks.  There have been several success stories of teams signing kickers who immediately perform at a high level.  It’s a “plug n play” position.

Look no further than the Packers, grab some guy who's was about to go back to teaching or something of the like.  He hits a 62 yard FG.  Think it broke the Packers' franchise record, so yeah, these guys are out there.

[gflore34]

55 minutes ago, BigSlick said:

It really does feel like the "come back to earth" game that we've seen the Bears experience in previous years. We beat up a few bums, and then we play some team that maybe fell on some tough times but has a legit offense, and the beat the everloving horsefeathers out of us. The Niners game last year is one such example I can think of. (Chargers game in '23 may apply, he Cowboys game in '22 when they dropped 49 on us, and on and on) 

Would love for this to not be a repeat of that phenomenon. 

No "get well" game for the Ravens, I'm fine with a competitive loss.

[BigSlick]

I'd probably stick with Moody, though you gotta keep in mind this guy has had some serious accuracy issues in the past... but unfortunately as dependable as Santos has been for the past few years, he's become outclassed by the standards of the position these days. 

You need a guy who can boot it out of the endzone when you need it (Santos can't do that) and you need a guy who can at least attempt 50+ with some credibility, which Santos has done but his leg is not strong enough to make them consistently. 

[UMFan83]

this is wild: 

 

[Brian707]

Why did the run game look like one of the league's worse to one of the best overnight basically? It has to be more than the change at LT

[WrigleyField 22]

12 minutes ago, Brian707 said:

Why did the run game look like one of the league's worse to one of the best overnight basically? It has to be more than the change at LT

Think they're running more power and less zone blocking.