Cubs (Imanaga) vs Brewers (Ashby): 10/6/25, 8:08pm

[gflore34]

6 minutes ago, Cuzi said:

Maybe we should have been a little more worried about getting someone better than Imanaga at the deadline. But here we are.

Sure, but, teams, knowing the Cubs were in a bind, asks were unreasonable.  Don't think I'd been too please with Jed giving up the farm for Gallen, Kelly, Houser, etc.

[Banks-Williams]

2 hours ago, squally1313 said:

I would go with something like:

1. Turner - he's not our best hitter vs LHP, but Busch is our best hitter at the moment and we should optimize how many ABs against RHPs he gets
2. Hoerner - he's fine here against both, elite here against LHPs
3. Tucker
4. Suzuki
5. Kelly/Swanson - pretty indifferent here
6. Happ - need him here to split up the RHBs for down the stretch
7. Kelly/Swanson
8. PCA
9. Castro - unlikely Ashby pitches this deep, prefer Castro over current Shaw against a RHP with extreme splits

Need a fast guy for lead off.   PCA would be great if he could stop swinging at everything. I’ll never forget when he swung at a pitch that hit him. 

[Rcal10]

6 minutes ago, Brian707 said:

Hardly any starters were moved at the deadline to any team. Prices were just way too high

Jed usually is forced by PTR to shop at the Dollar Tree but I don't blame him this time

I blame him for forcing the Cubs into a situation where they needed pitching by not spending in the off season to add a better pitcher. But I don’t blame the FO for not paying the ridiculous prices wanted by teams dumping players. 

[Cuzi]

13 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Sure, but, teams, knowing the Cubs were in a bind, asks were unreasonable.  Don't think I'd been too please with Jed giving up the farm for Gallen, Kelly, Houser, etc.

Do you have any idea what the asks were? I dont.

All I know is that in a year where you go all out on a 1 year deal for Tucker, you should be willing to meet the asking price to capitalize on that 1 year. We were talking about the need for starting pitching during winter. So it's not like this is something that just snuck up at the deadline.

As it sits, the Tucker deal looks more like a move to save ones job. Mission accomplished I suppose.

Edited October 6, 2025 by Cuzi

[Southpaw19]

4 minutes ago, Cuzi said:

Do you have any idea what the asks were? I dont.

All I know is that in a year where you go all out on a 1 year deal for Tucker, you should be willing to meet the asking price to capitalize on that 1 year. We were talking about the need for starting pitching during winter. So it's not like this is something that just snuck up at the deadline.

It's been reported several times that the ask for a SP with controllable years was Horton, Shaw, and Caissie.

[Stratos]

2 hours ago, Irrelevant Dude said:

They are really searching for stories if this is one of them.  How does what music is played in the stadium during warmups impact anyone at all?  Is there some hatred of classic rock now that I don't know about?

I've learned this series that the Brewers and their fans really, really hate the Cubs and Cubs fans.   I get it though.  The fans I get but the team trolling is a bit low, unless it's all just a coincidence, which I doubt.

[I owned a Suzuki]

I would go 

Hoerner, Shaw, Tucker Suzuki, Happ and so on

[BigSlick]

I feel pretty blah about this series and the Cubs chances but its baseball and anything can happen and go the horsefeathers out there and beat the horsefeathers out of them 

[CubUgly]

40 minutes ago, Brian707 said:

Hardly any starters were moved at the deadline to any team. Prices were just way too high

Jed usually is forced by PTR to shop at the Dollar Tree but I don't blame him this time

Do you think Bieber would have helped us?  Toronto got him for not too much it seems.  I wonder if we made an offer for him? 

[Jason Ross]

4 minutes ago, CubUgly said:

Do you think Bieber would have helped us?  Toronto got him for not too much it seems.  I wonder if we made an offer for him? 

Toronto gave up a prospect who was on Fangraph's top-100 mid-season list and currently ranked 73rd on their list. While I think Jaxon Wiggins is a better prospect than Khal Stephan, the pitcher that went back to Cleveland in that deal, he's also probably the closest 1:1 comp in our system. 

Pitching prospects are always a little all over the place, and Eric Logenhagen at FG seems to be among the high-water-marks for their feelings on Stephan, but I would also caution you into saying they got him for not too much. Even if you think he's a little high, and you've got him more in the 125 range, the Blue Jays gave up a top-125 prospect for a pitcher who hadn't even made an appearance past A-ball on the season and who they got 7 regular season starts of. In terms of value, the Jays/Guardians swap was likely among the largest prices paid.

[Rcal10]

30 minutes ago, I owned a Suzuki said:

I would go 

Hoerner, Shaw, Tucker Suzuki, Happ and so on

What has Shaw done to be batting second? This is a terrible idea. And where is Busch? 

Edited October 6, 2025 by Rcal10

[I owned a Suzuki]

1 minute ago, Rcal10 said:

What has Shaw done to be batting second? This is a terrible idea. And where is Busch? 

If Shaw comes up against a RH later in the game if runners are on,PH for him. I would have Busch behind Happ or between Kelly and Swanson. Its just my counter to starting Ashby. Could put Swanson at 2 also. 

[gflore34]

13 minutes ago, BigSlick said:

I feel pretty blah about this series and the Cubs chances but its baseball and anything can happen and go the horsefeathers out there and beat the horsefeathers out of them 

I'm teetering along the same lines, I think it'd really sweet if the Cubs could get this one tonight.  Put all the pressure on the Brewers going into Chicago.  Realistically, neither of these teams is going to beat the Dodgers or Phillies.  It's baseball anything can happen, we've seen not so good WC teams make the WS, we've seen not good teams win the WS.

[squally1313]

9 minutes ago, Jason Ross said:

Toronto gave up a prospect who was on Fangraph's top-100 mid-season list and currently ranked 73rd on their list. While I think Jaxon Wiggins is a better prospect than Khal Stephan, the pitcher that went back to Cleveland in that deal, he's also probably the closest 1:1 comp in our system. 

Pitching prospects are always a little all over the place, and Eric Logenhagen at FG seems to be among the high-water-marks for their feelings on Stephan, but I would also caution you into saying they got him for not too much. Even if you think he's a little high, and you've got him more in the 125 range, the Blue Jays gave up a top-125 prospect for a pitcher who hadn't even made an appearance past A-ball on the season and who they got 7 regular season starts of. In terms of value, the Jays/Guardians swap was likely among the largest prices paid.

I'm so torn on this because it feels like we're, again, letting Jed off the hook here. I know Jaxon Wiggins is the hot pitching name at a time where we are, as we are currently discussing, very short on pitching. But like...just using the FG list, which is making the price paid seem as high as possible.....would anyone be that upset right now about Alcantara (30ish slots higher) having gotten moved for Bieber? Which would be even more of an overpay. Should I be? Maybe, almost certainly on a aggregate WAR or WAR/dollar basis. But man, I have to tune in tonight and hope that they pick the right time to turn to Colin Rea before Shota gives up a dong when we are 11 wins away from a World Series. And that sucks. 

[Rcal10]

1 minute ago, I owned a Suzuki said:

If Shaw comes up against a RH later in the game if runners are on,PH for him. I would have Busch behind Happ or between Kelly and Swanson. Its just my counter to starting Ashby. Could put Swanson at 2 also. 

I think it is an overreaction. Shaw shouldn’t be near the top of the line up. Maybe he should be on the bench. Maybe Swanson second. Nico, Swanson, Tucker, Seiya, Busch, Happ, Kelly, PCA, Castro? 

[Derwood]

I non-pacific time zone game starting after 9pm eastern is ludicrous

[CubUgly]

3 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

I'm teetering along the same lines, I think it'd really sweet if the Cubs could get this one tonight.  Put all the pressure on the Brewers going into Chicago.  Realistically, neither of these teams is going to beat the Dodgers or Phillies.  It's baseball anything can happen, we've seen not so good WC teams make the WS, we've seen not good teams win the WS.

Yeah, I'm about in the same boat. My expectations are not very high to win tonight and I'm not very positive about our chances tonight and therefore of course the series.  

But let's play the game and see, I'd just like to go down swinging both figuratively and literally. 

[BigSlick]

7 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

I'm teetering along the same lines, I think it'd really sweet if the Cubs could get this one tonight.  Put all the pressure on the Brewers going into Chicago.  Realistically, neither of these teams is going to beat the Dodgers or Phillies.  It's baseball anything can happen, we've seen not so good WC teams make the WS, we've seen not good teams win the WS.

the 2006 Cardinals should be motivation enough for everyone to be excited your team is in the playoffs and roll the dice

[Rcal10]

1 minute ago, squally1313 said:

I'm so torn on this because it feels like we're, again, letting Jed off the hook here. I know Jaxon Wiggins is the hot pitching name at a time where we are, as we are currently discussing, very short on pitching. But like...just using the FG list, which is making the price paid seem as high as possible.....would anyone be that upset right now about Alcantara (30ish slots higher) having gotten moved for Bieber? Which would be even more of an overpay. Should I be? Maybe, almost certainly on a aggregate WAR or WAR/dollar basis. But man, I have to tune in tonight and hope that they pick the right time to turn to Colin Rea before Shota gives up a dong when we are 11 wins away from a World Series. And that sucks. 

Letting Jed off the hook for not making a  deadline deal is not the same as letting off the hook for the lack of another option as a starting pitcher. He is the guy responsible for them being so short of pitching options at the deadline. He should have know the costs would be ridiculous and made whatever move necessary in the off season. While I don’t blame him for not paying the prices needed, I do blame him for the entire situation. Based on who did get moved, IMO, Kelly shouldn’t of been who they traded for. I think he was cheaper than Bieber. 

[Bertz]

Craig is doing the Busch gambit, I approve

 

[Jason Ross]

10 minutes ago, squally1313 said:

I'm so torn on this because it feels like we're, again, letting Jed off the hook here. I know Jaxon Wiggins is the hot pitching name at a time where we are, as we are currently discussing, very short on pitching. But like...just using the FG list, which is making the price paid seem as high as possible.....would anyone be that upset right now about Alcantara (30ish slots higher) having gotten moved for Bieber? Which would be even more of an overpay. Should I be? Maybe, almost certainly on a aggregate WAR or WAR/dollar basis. But man, I have to tune in tonight and hope that they pick the right time to turn to Colin Rea before Shota gives up a dong when we are 11 wins away from a World Series. And that sucks. 

Listen, I wrote a whole article on bitching about the Cubs not getting a SP at the deadline; that isn't me defending Jed Hoyer. But saying that Toronto didn't pay a very high price for Bieber is also not appropriate. So I think I'd say two things are going on here:

1. I think the Cubs should have probably paid for something more - be it a SP, or another impact RP like David Bednar. 
2. Toronto paid a lot for Shane Bieber.

I was one of the people here suggesting they trade for Sandy Alcantara (who's been excellent) and Edward Cabrera (who's been excellent). So I don't want to let him off the hook. And that post you quotes wasn't about Jed at all. Only that, I don't think it's fair to undersell the price the Blue Jays paid. Khal Stephan was a good prospect given up for Shane Bieber. Which is cool! Sometimes you pay up. 

[squally1313]

1 minute ago, Rcal10 said:

Letting Jed off the hook for not making a  deadline deal is not the same as letting off the hook for the lack of another option as a starting pitcher. He is the guy responsible for them being so short of pitching options at the deadline. He should have know the costs would be ridiculous and made whatever move necessary in the off season. While I don’t blame him for not paying the prices needed, I do blame him for the entire situation. Based on who did get moved, IMO, Kelly shouldn’t of been who they traded for. I think he was cheaper than Bieber. 

I think I'm mostly just talking to myself here as a guy who has been accused of being a Jed/front office apologist. We ended the offseason with a big hypothetical pile of unspent cash and myself and others were like 'it's fine, we should be good enough to win high 80s-90 games (which at the time, seemed more than enough to carry the division)....let's keep the powder dry for the midseason acquisitions that are definitely coming'. And then July came and went and it was like 'well, that would have been stupid to make a meaningful acquisition'. And here we are, at least a starter short, probably more, with that pile of cash sitting safely in Tom's bank account.

[Rcal10]

10 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

I'm teetering along the same lines, I think it'd really sweet if the Cubs could get this one tonight.  Put all the pressure on the Brewers going into Chicago.  Realistically, neither of these teams is going to beat the Dodgers or Phillies.  It's baseball anything can happen, we've seen not so good WC teams make the WS, we've seen not good teams win the WS.

One sentence you say realistically neither the Cubs or the Brewers can beat the Dodger or Phillies and then the next sentence you say it is baseball, so anything can happen. So which is it? Personally I think because it is baseball whoever wins this series has a realistic chance of going to the WS. Not 50/50,  but not that unrealistic either. 

[squally1313]

1 minute ago, Jason Ross said:

Listen, I wrote a whole article on bitching about the Cubs not getting a SP at the deadline; that isn't me defending Jed Hoyer. But saying that Toronto didn't pay a very high price for Bieber is also not appropriate. So I think I'd say two things are going on here:

1. I think the Cubs should have probably paid for something more - be it a SP, or another impact RP like David Bednar. 
2. Toronto paid a lot for Shane Bieber.

Yeah but I think you're being a little unfair in a couple places. One, making the comparison to Wiggins multiple times, who is ranked higher than Stephan in the highest Stephan ranking, and also looked at around here as the next Horton. And two, calling it seven starts, because he's making an EXTREMELY important 8th start in a couple days here.

[Bertz]

2 minutes ago, Jason Ross said:

Listen, I wrote a whole article on bitching about the Cubs not getting a SP at the deadline; that isn't me defending Jed Hoyer. But saying that Toronto didn't pay a very high price for Bieber is also not appropriate. So I think I'd say two things are going on here:

1. I think the Cubs should have probably paid for something more - be it a SP, or another impact RP like David Bednar. 
2. Toronto paid a lot for Shane Bieber.

I was one of the people here suggesting they trade for Sandy Alcantara (who's been excellent) and Edward Cabrera (who's been excellent). So I don't want to let him off the hook. And that post you quotes wasn't about Jed at all. Only that, I don't think it's fair to undersell the price the Blue Jays paid. Khal Stephan was a good prospect given up for Shane Bieber. Which is cool! Sometimes you pay up. 

Yeah i think knowing now what the sticker price was for SP IMO the answer is that Taylor Rogers should have instead been David Bednar or Griffin Jax.