Royals (Cameron) vs Cubs (Brasier): 7/21/25, 7:05pm

[chibears55]

4 minutes ago, JBears79 said:

That's my point though. The fact that we dont have one of those guys with our resources is a massive problem. 

Imanaga is a guy we can trust to match up well against any opposing number one they will face in the postseason.

After him is the question...

Boyd is having a career year for himself, can he continue and continue it into the postseason is questionable, let hope so.

The number 3 guy in the postseason rotation is where Hoyer needs to put his big boy GM pants on and figure out who and how to bring in another quality starter to go with Imanaga and Boyd, preferably one that can match up and pitch game 2, with Boyd being questionable for now as far as if he can continue having this great season, having him match up against opponents number 3 would be preferable.

[Soul]

Just now, Outshined_One said:

The fact that you're the level-headed voice of reason in this thread speaks volumes here.

In real life I’m extremely level-headed, ask anyone.

[Bobson Dugnutt]

2 minutes ago, Soul said:

In real life I’m extremely level-headed, ask anyone.

Please submit 3-4 personal references.

[JBears79]

Just now, squally1313 said:

Yes, why didn’t we use our massive resources to…draft Paul Skenes first overall. This is uniquely a cubs problem. 
 

Linking your arguments, it’s weird how there are only five pitchers, but at least one of them is a brewer, as they are the only team that can win the WS, which is backed by zero statistical analysis (Boyd has been better than peralta by every metric this year). It’s almost like you crafted a narrative that is as negative as possible. 

The Cubs are in the bottom half of the league as a collective pitching staff. 21st overall. Its a staff that doesnt strike guys out (27th in k/9), gives up a lot of homeruns (22nd in the league) and relies on weak contact and strong defense to carry it which isnt great when your staff doesnt generate a ton of groundballs.

Its a uniquely Cubs problem that we havent drafted and developed or signed one in years. Even Jon Lester, who is an outstanding big game pitcher and a hall of very good pitcher, was no where near the level of ace that a big time organization like the Cubs should have every year. Look at the Yankees, Max Fried (Cole when healthy), Look at the Mets, Kodai Senga, Look at the Phillies Zach Wheeler, Tigers Tarik Skubal, Dodgers Yamamoto, Astros Hunter Brown, Brewers have Peralta, Misorowski, Woodruff. The only other team even comparable to us in pitching is the Blue Jays but they are a pretender. 

The Cubs have Matthew Boyd, a guy on pace to hit his career innings that he hit one time almost 6 years ago and Shota a fly ball pitcher coming off injury. I dont trust either of those guys for a deep playoff run. We have every single reason to be concerned about the Cubs pitching staff and their lack depth and a go to ace.

[JBears79]

16 minutes ago, chibears55 said:

Imanaga is a guy we can trust to match up well against any opposing number one they will face in the postseason.

After him is the question...

Boyd is having a career year for himself, can he continue and continue it into the postseason is questionable, let hope so.

The number 3 guy in the postseason rotation is where Hoyer needs to put his big boy GM pants on and figure out who and how to bring in another quality starter to go with Imanaga and Boyd, preferably one that can match up and pitch game 2, with Boyd being questionable for now as far as if he can continue having this great season, having him match up against opponents number 3 would be preferable.

I dont trust Shota. Hes prone to the home run and a fly ball guy. He also lacks the power profile youd look for in an elite starter. Hes good sure but I dont trust him.

[gflore34]

4 minutes ago, JBears79 said:

The Cubs are in the bottom half of the league as a collective pitching staff. 21st overall. Its a staff that doesnt strike guys out (27th in k/9), gives up a lot of homeruns (22nd in the league) and relies on weak contact and strong defense to carry it which isnt great when your staff doesnt generate a ton of groundballs.

Its a uniquely Cubs problem that we havent drafted and developed or signed one in years. Even Jon Lester, who is an outstanding big game pitcher and a hall of very good pitcher, was no where near the level of ace that a big time organization like the Cubs should have every year. Look at the Yankees, Max Fried (Cole when healthy), Look at the Mets, Kodai Senga, Look at the Phillies Zach Wheeler, Tigers Tarik Skubal, Dodgers Yamamoto, Astros Hunter Brown, Brewers have Peralta, Misorowski, Woodruff. The only other team even comparable to us in pitching is the Blue Jays but they are a pretender. 

The Cubs have Matthew Boyd, a guy on pace to hit his career innings that he hit one time almost 6 years ago and Shota a fly ball pitcher coming off injury. I dont trust either of those guys for a deep playoff run. We have every single reason to be concerned about the Cubs pitching staff and their lack depth and a go to ace.

Lester is who choose to site?  Completely, ignoring the fact that Jake Arrieta was damn near un-hittable in 2015/2016 and certainly a big time ace along the likes of any of the above pitchers?

[chibears55]

11 minutes ago, JBears79 said:

I dont trust Shota. Hes prone to the home run and a fly ball guy. He also lacks the power profile youd look for in an elite starter. Hes good sure but I dont trust him.

Sorry to say this, but you probably should just stop watching then if you have zero confidence in any of these guys.

I mean, what the point of watching the rest of the season if you dont expect them to succeed or be competitive enough to win games the rest of year and into the postseason?

Imanaga their guy, if you have no confidence in him winning games in the postseason, like i said you might as well stop watching 

🤷‍♂️

[JBears79]

7 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Lester is who choose to site?  Completely, ignoring the fact that Jake Arrieta was damn near un-hittable in 2015/2016 and certainly a big time ace along the likes of any of the above pitchers?

Very true. Arrieta is a great example. 2nd half of 2015 and the first half of 2016. He was great. He fell off in the back half of 2016 a bit but he had a great run.

[JBears79]

Just now, chibears55 said:

Sorry to say this, but you probably should just stop watching then if you have zero confidence in any of these guys.

I mean, what the point of watching the rest of the season if you dont expect them to succeed or be competitive enough to win games the rest of year and into the postseason?

Imanaga their guy, if you have no confidence in him winning games in the postseason, like i said you might as well stop watching 

🤷‍♂️

I'm a Cubs fan. Why stop watching because I dont have confidence in those pitchers? That doesnt make any sense to me. 

[Brian707]

[gflore34]

11 minutes ago, JBears79 said:

Very true. Arrieta is a great example. 2nd half of 2015 and the first half of 2016. He was great. He fell off in the back half of 2016 a bit but he had a great run.

Also, 2016 Jon Lester, was really horsefeathers good, 5.6 WAR, 19-5, 2.44 ERA, 3.41 FIP, Freddy Peralta, for example, has not come close to matching those numbers...ever.

[Derwood]

42 minutes ago, gflore34 said:

Also, 2016 Jon Lester, was really horsefeathers good, 5.6 WAR, 19-5, 2.44 ERA, 3.41 FIP, Freddy Peralta, for example, has not come close to matching those numbers...ever.

But he's not an ACE because REASONS

[squally1313]

2 minutes ago, Derwood said:

But he's not an ACE because REASONS

He’s certainly no Jacob Misier-whatever 

[chibears55]

1 hour ago, JBears79 said:

I'm a Cubs fan. Why stop watching because I dont have confidence in those pitchers? That doesnt make any sense to me. 

Just saying that it cant be much enjoyable for you to continue watching if you have low confidence in those SP, especially Imanaga, to win games the rest of season or in the postseason, what the joy in that ?

 

 

 

[gflore34]

9 minutes ago, Derwood said:

But he's not an ACE because REASONS

Add to that, 3-1, 2.02 ERA, 3.15 FIP in the playoffs + WS but, he didn't accomplish that throwing 200 MPH so, I guess it doesn't count.

[muntjack]

There are grind-it-out, gutsy- performance aces and there are blow- you-away, high-octane, no-hit-threat aces.

Obviously this is not a scientific analysis,  but I can see the desire,  at least from a fan perspective, to have one of the latter fronting your rotation, especially heading into the playoffs. 

Unfortunately, those kinds of guys aren't common, or commonly available. 

 

 

[chibears55]

2 hours ago, muntjack said:

There are grind-it-out, gutsy- performance aces and there are blow- you-away, high-octane, no-hit-threat aces.

Obviously this is not a scientific analysis,  but I can see the desire,  at least from a fan perspective, to have one of the latter fronting your rotation, especially heading into the playoffs. 

Unfortunately, those kinds of guys aren't common, or commonly available. 

 

 

Those guys are pretty much extinct now, because teams dont build up their pitching in their system to throw over 100 pitches to go 8-9 innings anymore.

SP are being brought up to go about 90 pitches and hope it can get them into the 7th at best, but in most cases the red flag is being waved once a SP hits 80 pitches or the 3rd time through a batting order, and yes theres a very small amount of starters now that can actually be counted on to get outs a third time through. 

 

[muntjack]

I just meant guys in the Skenes, Skubal, Degrom, Misiorowski, 2015 Arrieta mold.  Wicked stuff that plays even when they are shaky.