Dempster Traded to Texas for 3B Villanueva & RHP Hendricks

[davell]

Knobler brought up a good point with the Dodgers, in regards to Dempster: We'd rather pay money in order to receive better prospects, while they'd rather take the contract and offer a lesser return. I'm starting to think Dempster winds up in Atlanta or maybe Toronto, if they stick around.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Knobler brought up a good point with the Dodgers, in regards to Dempster: We'd rather pay money in order to receive better prospects, while they'd rather take the contract and offer a lesser return. I'm starting to think Dempster winds up in Atlanta or maybe Toronto, if they stick around.

 

That should be a given. The point behind this debacle of a season was to build for the future. Money didn't enter into it. When trading anybody, it should be all about the players we get in return, salary relief be damned.

[davell]

Knobler brought up a good point with the Dodgers, in regards to Dempster: We'd rather pay money in order to receive better prospects, while they'd rather take the contract and offer a lesser return. I'm starting to think Dempster winds up in Atlanta or maybe Toronto, if they stick around.

 

That should be a given. The point behind this debacle of a season was to build for the future. Money didn't enter into it. When trading anybody, it should be all about the players we get in return, salary relief be damned.

 

 

I think it's been widely known for a while that we were looking to pay salary in order to receive a better prospect. It really hadn't occured to me that the Dodgers would actually balk at it. Maybe they're more likely to go after Wandy, or even Greinke, since Houston and Milwaukee probably want some salary relief.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Yankees placed LHP Andy Pettitte on the 15-day disabled list with a left ankle fracture.

Pettitte will not need surgery to repair the fracture, but the Yankees have now officially ruled him out for two months. It's a tough break for the 40-year-old left-hander, who has really surprised during his comeback by posting a 3.22 ERA and 59/13 K/BB ratio in 58 2/3 innings. With CC Sabathia (groin) also injured, Adam Warren and Freddy Garcia will be given opportunities in the starting rotation.

 

So basically, he'd be making rehab appearences by late August. They need pitching. While they don't have anything worth Garza, we should be selling them on Dempster for a package built around Mason Williams. Unless the Braves really are willing to send us Tejeran or Minor, I can't imagine anything better coming back for 3 months of Dempster. They also have a 20 year old OF in A named Tyler Austin, their #14 prospect who's hitting .329/.410/.627/1.036 in 65 games. What's more, he's 6'2, 160 lbs so chances are he'll get bigger and develope even more power. If we could get 1 or both of those 2, Dempster's theirs. If they want to give us both + Banuelos or Betances, they can have Garza. I should add by that I mean, just Garza, not both.

[davell]

No, on any Yankee package for Garza. I could rectify and say if they sent Sanchez, Williams, Austin, and Gumbs, then sure. Because it's a massive overpay. But realistically, if Garza is dealt, same with Dempster, we need pitching. Betances is walking a batter an inning, is 25, and looks like a bullpen arm at best. Banuelos had an MRI on his elbow, which evidently was clean, but hasn't pitched for a month and will miss another month too? No thank you. If they send one of the four position prospects for Dempster, fine, it's solid value. Otherwise, we can find what we want and need elsewhere.

[Little Slide Rooter]

But again, we shouldn't be fixated on pitching, becasue like the draft, we should be focused on the best prospects we can get, regardless of position. I have no problem shooting for the moon with Garza due to the fact that he still has another year under team control, and we can always extend him or trade him this time next year, but with Dempster we don't have that leverage.

[davell]

I understand. But the Red Sox, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cardinals, Braves, Tigers, and Royals all have pitching. The Yankees, White Sox, and Orioles(for Garza anyway) do not. If one of those last 3 teams wants to overpay, fine. Otherwise, if the packages are close, we need to take the package with as much pitching as possible.

[Backtobanks]

I understand. But the Red Sox, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cardinals, Braves, Tigers, and Royals all have pitching. The Yankees, White Sox, and Orioles(for Garza anyway) do not. If one of those last 3 teams wants to overpay, fine. Otherwise, if the packages are close, we need to take the package with as much pitching as possible.

 

After trading Garza and Dempster, the most obvious holes on the team for 2013 and beyond is pitching. We have to get back pitching unless the FO is going to trade some position prospects for young pitchers during the offseason,

[Little Slide Rooter]

I understand. But the Red Sox, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cardinals, Braves, Tigers, and Royals all have pitching. The Yankees, White Sox, and Orioles(for Garza anyway) do not. If one of those last 3 teams wants to overpay, fine. Otherwise, if the packages are close, we need to take the package with as much pitching as possible.

 

After trading Garza and Dempster, the most obvious holes on the team for 2013 and beyond is pitching. We have to get back pitching unless the FO is going to trade some position prospects for young pitchers during the offseason,

 

Yes, we need pitching, but quality pitching. We don't want to trade the few assets we have for a bunch of, well, the pitchers we currently have throughout the organization. If nobody's offering top pitching prospects, but we can get a few top hitting prospects, wouldn't you rather that? Basically, if it comes down to ending up with a few top 100 position player prospects, or a few fringy pitching prospects from someone's top 10-15 simply because they were the best pitchers offered up, which would you rather have? Spoiler alert: fringy pitching prospects form the back of most teams top 10-15 tend to turn into Casey Coleman or Chris Rusin.

[davell]

As I just laid out, every single team that's after Dempster or Garza has good pitching prospects. Top 100 guys. Most of those teams have more than one of them. So again, unless the Yankees basically offer 3 top 100 type hitters, against 2 top 100 pitchers from everyone else, you take the pitching, because we have legit cases to be made that there's not a single pitcher inside our organizations top 10 prospects.

[Little Slide Rooter]

But the question is, are they desperate enough for pitching that they'll give up those top 100 guys for Dempster? Right now, the Yankees are near desperate for pitching, and as a result, are more likely to give up top prospects for 3 months of Dempster than say the Braves or Tigers. If offered, I'd take a few top position player prospects from the Yankees for Dempster, and then shop the more valuable Garza to the teams with more pitching to offer. More importantly, pitchers that we wouldn't get for Dempster.

[davell]

First, we're not getting multiple top prospects for Dempster, under any circumstance. If you're asking whether I'd take a slightly better headliner if it's a hitter in a Dempster deal, yeah, I would. But, from everything we've heard, the Yanks don't think Dempster can pitch in the AL East anyway. I'd prefer to deal him to the Braves, with Sean Gilmartin being the main piece coming back. Or the Dodgers with Garrett Gould. Eovaldi, if Ned's stupid that day. It'd take Williams, Sanchez, or Austin to trump those guys. And they don't trump Eovaldi, in my mind anyway. My guess is the Yanks go get Liriano.

[Backtobanks]

I understand. But the Red Sox, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cardinals, Braves, Tigers, and Royals all have pitching. The Yankees, White Sox, and Orioles(for Garza anyway) do not. If one of those last 3 teams wants to overpay, fine. Otherwise, if the packages are close, we need to take the package with as much pitching as possible.

 

After trading Garza and Dempster, the most obvious holes on the team for 2013 and beyond is pitching. We have to get back pitching unless the FO is going to trade some position prospects for young pitchers during the offseason,

 

Yes, we need pitching, but quality pitching. We don't want to trade the few assets we have for a bunch of, well, the pitchers we currently have throughout the organization. If nobody's offering top pitching prospects, but we can get a few top hitting prospects, wouldn't you rather that? Basically, if it comes down to ending up with a few top 100 position player prospects, or a few fringy pitching prospects from someone's top 10-15 simply because they were the best pitchers offered up, which would you rather have? Spoiler alert: fringy pitching prospects form the back of most teams top 10-15 tend to turn into Casey Coleman or Chris Rusin.

 

I understand what you're saying, but Garza has to get us top pitching prospects back or else don't trade him. Dempster obviously is a different situation. A lot can happen by the time the Cubs are a solid team, but right now all I see in the future is a decent Wood and a shaky Samardzija in the rotation and a decent Russell in the bullpen. That's miles away from a decent pitching staff.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I understand. But the Red Sox, Dodgers, Blue Jays, Rangers, Cardinals, Braves, Tigers, and Royals all have pitching. The Yankees, White Sox, and Orioles(for Garza anyway) do not. If one of those last 3 teams wants to overpay, fine. Otherwise, if the packages are close, we need to take the package with as much pitching as possible.

 

After trading Garza and Dempster, the most obvious holes on the team for 2013 and beyond is pitching. We have to get back pitching unless the FO is going to trade some position prospects for young pitchers during the offseason,

 

Yes, we need pitching, but quality pitching. We don't want to trade the few assets we have for a bunch of, well, the pitchers we currently have throughout the organization. If nobody's offering top pitching prospects, but we can get a few top hitting prospects, wouldn't you rather that? Basically, if it comes down to ending up with a few top 100 position player prospects, or a few fringy pitching prospects from someone's top 10-15 simply because they were the best pitchers offered up, which would you rather have? Spoiler alert: fringy pitching prospects form the back of most teams top 10-15 tend to turn into Casey Coleman or Chris Rusin.

 

I understand what you're saying, but Garza has to get us top pitching prospects back or else don't trade him. Dempster obviously is a different situation. A lot can happen by the time the Cubs are a solid team, but right now all I see in the future is a decent Wood and a shaky Samardzija in the rotation and a decent Russell in the bullpen. That's miles away from a decent pitching staff.

 

I agree with that for the most part. Pitching is our biggest need, however if no blue chip pitching prospects were on the board but we were able to get something like Castalannos, Porcello, and low level prospect I'd take it. Unless, of course the plan was to extend him and try and win in the next few years.

[SouthSideRyan]

Instead of Rick Porcello, let's pursue Jamey Wright. They're pretty much interchangeable.

[jersey cubs fan]

Bruce Miles ‏@BruceMiles2112

#Cubs Dempster probably won't start til after break

 

Bruce Miles ‏@BruceMiles2112

#Cubs considering Coleman or Volstad for Tuesday's start in Atlanta

[davell]

If that's the case, he'll have 4 starts max, to show he's healthy.

[pccubfan]

Bruce Miles ‏@BruceMiles2112

#Cubs Dempster probably won't start til after break

 

So it went from being pre-cautionary to sitting for a month.

 

As a GM, that would concern me. Dempster isn't going to get traded until the very end of July, if then, and isn't going to net near as much as we had hoped.

[17 Seconds]

like i said, disaster.

[Sammy Sofa]

No, it's OK, the worse they are the better they'll be when they're good. That's how it works, right?

[treebird]

these trade talks must have really heated up if the cubs are going to have to pretend dempster is hurt for a whole month

[Little Slide Rooter]

Instead of Rick Porcello, let's pursue Jamey Wright. They're pretty much interchangeable.

 

The would be an acceptable response, had I suggested that Porcello be the centerpiece of the deal.

[davell]

Heyman says the Dodgers want Dempster and are the favorites to get him.

[Vinestal]

Heyman says the Dodgers want Dempster and are the favorites to get him.

What can we get from the dodgers as far as pitching?

[davell]

Garrett Gould and Shawn Tolleson would be an excellent package, in my mind.