Cubs Acquire Garza for Archer, Lee, Guyer, Chirinos & Fuld

[Backtobanks]

Why does this have to be considered a "win now" move? Garza is going to be 27 this season and we've got him for 2 more after that. Sure, he'll help this year, but this move is more for the future than it is for 2011, if you ask me.

 

The NL Central is loaded with question marks and this trade moves the Cubs up to the status of "teams that could win IF". I would think that many Cub front office people are looking at a decent run in 2011 and serious contention in 2012 without saying it out loud.

[Cubswin11]

Wish we still had Rothschild around for Garza. Sounds like he has great stuff, but seems like he could use some refining to take the step from a good #2-3 to an ace.

[Illini Iceman]

Why does this have to be considered a "win now" move? Garza is going to be 27 this season and we've got him for 2 more after that. Sure, he'll help this year, but this move is more for the future than it is for 2011, if you ask me.

 

Seriously.

 

The fact is that the Cubs still have a very high payroll and I have to think that Ricketts wants them to be at least competitive for that kind of cost. It is not like the payroll is $30M and they can just call it a rebuilding year. Realistic or not, when you have an over $100M payroll you aren't going to just roll over for two years and watch attendance and TV ratings tank while you have that kind of expense on the books.

 

That might not be a great pure baseball strategy, but it is a business as well. Moves like this at least keep the fans interested enough to keep them coming to games and there is enough talent out there that if a few guys have strong years and the team avoids key injuries the playoffs are not out of the question.

[Cubswin11]

Highly doubt this is true, from some blog. But this guy says the pitching prospect coming to the Cubs is either Matt Moore, Alex Torres, or Braulio Lara.

 

http://cubsrumorsandnews.blogspot.com/2011/01/cubs-trade-for-matt-garza.html

 

 

No way I see Moore coming over

[davell]

Moore has about as much chance as Evan Longoria does, as far as being the last person in this deal.

 

I'll be shocked if this last person is anyone who'd even make our top 30 prospects personally.

[seanhopper]

(@CarrieMuskat) #Cubs get Garza, OF Fernando Perez and LHP Zachary Rosscup for Archer, Hak-Ju Lee, Guyer, Chirinos and Fuld

 

So the Hendry got nothing more than Garza back. Rosscup's #'s look decent in low A ball, but he doesn't show up on any prospect lists.

[davell]

Per Miles' blog: Other prospect is LHP Zachary Rosscup. 22 years old, drafted in 29th round in 2009, yet to make full season debut.

[David]

Rangers tried to get Garza and almost did

According to Peter Gammons, the Rangers went hard after Matt Garza this week. Club officials made it clear this winter that they were interested in Garza and apparently they tried very hard.

 

Gammons said the Rangers tried to get outfielder Robinson Chirinos from the Cubs and package him in a deal along with pitchers Derek Holland and Frank Francisco, and Minor League outfielder Engel Beltre.

 

But the Rays preferred what they were getting from Chicago because the Cubs were willing to put pitcher Chris Archer in the deal. A source said the Rays were close to doing business with the Rangers, but told the Cubs they could get Garza if they included Archer in the deal.

 

The Cubs huddled and decided to do the deal. If they had said no, the Rangers would have added Garza to the rotation. The Rays ultimately really wanted Archer.

[Guest]

Per Miles' blog: Other prospect is LHP Zachary Rosscup. 22 years old, drafted in 29th round in 2009, yet to make full season debut.

 

4.5 K/BB, nice.

 

Also: http://www.myspace.com/zacisback

[CubsWin]

Also: http://www.myspace.com/zacisback

 

This is what he wrote in his profile "Im Zac. im a very nice and very fun person who is very outgoing and up for anything. i will do anything to have fun at any time."

 

Anything? At any time? Whoa. This dude's intense.

 

"Hey, Zac, it's 4:13am, let's smoke crack and go inner tubing down the St. Lawrence River!"

"Rock and roll, dude! You're on!"

[TruffleShuffle]

sounds like he swings, and i'm not talking about a baseball bat. except if you use baseball bat as a euphemism for a body part.

[PrimeTime]

Trade is officially completed per Roto. Heres some of their takes on the top guys in the deal

 

Cubs acquired RHP Matt Garza, OF Fernando Perez and LHP Zachary Rosscup from the Rays for RHP Chris Archer, SS Hak-Ju Lee, C Robinson Chirinos, OF Brandon Guyer and OF Sam Fuld.

 

A Cubs rotation with Garza, Ryan Dempster, Carlos Zambrano and two from the group of Randy Wells, Tom Gorzelanny and Carlos Silva looks pretty good. Still, Garza isn't exactly a top-flight pitcher and the Cubs gave up four significant talents to bring him in; they're going to regret it unless this is the year Garza takes that step forward. Since the rotation is crowded, there's a good chance they'll trade Gorzelanny now

 

 

Rays acquired RHP Chris Archer, SS Hak-Ju Lee, C Robinson Chirinos, OF Brandon Guyer and OF Sam Fuld from the Cubs for RHP Matt Garza, OF Fernando Perez and LHP Zachary Rosscup.

 

Archer, 22, went 15-3 with a 2.34 ERA between Single-A Daytona and Double-A Tennessee last season. Probably the Cubs' top pitching prospect, he has No. 2 starter ability if improved command comes with experience. The Rays probably won't need him this year, but it's possible he'll make the jump in the second half if injuries strike.

 

Shortstop Hak-Ju Lee was sent from the Cubs to the Rays in the Matt Garza deal.

 

Starlin Castro made Lee expendable in Chicago, but the 20-year-old projects as a fine starting starting shortstop. He hit .282/.354/.361 in low-A ball last year, and some power should come with age. He's not going to help the Rays before 2013, but he might be the most valuable player to come out of this deal.

 

Heres the others we received

 

OF Fernando Perez and LHP Zachary Rosscup were acquired by the Cubs as part of the Matt Garza deal.

 

Perez missed most of 2009 with a dislocated wrist and then struggled upon returning last season, batting .223/.280/.299 for Triple-A Durham. Back in 2008, he was looking like a potentially excellent fourth outfielder with a pretty good bat and plenty of speed and defense. His bat needs to bounce back, but he could prove very useful for the Cubs, particularly if Kosuke Fukudome gets moved. Rosscup, a 28th-round pick in 2009, was not viewed as one of the Rays' top pitching prospects.

[JonJayCutler]

Pretty solid stats for Rosscup to this point, and you'd have to think that the depth of TB's farm is part of the reason he hasn't been named a top prospect. I'm eager to see what he can do.

 

Hendry must have gotten good reports on the health of Perez. I heard he brings A+ defense.

 

I still don't like the trade very much, but I'm willing to give it a chance.

[Soul]

Talent evaluators spoken to by ESPN's Buster Olney don't seem to be overly impressed with the Matt Garza deal from either end of things.

 

Our View: The consensus seems to be the Cubs might be overestimating their chances of competing in 2011, making the deal unnecessary, while most believe the Rays aren't getting any impact prospects in return. And while it's surely a disheartening move for Tampa fans, Garza, while a great MLB pitcher, isn't exactly a once in a generation hurler, or even a true ace.

 

That makes pretty much no sense. There's no reason this move needs to be for only next year, and there's no reason Garza needs to be a once in a generation hurler for someone to want to offer 4 prospects for him.

[Northside Blues]

Rosscup appears to be a soft tossing lefty. Lovely.

[CubsWin]

Pretty solid stats for Rosscup to this point, and you'd have to think that the depth of TB's farm is part of the reason he hasn't been named a top prospect. I'm eager to see what he can do.

 

Hendry must have gotten good reports on the health of Perez. I heard he brings A+ defense.

 

I still don't like the trade very much, but I'm willing to give it a chance.

Rosscup put up those stats as a 22 year old in rookie and short season ball. He'll turn 23 in June. Let's see what kind of numbers he puts up at the higher levels.

[J.R.]

As a fan who believes we can compete in the NL Central, I love this deal.

[CubsWin]

As a fan who believes we can compete in the NL Central, I love this deal.

I believe they CAN, they just have more "ifs" than other central division teams.

 

1. Which Zambrano will show up this year?

2. Will Dempster's numbers fall off from last season as a guy who turns 34 in May?

3. Can Cashner be an effective starter?

4. Can Garza become the ace his stuff portends?

5. Can Wood stay healthy and be an effective 7th or 8th inning guy?

6. Can Ramirez stay healthy and put up his usual excellent numbers?

7. Can Pena rebound and OPS .850+?

8. Will Castro continue his development or have a sophomore slump?

9. Which Marlon Byrd will the Cubs get, the 1st half one or the 2nd half?

10. Will Colvin continue his development or plateau?

11. Can Fukudome finally put together a consistently good season?

 

These are all key performers needed for the Cubs to fulfill their potential. It can happen. But will it, especially when the talent in the NL Central has improved so much this off season? I guess that's why they play the games.

 

Lots of teams have questions like this perhaps just not as many, and Garza definitely improves their chances. But, for me, this is a trade that is made when you know you are a good #2 starter away from winning it all, and the Cubs don't fit that description.

[Cubs Fan Dan]

As a fan who believes we can compete in the NL Central, I love this deal.

I believe they CAN, they just have more "ifs" than other central division teams.

 

1. Which Zambrano will show up this year?

2. Will Dempster's numbers fall off from last season as a guy who turns 34 in May?

3. Can Cashner be an effective starter?

4. Can Garza become the ace his stuff portends?

5. Can Wood stay healthy and be an effective 7th or 8th inning guy?

6. Can Ramirez stay healthy and put up his usual excellent numbers?

7. Can Pena rebound and OPS .850+?

8. Will Castro continue his development or have a sophomore slump?

9. Which Marlon Byrd will the Cubs get, the 1st half one or the 2nd half?

10. Will Colvin continue his development or plateau?

11. Can Fukudome finally put together a consistently good season?

 

These are all key performers needed or the Cubs to fulfill their potential. It can happen. But will it? Especially when the talent in the NL Central has improved so much this off season. I guess that's why they play the games.

 

Lots of teams have questions like this perhaps just not as many, and Garza definitely improves their chances. But, for me, this is a trade that is made when you know you are a good #2 starter away from winning it all, and the Cubs don't fit that description.

 

My thoughts..

 

1. Z will be fine if he is left in the rotation all year, i see no reason why he cant post his usuall mid to upper 3 ERA pitching 180-200 innings.

2. Demp will be fine, adding Garza takes pressure off of Demp and Z. Demp is also in better shape than most 28 year olds.

3. Good question, I still have a sneaking suspician he will not get a chance(lets hope I am wrong).

4. Garza just needs to continue to be the pitcher he was in the AL and his numbers will improve enough naturally to warrant a #2 starter.

5. Probably my biggest concern going into the season as well.

6. Aram's first half was an absolute fluke, the injuries may be of a concern but heading into FA year I think he is a good bet to return to his averages.

7. Pena is going to see a lot of good pitching but will also see a lot of very bad pitching, I think he will bounce back close to an .850 ops, but potentially even better.

8. Castro to me is an exception to the rule, his bat is as good as anyone when it comes to making contact and driving the ball through the holes, the only thing I believe that could stop him is hitting into bad luck similar to Soto. If the other players in the lineup hit to their career averages Castro will be a bonus.

9. Byrd needs more rest, I really think he is solid for 450 ab's per year but his body wears down over the full season. Getting Colvin in their should help Byrd keep steady production offensively.

10. I do not like Colvins patience but I do think he makes pretty good hard contact, therefore I think if he can hit .250-.270 that repeating his power numbers is not out of the question. The good news is if he struggles Jackson is close behind.

11. Fukudome is a solid contributor over 400 at bats. Not great but he will help the Cubs when he is out there.

 

I would add Soto to your list, there was a lot of AB's that Hill got because Lou was an idiot but also Soto has had a lot of smaller nagging injuries like oblique issues. Soto getting 450+ at bats is a huge key for the Cubs this year, he is arguably the best hitter on the team and could easily account for 20-25HRs 75-80 RBI's similar to his rookie year.

[XZero771679666304]

Number one, I am among those perplexed at how people think this is a "win in 2011" move. We have the guy for at least three seasons, and we'll have money to spend (hopefully on Fielder, etc.) after 2011. This move will have just as much impact on 2012 and 2013 as 2011.

 

Secondly, one theme I've noticed is that many people are of the opinion that what we saw out of ARam and Pena last year is what we can expect going forward. Now ARam is exiting his prime years, but last year was a fluke, and he proved it in the second half. He and Pena battled injuries for much of last season., and I don't think either is nearly as bad as they were last year.

 

Some may be too optimistic regarding the Cubs ability to compete, but far too many people are writing the Cubs off in 2011 based on false perceptions.

 

If Castro doesn't regress and ARam and Pena have even average seasons, I don't see how the Cubs are much worse then the Cards, Crew or Reds.

 

Having said that,I think the season hinges on Big Z's performance. If he pitches in between what he was in the second and first halves, we'll have the deepest, though not the most top heavy, rotation in the division.

[CUBZ99]

Interesting, Maddux was pushing for Garza trade. :-k

 

[UMFan83]

The thing that I am excited about is the best case scenario is that Garza takes his game to a new level and becomes an elite ace. Worst case scenario he has trouble adjusting to the league, struggles but is a solid 3rd or 4th starter. It's not terribly likely, but with a change in leagues, a change of organizations its not insane to think he can harness his stuff and take his game to a new level. Is it? He has ace stuff doesn't he?

[Little Slide Rooter]

Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but per MLBTR, the pitcher we get is 22 year old lefty Zach Rosscup. Doesnt seem awful.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?utm_source=direct&utm_medium=linker&utm_campaign=Linker&id=rosscu001zac

[UMFan83]

Only 17 starts in 2 seasons, even in short season that seems low. Injury issues?

[Guest]

Only 17 starts in 2 seasons, even in short season that seems low. Injury issues?

 

40 IP seems about right for someone who doesn't start pitching until short season ball starts. Spot checking against a couple of our recent draftees(Rusin and Carpenter), it's actually higher than their workload when they didn't start in April.