Fire Lou Piniella

[17 Seconds]

Lee and Ramirez have hit like crap all year, Zambrano has another meltdown and is on the restricted list, yet we should fire Lou because he has shorted Geovany Soto a few at bats? . I am guessing this "thought" process is just a bunch of fans looking for a scapegoat of some sort, blindly lashing out at a horrible team assembled by Jim Hendry.

 

Can't really say I blame you, but firing Piniella accomplishes next to nothing.

 

but seriously, are you going to pretend that we don't have good reasons to want lou gone? it's really just because we are looking for a scapegoat? come on. there are 25 pages of examplex. look through this thread if you want to see the reasons we want lou gone.

 

you really think he's doing an ok job?

 

yes, the team sucks and they'd suck no matter who was managing them right now. that doesn't mean we can't admit that lou is making them worse. he's supposed to get a free pass because the team sucks anyways? lou is making it worse with his atrocious moves. nobody is claiming that lou is the reason we suck.

Edited June 30, 2010 by 17 Seconds

[javy knows my name]

Lee and Ramirez have hit like crap all year, Zambrano has another meltdown and is on the restricted list, yet we should fire Lou because he has shorted Geovany Soto a few at bats? . I am guessing this "thought" process is just a bunch of fans looking for a scapegoat of some sort, blindly lashing out at a horrible team assembled by Jim Hendry.

 

Can't really say I blame you, but firing Piniella accomplishes next to nothing.

Dexter already beat me, but seriously, read one of the 25 pages of this thread (hell, just skim one) and you will see just how misguided this post is.

[flyseye]

Lee and Ramirez have hit like crap all year, Zambrano has another meltdown and is on the restricted list, yet we should fire Lou because he has shorted Geovany Soto a few at bats? . I am guessing this "thought" process is just a bunch of fans looking for a scapegoat of some sort, blindly lashing out at a horrible team assembled by Jim Hendry.

 

Can't really say I blame you, but firing Piniella accomplishes next to nothing.

Dexter already beat me, but seriously, read one of the 25 pages of this thread (hell, just skim one) and you will see just how misguided this post is.

 

26 pages of whining is about 25 more than I can tolorate, but I skimmed the thread , and it does not change the fact that replacing Lou might be good for maybe one win. Big deal.

 

But as long as it makes you all feel better,have at it.

[17 Seconds]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

[17 Seconds]

why even spend money on managers? they can only cost you 1 win, right? might as well just hire a nobody and save some cash. they're irrelevant.

[J.R.]

A "world class" organization would not let this madness continue.

 

http://www.mouthpiecesports.com/media/images/articles/CubsRicketts7.jpg

 

“It’s our intention to be the best organization in all of the sports."

 

Where is the accountability we heard so much about?

[17 Seconds]

i don't understand this irrational hatred you display towards ricketts. it's getting creepy

[Outshined_One]

why even spend money on managers? they can only cost you 1 win, right? might as well just hire a nobody and save some cash. they're irrelevant.

 

I say the Cubs should hire someone to write a managerial computer program. I think that would cause massive coronaries for at least half the jackoffs working for ESPN.

[XZero771679666304]

i don't understand this irrational hatred you display towards ricketts. it's getting creepy

 

It's the Toyota sign. They're agents of the dark side.

[J.R.]

I don't hate them, and the Toyota sign is an afterthought.

 

They preached "fan" this, "accountability" that all winter long. I feel justified in my disappointment.

Edited July 1, 2010 by J.R.

[flyseye]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

 

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument.

 

Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something.

[inari]

I don't hate them, and the Toyota sign is an afterthought.

 

They preached "fan" this, "accountability" that all winter long. I feel justified in my disappointment.

 

Well you shouldn't, not yet. We get that you don't like him.

[J.R.]

Actually, I'm thrilled that he wound up with the team.

[XZero771679666304]

I don't hate them, and the Toyota sign is an afterthought.

 

They preached "fan" this, "accountability" that all winter long. I feel justified in my disappointment.

 

Well, there just isn't enough to pass judgement on them yet. Lou has been awful, but with Lee and Ramirez in the toilet, this thing wasn't going anywhere anyway. If Lou had been fired a month ago, I don't think the team would be in much better shape. It's a lost season, that much has been clear for a while. I'd rather they get their ducks in a row before making changes rather than just chopping heads in a reactionary fashion. If change isn't made immediately after the season, then I'll be concerned.

 

It was always pretty implicit that this season was going to be spent taking stock.

[XZero771679666304]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

 

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument.

 

Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something.

 

This team would have been bad anyway, but Lou has been awful on multiple fronts. His lineup construction has been consistently crappy (keeping Lee and Ramirez 3-4 when they were at their coldest while at the same time burying Soriano/Soto in the 6-7-8 when they were smoking hot was just mind numbing, and may have cost the team 2-3 wins right there). His bullpen management has been horrible. He leaves SP in too long. He's just bad. The Hill/Soto thing is almost immaterial compared to the other crap.

 

Yeah, Ramirez and Lee have sucked. But Lou really compounded things by sticking these two auto outs in between the players who actually were hitting,when they were hitting.

 

Remember when Byrd, Kosuke, Soriano and Soto were all OPSing over .900, and the team still wasn't scoring? How many rallies were killed by Ramirez and Lee, or those killed by the pitcher's spot because our two best hitters were batting 6-7?

 

And then there's the Z to the bullpen retardation.

 

Good managers stay out of the way and make the obvious moves. Bad managers exacerbate bad situations by being obstinate or micromanaging. Lou has clearly been the latter this season.

[flyseye]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

 

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument.

 

Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something.

 

This team would have been bad anyway, but Lou has been awful on multiple fronts. His lineup construction has been consistently crappy (keeping Lee and Ramirez 3-4 when they were at their coldest while at the same time burying Soriano/Soto in the 6-7-8 when they were smoking hot was just mind numbing, and may have cost the team 2-3 wins right there). His bullpen management has been horrible. He leaves SP in too long. He's just bad. The Hill/Soto thing is almost immaterial compared to the other crap.

 

Yeah, Ramirez and Lee have sucked. But Lou really compounded things by sticking these two auto outs in between the players who actually were hitting,when they were hitting.

 

Remember when Byrd, Kosuke, Soriano and Soto were all OPSing over .900, and the team still wasn't scoring? How many rallies were killed by Ramirez and Lee, or those killed by the pitcher's spot because our two best hitters were batting 6-7?

 

And then there's the Z to the bullpen retardation.

 

Good managers stay out of the way and make the obvious moves. Bad managers exacerbate bad situations by being obstinate or micromanaging. Lou has clearly been the latter this season.

 

Thanks for making my point. If Lee and Ramirez had not sucked all year things would be much different. Hiding what are supposed to be your two best hitters at the bottom of the order is not the answer, them hitting is .

 

I think Lou is an average manager. Replacing him solves very little.

[muntjack]

The argument that Aram's and Derrek's lack of production takes management off the hook is completely missing the forest for the trees here. We have gotten great production from a predicted non-impact source in Colvin. We've gotten great production from a predicted average to good source in Byrd. Soto and Soriano have rebounded from their terrible '09 seasons. Silva has gone from the worst starter in major league baseball to a borderline all-star. Marshall, Marmol, Dempster, Lilly and Gorzelanny are all having good to great seasons.

 

The cubs have the highest payroll in the NL, have had no major injuries and yet are languishing at 10 games under because of historically bad management.

 

Ramirez went through the worst funk of his career, but did we need to hit him cleanup through the entire thing? How much did that decision cost the team?

 

Grabow showed right away that he was not fooling anyone, but did we need to keep trotting him out in crucial situations? How much did that decision cost the team.

 

Theriot can not get on base to save his life, yet he has been given the most ABs.

 

Xavier Nady has a .636 OPS, yet when he's in the lineup he has to be in the 4th spot.

 

And most egregious of all, we have a guy with a .402 OBP in a platoon with a .274 and no sign of a change.

[XZero771679666304]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

 

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument.

 

Start a 26 page thread about how much Aramis Ramirez has sucked this year and you might be on to something.

 

This team would have been bad anyway, but Lou has been awful on multiple fronts. His lineup construction has been consistently crappy (keeping Lee and Ramirez 3-4 when they were at their coldest while at the same time burying Soriano/Soto in the 6-7-8 when they were smoking hot was just mind numbing, and may have cost the team 2-3 wins right there). His bullpen management has been horrible. He leaves SP in too long. He's just bad. The Hill/Soto thing is almost immaterial compared to the other crap.

 

Yeah, Ramirez and Lee have sucked. But Lou really compounded things by sticking these two auto outs in between the players who actually were hitting,when they were hitting.

 

Remember when Byrd, Kosuke, Soriano and Soto were all OPSing over .900, and the team still wasn't scoring? How many rallies were killed by Ramirez and Lee, or those killed by the pitcher's spot because our two best hitters were batting 6-7?

 

And then there's the Z to the bullpen retardation.

 

Good managers stay out of the way and make the obvious moves. Bad managers exacerbate bad situations by being obstinate or micromanaging. Lou has clearly been the latter this season.

 

Thanks for making my point. If Lee and Ramirez had not sucked all year things would be much different. Hiding what are supposed to be your two best hitters at the bottom of the order is not the answer, them hitting is .

 

I think Lou is an average manager. Replacing him solves very little.

 

Lou has absolutely made a bad situation worse. Do I want him as Cubs manager after this year? Absolutely not.

 

Would firing him a month ago have kept the Cubs in contention, or would firing him now save the season? No way. As long as he and Hendry are gone come October, I'm fine with that.

 

But let's not pretend people are grasping at straws criticizing him. This goes way beyond playing Hill too much - he has become an overall bad manager, making decisions completely contrary to logic. He could have lessened the impact of Lee and Ramirez blowing, but he has maximized it.

[17 Seconds]

great argument.

 

so did dusty do an ok job in 2006 because the team sucked so bad anyways?

 

So using your logic, the Reds are in first now , so Dusty must have become a good manager ? Great argument.

 

lol what? apparently you don't understand my argument at all. that's basically the opposite of what i'm saying

 

maybe you just don't understand this thread

[17 Seconds]

im convinced

 

flyseye = wrigley23

[flyseye]

XZero-I dont think we totally disagree. It is just to me the blame lies much more heavily on Lee and Ramirez, not on Lou, at least nowhere near as much. If Lee and Ramirez are having even average years, the Cubs are in contention. Replace Lou and they still are not.

[flyseye]

im convinced

 

flyseye = wrigley23

 

If you want to have a discussion fine. If, however ,the best you can do is to compare me to another poster, we are done.Thats just childish and desperate.Good day.Whine away.

[Derwood]

I don't care if a new manager wins more games. That's not the point. All I care about at this point is that the right players are getting the right playing time in the right positions (Soto starts 80% of the time, Cashner starts, etc.)

[JoshiQ]

I've always been of the opinion, and I think I've heard it here too, that having a bad manager might be worth 4-5 losses while having a good manager may only be worth maybe 1-2 wins.

 

Basically, all I want is a manager that uses common sense. Soto is a far better hitter and probably, at least, the same as Hill on defense. So let Soto start almost all of the games and give Soto a day off maybe once every 7-9 games. That's just common sense. If your two best hitters are still slumping in June, and you have hitters like Byrd and Soriano crushing the ball, move them up to 3-4 and move Lee and Ramirez back to 6-7 until they get their swing back.

 

It's just common sense stuff.

[Sosa21MVP]

Lou has been making mind boggling decisions for what, 3 seasons now? 2007 I don't recall as much but even in 2008 when we were winning a ton of games I remember being amazed at some of his moves. The fact this team stinks just magnifies the bad decision making to a higher degree.

 

It isn't all his fault and firing him won't cure all but yeah I won't be sad to see him go. If they fired him right now I would not complain.