Zambrano as Trade Bait?

[Eric Clipperton]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/carlos-zambrano-loves-lucky-charms

 

Article from fangraphs discussing some of the points i mentioned in an earlier post. In the interest of full disclosure, i am commenter Rodney King on fangraphs. The offer I posted in the comment is valid for anyone over here as well- I'll take action on whether Z will live up to his contract or not, for mutually agreed upon units and terms to any interested Z backers. If anyone finds this little game interesting I would consider any bets of this style, so if you disagree on a projection or player value let's hash out some terms ahead of time and either feel better about being right or learn a lesson the hard way. Of course luck also will play a huge part as always.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Zambrano's only between -5 and 0 runs above average as a hitter when you compare him to position players. Stupid BTBS and USS Mariner's graphs are gone from their good articles about pitcher hitting from a while back. Odds are Z's about even on his contract. Not that he's extremely likely to be worth the contract, but he's been a lot more valuable than many assume, and he's not so much worse than his deal that trading his salary on a high ceiling flyer would be a wise decision at all.

[dew1679666265]

The point that Z didn't get a win in some games he pitched well in does not tell us any meaningful information about the skill or value of the pitcher. Pitcher value is independent of wins. Every pitcher has games they pitch well in but lose, and pitch poorly while lucking into a win. Who cares?

 

I can understand this explanation and agree with it. I don't think Bruce's point was to point out Z's value, though, considering win total pretty much never is an example of a player's value. Bruce was just pointing out that people have talked about how Wells would have more wins if some of his great starts ended up in wins but have ignored that Z has missed a few wins as well.

 

From what I could tell, he wasn't making a value argument.

 

I am right about even either way on a pure salary dump of Z- i could take it or leave it. How much do you think he is worth?

 

For a pitcher who is just going to be 29 next year and has a sub-4 ERA with a decent WHIP and nearly 2:1 K:BB ratio every year, I'd want a some good prospects. I'd much, much rather trade Lilly personally, but I'm not sure I'd be in favor dealing either of them unless we get blown away.

 

We're still trying to compete and dumping either likely won't help us in that endeavor.

[Little Slide Rooter]

According to the Chicago Tribune, Carlos Zambrano has a full no-trade clause and has no intention of waiving it this offseason.

 

[illiniguy]

According to the Chicago Tribune, Carlos Zambrano has a full no-trade clause and has no intention of waiving it this offseason.

 

Good. This might save us from another horrible slary dump by Hendry.

[Guest]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/carlos-zambrano-loves-lucky-charms

 

Article from fangraphs discussing some of the points i mentioned in an earlier post. In the interest of full disclosure, i am commenter Rodney King on fangraphs. The offer I posted in the comment is valid for anyone over here as well- I'll take action on whether Z will live up to his contract or not, for mutually agreed upon units and terms to any interested Z backers. If anyone finds this little game interesting I would consider any bets of this style, so if you disagree on a projection or player value let's hash out some terms ahead of time and either feel better about being right or learn a lesson the hard way. Of course luck also will play a huge part as always.

The return of Meph?

[17 Seconds]

Hasn't Meph been guaranteeing that Zambrano's ERA wouldn't be below 4 for like 3 straight seasons now?

[Drew Doughty]

isn't meph a crazy psycho that no one should ever speak of again

[SouthSideRyan]

Meph is a psycho?

I don't think this is a word

that does him justice

 

Don't you understand

a making fun of culture

requires this response

[TruffleShuffle]

hey speaking of people who are banned, when we were doing the change over to the new board, i was on the emergency board and saw that CubsGM was signed on. i guess he must still lurk a lot here, though thankfully we have been spared of his lunacy.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Seems like pure speculation, but a Jake Peavy for Carlos Zambrano deal this offseason would not surprise some in Chicago.

 

Intriguing. While I dont know how to feel about this, which I dont see happening anyway as its just specualtion, not even rumor, Id prefer it 100% over a salary dump or some prospects. If we do end up gettig rid of Z, this would probably be the best way to go.

 

-Peavy prefers the NL, with the Cubs as one of his top 2 choices.

-Ozzie and Cooper seem to think they can strighten Z out+Z and Ozzie seem to have a good relatinship

-The White Sox are among the teams that Z said hed like to play for other than the Cubs.

-Both have their share of nagging injuries, but not to the sam degree as say Sheets or Harden

-While I think Z may be a bettter overall pitcher, Peavy is always been consistant as opposed to Z and his off a gain on again schtick

[CUBZ99]

Seems like pure speculation, but a Jake Peavy for Carlos Zambrano deal this offseason would not surprise some in Chicago.

 

Intriguing. While I dont know how to feel about this, which I dont see happening anyway as its just specualtion, not even rumor, Id prefer it 100% over a salary dump or some prospects. If we do end up gettig rid of Z, this would probably be the best way to go.

 

-Peavy prefers the NL, with the Cubs as one of his top 2 choices.

-Ozzie and Cooper seem to think they can strighten Z out+Z and Ozzie seem to have a good relatinship

-The White Sox are among the teams that Z said hed like to play for other than the Cubs.

-Both have their share of nagging injuries, but not to the sam degree as say Sheets or Harden

-While I think Z may be a bettter overall pitcher, Peavy is always been consistant as opposed to Z and his off a gain on again schtick

 

I can see this happening. It makes sense for both teams.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I suppose if both teams, coming off dissapointing season wanted to really shake things up they could do Z, Theriot, and Bradley for Peavy, Alexie Ramirez, and Quentin. Never going to happen, but it would be intersting.

[Backtobanks]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat. Actually I can't see Zambrano waiving his NTC unless the Cubs really make him the scapegoat for a terrible season and that would be a really stupid thing to do.

[NCCubFan]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat.

I don't know. I could be wrong about this, but it sticks in my mind that there was discussion on this board awhile back (maybe a year ago) about Z being quoted as expressing interest in signing with the White Sox at some time in his career.

[SouthSideRyan]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat. Actually I can't see Zambrano waiving his NTC unless the Cubs really make him the scapegoat for a terrible season and that would be a really stupid thing to do.

 

Zambrano would absolutely waive his NTC to go play for Guillen.

 

And that trade(which I don't buy for a second) would be an absurd heist for the Cubs.

[Backtobanks]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat. Actually I can't see Zambrano waiving his NTC unless the Cubs really make him the scapegoat for a terrible season and that would be a really stupid thing to do.

 

Zambrano would absolutely waive his NTC to go play for Guillen.

 

And that trade(which I don't buy for a second) would be an absurd heist for the Cubs.

 

Zambrano would have to be crazy to want to play for Guillen. Guillen would call Zambrano every four-letter word (in spanish) in the book instead of being treated with kid gloves by the Cubs. The sportswriters would have a field day.

[inari]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat. Actually I can't see Zambrano waiving his NTC unless the Cubs really make him the scapegoat for a terrible season and that would be a really stupid thing to do.

 

Zambrano would absolutely waive his NTC to go play for Guillen.

 

And that trade(which I don't buy for a second) would be an absurd heist for the Cubs.

 

Zambrano would have to be crazy to want to play for Guillen. Guillen would call Zambrano every four-letter word (in spanish) in the book instead of being treated with kid gloves by the Cubs. The sportswriters would have a field day.

 

You obviously aren't aware of the kinds of things that Z has said about Ozzie Guillen and the White Sox in the past.

[Benchwarmer]

Zambrano has said alot of things, but he fails to back anything up. The White Sox can't afford his bloated contract, besides Hendry would want players we don't need like Fields, Rios, Konerko, Garcia or Rios.

 

I'm all for unloading Zambrano but I want young prospects, not another bad contract or failing veteran back.

[SouthSideRyan]

besides Hendry would want players we don't need like Fields, Rios, Konerko, Garcia or Rios.

 

What?

[Cubs Fan Dan]

besides Hendry would want players we don't need like Fields, Rios, Konerko, Garcia or Rios.

 

What?

 

Surprised Rios is not on that list..........

[jersey cubs fan]

besides Hendry would want players we don't need like Fields, Rios, Konerko, Garcia or Rios.

 

What?

 

Surprised Rios is not on that list..........

 

He is.

 

I think that was the joke.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I do not appreciate your slander, good sir.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

http://us.ent4.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/columbia_pictures/spider_man_2/j_k__simmons/Spiderman2.jpg

 

When it's written, it's libel.

[Backtobanks]

I said it before and I stand by it: Zambrano won't waive his NTC to an AL team where he can't bat. Actually I can't see Zambrano waiving his NTC unless the Cubs really make him the scapegoat for a terrible season and that would be a really stupid thing to do.

 

Zambrano would absolutely waive his NTC to go play for Guillen.

 

And that trade(which I don't buy for a second) would be an absurd heist for the Cubs.

 

Zambrano would have to be crazy to want to play for Guillen. Guillen would call Zambrano every four-letter word (in spanish) in the book instead of being treated with kid gloves by the Cubs. The sportswriters would have a field day.

 

You obviously aren't aware of the kinds of things that Z has said about Ozzie Guillen and the White Sox in the past.

 

Zambrano has said so many things in the past that you never know what to believe. The last thing I remember him saying was that he might retire after this contract. One of the things that I do believe about him is he loves to hit and takes great pride in his hitting, so I don't believe he would go to the AL.