Zambrano as Trade Bait?

[Cubs Fan Dan]

I do not appreciate your slander, good sir.

 

I apologize, I could not resist...

 

In other news, Zambrano is not going anywhere...

[Keener98]

Zambrano has said alot of things, but he fails to back anything up. The White Sox can't afford his bloated contract, besides Hendry would want players we don't need like Fields, Rios, Konerko, Garcia or Rios.

 

I'm all for unloading Zambrano but I want young prospects, not another bad contract or failing veteran back.

 

If the White Sox could affor Peavys deal, they could afford Zambranos deal if Peavy was taken off the books.

[Eric Clipperton]

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/carlos-zambrano-loves-lucky-charms

 

Article from fangraphs discussing some of the points i mentioned in an earlier post. In the interest of full disclosure, i am commenter Rodney King on fangraphs. The offer I posted in the comment is valid for anyone over here as well- I'll take action on whether Z will live up to his contract or not, for mutually agreed upon units and terms to any interested Z backers. If anyone finds this little game interesting I would consider any bets of this style, so if you disagree on a projection or player value let's hash out some terms ahead of time and either feel better about being right or learn a lesson the hard way. Of course luck also will play a huge part as always.

The return of Meph?

 

Just wanted to mention that I am most certainly not Meph, while I may remind you of the departed in some ways, merely looking at the differences in posting size and frequency make clear that I am not Meph unless he is completely changing style upon his return. I post infrequently and when I do they are way too long epics which try to explain as much of my reasoning as possible. Which is basically the opposite in all ways from anything Meph posted save for his few periods of playing nice.

 

Of course, if I were Meph I would definitely not want to bring it up since I would expect KHALIL GREENE KHALIL GREENE KHALIL GREENE to be the reply.

 

One point that I want to make clear is on Zambrano's hitting value. With only <100 PAs, even a close to average hitter is not really picking up a whole lot of value, and any metric will have a ton of variance. But if we wish to include Pitcher hitting to Zs value, should we then subtract all other pitchers' hitting lines? If so, someone like Lilly who is truly horrendous would find himself to be slightly less valuable than the pitching line would indicate. Anybody think this matters, or does it make more sense to ignore P-hitting since high leverage spots will lead to a PH almost all the time? Could see it either way...

[Little Slide Rooter]

Considering that its pretty much official that we will be eating Milton Bradleys contract, I really cant imagine any scenerio in which Zambrano is traded and we dont get either something good in return or a huge chunk of salry picked up.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

One point that I want to make clear is on Zambrano's hitting value. With only <100 PAs, even a close to average hitter is not really picking up a whole lot of value, and any metric will have a ton of variance. But if we wish to include Pitcher hitting to Zs value, should we then subtract all other pitchers' hitting lines? If so, someone like Lilly who is truly horrendous would find himself to be slightly less valuable than the pitching line would indicate. Anybody think this matters, or does it make more sense to ignore P-hitting since high leverage spots will lead to a PH almost all the time? Could see it either way...

 

Zambrano is an outlier with pitcher hitting. I think the point would not be to try and pinpoint hitter contributions to the decimal point in value for everyone, but to recognize that Zambrano definitely adds value with the bat. A couple years ago he was worth a couple million dollars for his hitting compared to other position players, so I think you definitely have to account for his hitting when getting an accurate picture of his value.

[jersey cubs fan]

One point that I want to make clear is on Zambrano's hitting value. With only <100 PAs, even a close to average hitter is not really picking up a whole lot of value, and any metric will have a ton of variance. But if we wish to include Pitcher hitting to Zs value, should we then subtract all other pitchers' hitting lines? If so, someone like Lilly who is truly horrendous would find himself to be slightly less valuable than the pitching line would indicate. Anybody think this matters, or does it make more sense to ignore P-hitting since high leverage spots will lead to a PH almost all the time? Could see it either way...

 

Zambrano is an outlier with pitcher hitting. I think the point would not be to try and pinpoint hitter contributions to the decimal point in value for everyone, but to recognize that Zambrano definitely adds value with the bat. A couple years ago he was worth a couple million dollars for his hitting compared to other position players, so I think you definitely have to account for his hitting when getting an accurate picture of his value.

 

That was last year and it was a completely flukey year that was twice as good as his normal hitting. You can account for his hitting, but it has to be extremely small.

[davell]

I saw on TCR that Nick Cafardo of the Boston Globe said that the only 3 teams that Z would accept a trade to are the Dodgers, White Sox, and Red Sox. No idea how he would know this, or if it's true, but I don't see Z getting dealt this offseason with all the Bradley drama awaiting as it is.

[Careless]

There's a huge difference in payrolls between the Cubs and Yankees, but it's not even close to twice as much. Stop saying that.

I don't know how accurate these numbers are, but 56% is pretty close to 50%.

[SouthSideRyan]

There's a huge difference in payrolls between the Cubs and Yankees, but it's not even close to twice as much. Stop saying that.

I don't know how accurate these numbers are, but 56% is pretty close to 50%.

 

You're looking at 2008. It's ~2/3 in '09

[Guest]

There's a huge difference in payrolls between the Cubs and Yankees, but it's not even close to twice as much. Stop saying that.

I don't know how accurate these numbers are, but 56% is pretty close to 50%.

 

You're looking at 2008. It's ~2/3 in '09

That's the closest it's been in years, but who the F cares?

 

Comparing the 30+ talent of the Yankees and the Cubs is stupid..

[erik316wttn]

I saw on TCR that Nick Cafardo of the Boston Globe said that the only 3 teams that Z would accept a trade to are the Dodgers, White Sox, and Red Sox. No idea how he would know this, or if it's true, but I don't see Z getting dealt this offseason with all the Bradley drama awaiting as it is.

 

It all depends on if he wants to stay here. If he wanted out, all he'd have to do is complain loudly enough publicly enough for long enough, and the Cubs would pretty much be forced to trade him. Z doesn't seem like the type of guy who would hold feelings back like that.

[CUBZ99]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

[Backtobanks]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

 

After trading for Peavy, Williams isn't going to trade him. I still say Zambrano won't waive his NTC to go to the AL where he won't get to bat and his ERA will go up. Finally, Zambrano enjoys being the "ace of the staff" recognition (true or not) that he gets on the north side.

[C.C.]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

 

After trading for Peavy, Williams isn't going to trade him. I still say Zambrano won't waive his NTC to go to the AL where he won't get to bat and his ERA will go up. Finally, Zambrano enjoys being the "ace of the staff" recognition (true or not) that he gets on the north side.

 

He'd waive his NTC to go to the White Sox.

[inari]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

 

After trading for Peavy, Williams isn't going to trade him. I still say Zambrano won't waive his NTC to go to the AL where he won't get to bat and his ERA will go up. Finally, Zambrano enjoys being the "ace of the staff" recognition (true or not) that he gets on the north side.

 

There's nothing Z has said that suggests he wouldn't jump at a chance to play for Ozzie Guillen. Your belief just isn't true in this case.

[Backtobanks]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

 

After trading for Peavy, Williams isn't going to trade him. I still say Zambrano won't waive his NTC to go to the AL where he won't get to bat and his ERA will go up. Finally, Zambrano enjoys being the "ace of the staff" recognition (true or not) that he gets on the north side.

 

There's nothing Z has said that suggests he wouldn't jump at a chance to play for Ozzie Guillen. Your belief just isn't true in this case.

 

He has said numerous times that he loves to hit and he takes great pride in his hitting. To me that sounds like he wants to stay in the NL.

[Guest]

Some baseball people believe the White Sox could have interest in the Cubs' Carlos Zambrano, possibly even for the newly acquired Jake Peavy. It would be a way for two teams without much money to spend to shake things up, but wouldn't Peavy have more value than Zambrano at this point? ...

 

From Phil Rogers this morning. http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-27-rogers-whispers-sep27,0,5280968.column

 

The same article also suggests the Cubs may be interested in trading Bradley to SD for Chris Young.

 

After trading for Peavy, Williams isn't going to trade him. I still say Zambrano won't waive his NTC to go to the AL where he won't get to bat and his ERA will go up. Finally, Zambrano enjoys being the "ace of the staff" recognition (true or not) that he gets on the north side.

 

There's nothing Z has said that suggests he wouldn't jump at a chance to play for Ozzie Guillen. Your belief just isn't true in this case.

Z says a lot of crazy [expletive] all the time. It's half the reason why the knuckleheads are pissed at him. I don't think anyone can take anything he says at face value.

 

I think Z likes to bat more than he cares for Ozzy who may be gone at any time. Z knows that.

[biittner77]

off topic but what would Ozzie Guillen have to do to get fired that he hasn't already done?

[Backtobanks]

off topic but what would Ozzie Guillen have to do to get fired that he hasn't already done?

 

 

Use some of those expletives on Williams and Reinsdorf.