MacPhail: Deal is dead (p. 297), stop posting, go outside

[CubColtPacer]

Keep in mind that the guy who reported that it was to go down today wasn't one of the supposed Orioles insiders but just some guy who signed up at that forum this month and claims to have Cubs sources.

 

The O's insiders have only been saying "soon" and today they said in the next week or so.

 

I don't believe any of Peace, Belkast, or Bigbird said that it would go down today. Just that new guy who has no history there and isn't somebody we've even heard from before. Jan 08 signup date.

 

That is true. None of the Orioles insiders have said today. One of them said soon, one of them said a few days, and one of them said not soon (and clarified that he didn't mean hours but more like days). All of them agreed that the deal was Marshall, Gallagher, Cedeno...and a couple of them said that paperwork had been exchanged.

 

That doesn't mean the deal is going to happen, but these facts remain.

 

1) There are a lot more posters on there then there is on NSBB (check out how many people they have vote on polls-a poll started today had 257 votes, and that's not unusual).

2) These posters give a great deal of respect to these insiders, and they have been doing so for years. The level of respect on there is around the same that people on here give to Bruce.

 

Now some of us could search through and find every deal that these insiders have gotten completely right beforehand. Simple logic tells us though that they have sources. If they didn't, they would have been discredited years ago by the large community over there. Imagine if we had a person come on here labeled as an insider. If they didn't get things right, would we continue to listen to him? Yet they hang on every single word their insiders say. The insiders have had to give them information that has made them justify that faith.

 

Obviously of course their sources are sometimes mistaken, or sometimes things change before they become official. This deal could still fall through. I have every belief it is likely (more than 70 percent) to happen within the next week though because of what the insiders say, and especially now that they are telling a very consistent story.

[Schwarber Fan]

One alleged insider on PSD said the deal is done

 

Belkast says it's close.... (surprise)

 

and Joey (alleged insider from O's hangout) says the ball is in Angelo's' court.

[RynoRules]

This whole thing is annoying. I'd bet on Angelos meddling in it.

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

damn, for such a crappy baseball team, they have a ton of traffic on their site.

[bhogg]

damn, for such a crappy baseball team, they have a ton of traffic on their site.

 

 

you talkin' bout the O's or the Cubs?

[GoCubsGo1679625768]

damn, for such a crappy baseball team, they have a ton of traffic on their site.

 

 

you talkin' bout the O's or the Cubs?

 

well, depending on the year..both I guess... :D

[RammyFanny]

One alleged insider on PSD said the deal is done

 

Belkast says it's close.... (surprise)

 

and Joey (alleged insider from O's hangout) says the ball is in Angelo's' court.

PSD guy and "Joey" are the same guy.

[Soul]

Keep in mind that the guy who reported that it was to go down today wasn't one of the supposed Orioles insiders but just some guy who signed up at that forum this month and claims to have Cubs sources.

 

The O's insiders have only been saying "soon" and today they said in the next week or so.

 

I don't believe any of Peace, Belkast, or Bigbird said that it would go down today. Just that new guy who has no history there and isn't somebody we've even heard from before. Jan 08 signup date.

 

That is true. None of the Orioles insiders have said today. One of them said soon, one of them said a few days, and one of them said not soon (and clarified that he didn't mean hours but more like days). All of them agreed that the deal was Marshall, Gallagher, Cedeno...and a couple of them said that paperwork had been exchanged.

 

That doesn't mean the deal is going to happen, but these facts remain.

 

1) There are a lot more posters on there then there is on NSBB (check out how many people they have vote on polls-a poll started today had 257 votes, and that's not unusual).

2) These posters give a great deal of respect to these insiders, and they have been doing so for years. The level of respect on there is around the same that people on here give to Bruce.

 

Now some of us could search through and find every deal that these insiders have gotten completely right beforehand. Simple logic tells us though that they have sources. If they didn't, they would have been discredited years ago by the large community over there. Imagine if we had a person come on here labeled as an insider. If they didn't get things right, would we continue to listen to him? Yet they hang on every single word their insiders say. The insiders have had to give them information that has made them justify that faith.

 

Obviously of course their sources are sometimes mistaken, or sometimes things change before they become official. This deal could still fall through. I have every belief it is likely (more than 70 percent) to happen within the next week though because of what the insiders say, and especially now that they are telling a very consistent story.

 

There was at least one of them who had the deal happening before Christmas. One of them already had his chain yanked -- badly and publicly.

 

Like I said, it's still a message board, still open to the usual nonsense of message boards.

[badnews]

Like I said, a lot of blogs predicted similar things for different rumors in the past. The Wieters thing was no mystery on the sources I was reading at the time. To me that's being impressed by someone predicting the Cubs would draft Vitters. Maybe you read different things that I did, that's not what I read. As for equating these guys with Bruce-worship, if people give these guys a lot of faith as you say, then they're gulliable, easy trusting, and too easily impressed.

 

David, I don't trust you because you come off as way too defensive to me. Every time someone posts that they don't trust the Oriole Insiders, you have to write an essay as to why they should be trusted. As far as I can tell you don't let a single questioning post slide. That strikes me as very strange. If someone was questioning a source I found reliable, I wouldn't be waging such a campaign for it.

 

It looks weird to me that you have so much emotionally invested in the message board reputations of these guys.

 

The jerking around remains - people are assured one deal or one day is the day. Then we hear "Oh no, this wasn't the *official* Insiders." Well then, why bother posting it?

 

Anyway, I'll duck out of this topic now. The rumors are frustrated and I am frustrated by my fellow fans, who feel like they have to be The Great Defenders of some message board attention whores masquerading as oracles, dropping hints here and there. The fact that it's the Orioles just rankles more.

 

Even if they *do* know their stuff, which I doubt, despite the exaggerated and in some cases, fabricated, claims to the contrary, I'd rather be a skeptic than a blind believer. Sorry if I've been rude. The situation has been obnoxious.

[E.J.]

Ugh. This thread is terrible. We've been talking about the same crap for weeks now. The deal either needs to happen now or it needs to come out that the O's and Cubs hit a snag or something. I'm tired of hearing about this. This offseason is too slow.

[Mizzou]

These "insiders" are clowns.

Absolutely agreed.

[RammyFanny]

Like I said, a lot of blogs predicted similar things for different rumors in the past. The Wieters thing was no mystery on the sources I was reading at the time. To me that's being impressed by someone predicting the Cubs would draft Vitters. Maybe you read different things that I did, that's not what I read. As for equating these guys with Bruce-worship, if people give these guys a lot of faith as you say, then they're gulliable, easy trusting, and too easily impressed.

 

David, I don't trust you because you come off as way too defensive to me. Every time someone posts that they don't trust the Oriole Insiders, you have to write an essay as to why they should be trusted. As far as I can tell you don't let a single questioning post slide. That strikes me as very strange. If someone was questioning a source I found reliable, I wouldn't be waging such a campaign for it.

 

It looks weird to me that you have so much emotionally invested in the message board reputations of these guys.

 

The jerking around remains - people are assured one deal or one day is the day. Then we hear "Oh no, this wasn't the *official* Insiders." Well then, why bother posting it?

 

Anyway, I'll duck out of this topic now. The rumors are frustrated and I am frustrated by my fellow fans, who feel like they have to be The Great Defenders of some message board attention whores masquerading as oracles, dropping hints here and there. The fact that it's the Orioles just rankles more.

 

Even if they *do* know their stuff, which I doubt, despite the exaggerated and in some cases, fabricated, claims to the contrary, I'd rather be a skeptic than a blind believer. Sorry if I've been rude. The situation has been obnoxious.

You obviously have your opinion. But i'd just like you to show me one article before the Tejada trade naming all players involved and one source naming the exact $ amount that Weiters signed before it happened. They've gotten other things out of the blue correct before, as i've had that site on my favorites for 3+ years when I was shocked at one of the things they said came true I honeslty don't remember that exact deal). I'm not trying to be a Great Defender, but i'm just stating what i've known to be facts for the last few years.

[David]

Like I said, a lot of blogs predicted similar things for different rumors in the past. The Wieters thing was no mystery on the sources I was reading at the time. To me that's being impressed by someone predicting the Cubs would draft Vitters. Maybe you read different things that I did, that's not what I read. As for equating these guys with Bruce-worship, if people give these guys a lot of faith as you say, then they're gulliable, easy trusting, and too easily impressed.

 

David, I don't trust you because you come off as way too defensive to me. Every time someone posts that they don't trust the Oriole Insiders, you have to write an essay as to why they should be trusted. As far as I can tell you don't let a single questioning post slide. That strikes me as very strange. If someone was questioning a source I found reliable, I wouldn't be waging such a campaign for it.

 

It looks weird to me that you have so much emotionally invested in the message board reputations of these guys.

 

The jerking around remains - people are assured one deal or one day is the day. Then we hear "Oh no, this wasn't the *official* Insiders." Well then, why bother posting it?

 

Anyway, I'll duck out of this topic now. The rumors are frustrated and I am frustrated by my fellow fans, who feel like they have to be The Great Defenders of some message board attention whores masquerading as oracles, dropping hints here and there. The fact that it's the Orioles just rankles more.

 

Even if they *do* know their stuff, which I doubt, despite the exaggerated and in some cases, fabricated, claims to the contrary, I'd rather be a skeptic than a blind believer. Sorry if I've been rude. The situation has been obnoxious.

 

You don't trust me? I'm not even sure what that means. I've been posting on this board for what, 4 years, and lurking it for almost 5... I just have a tendency to correct people when I think they're wrong or misinformed, i.e. when people were attributing that Joey dude's reports to the other "insiders." I'm really not sure what your whole deal is with the O's guys. It's beyond skepticism in these last two posts. It's just odd.

 

Personally, I think the skepticism is implied and inherent in the nature of the whole thing. There's no need to constantly point things like that out and I just think it's cool that we have access to some information we otherwise wouldn't.

[CP_414]

I know this has not been discussed in a few pages, but I'm bored...

 

Why is it assumed that DeRosa will not end up as the SS? At this point last year Theriot was not considered an option for SS. If I recall it was quite a big deal last season when Theriot started playing SS, that they didn't know if he could handle it. Izturis was horrible, Cedeno didn't perform in his (very limited) chances early in the year and Lou tried Theriot at SS, and it stuck. So if Theriot sucks (which is pretty likley) and DeRosa and Roberts (assuming this ever happens) are playing well, would anyone really be surprised to see DeRosa at SS?

 

You can say they think Theriot is good, but they thought Izturis was good at this point last season. I don't think DeRosa will be the opening day SS, but I don't expect DeRosa to be rotting on the bench while Theriot starts everyday with a .320 OBP.

 

That is all...

 

These O's "insiders" are just going to predict this trade will happen every week until it happens and then claim they predicted it.

[CubColtPacer]

Like I said, a lot of blogs predicted similar things for different rumors in the past. The Wieters thing was no mystery on the sources I was reading at the time. To me that's being impressed by someone predicting the Cubs would draft Vitters. Maybe you read different things that I did, that's not what I read. As for equating these guys with Bruce-worship, if people give these guys a lot of faith as you say, then they're gulliable, easy trusting, and too easily impressed.

 

Let's just say this. If you read the Hangout for any length of time and still didn't believe that they have some source, not only would you have to conclude that the insiders are pretty good at guessing, but also that they've pulled one of the greatest acting jobs in history. There have been plenty of people that have admitted that they mainly come to read the insider information, and have been doing so for years. The board's regular people believe in them. The board's administrators believe in them, and I believe they have been informed on who the sources specifically are. Many Oriole fans sit there during key times and wait anxiously for an update from one of them. I've honestly never seen anything like it, and I've seen lots of people come on to boards and claim to have sources. We all have, and most of them turning out to be completely false have made all of us extremely unlikely to trust anybody who claims that.

 

 

The jerking around remains - people are assured one deal or one day is the day. Then we hear "Oh no, this wasn't the *official* Insiders." Well then, why bother posting it?

 

Why not? It's a rumor like many rumors are posted on here. It was listed right up front that the source had not been found to be reliable and so the information could not be trusted.

 

As far as I know, 1 Insider has said today is the day exactly once 3 weeks ago. On that day, the other Insiders disagreed with him. Then right after that was the Christmas holiday, which made people antsy and think this process was actually dragging longer than it has (because half of the time people weren't working). Since they went back to work, it has been heating up again. Last night and today, the insiders have said "it's close", it will "probably be done later this week or early next week" and "paperwork has been exchanged, but it won't be done in the next few hours". None of those ever said that today would be the day.

 

 

Even if they *do* know their stuff, which I doubt, despite the exaggerated and in some cases, fabricated, claims to the contrary, I'd rather be a skeptic than a blind believer. Sorry if I've been rude. The situation has been obnoxious.

 

 

You should be a skeptic. Just because they posted it doesn't mean the Roberts deal is going to go down. Even if they know their stuff, their source may be wrong on this particular issue. Their source may not have all the information, or something may change (as is common in MLB front offices) before things are done. Trades can sometimes fall through or be made at the last minute. The Cubs are no stranger to that. I wouldn't be ordering Roberts jerseys just yet, but the fact that all their sources believe the deal has progressed quite a ways means the chances are good that Roberts will be a Cub.

 

Believe as little or as much as you want. You certainly have the right to be a skeptic. The information posted here does not have to be believed, but it is for the benefit of those who want to know without wading through the thousands of posts over there. I understand some people probably still won't trust the information even if this deal does go through, and that's fine. It's not about validating these people, it's about getting potential info out early, which is one reason why people are on this board. Most of the newspaper writers are never right and yet their speculation is posted on here constantly. At the worst, that's really all this is, and it has the potential to be much more than that depending on how you perceive the record of these insiders.

[Schwarber Fan]

Insiders say Angelos has signed off on the deal... we'll see what happens.

[Ryno12]

Orioles Hangout Front Page is reporting Roberts to Cubs deal finalized. The article says the deal is Cedeno, Gallagher, and Marshall.

 

Here's the link:

 

http://www.orioleshangout.com/article.asp?ID=1297

[Ding Dong Johnson]

yuck

[blufftonbuck]

Orioles Hangout Front Page is reporting Roberts to Cubs deal finalized. The article says the deal is Cedeno, Gallagher, and Marshall.

 

Here's the link:

 

http://www.orioleshangout.com/article.asp?ID=1297

 

Way too much. That is just disturbing how much we overpaid if true.

 

Edit: Especially since we have 2nd baseman already and this is less competition for Marquis and Dempster in the rotation.

Edited January 9, 2008 by blufftonbuck

[E.J.]

I'm probably in the minority, but I'm upset about giving up Cedeno. I hate the fact that The Riot is our SS full-time with no backup at all. Cedeno was still young and could have figured things out at the major league level. I'll miss Gallagher, but I'm not too upset about giving up Marshall.

[badnews]

From what I'm seeing now I fully expect to this topic to be 134 pages the next time I log on.

 

Rip-off.

[Ryno12]

I really wish we wouldn't have given up two pitchers in this deal. I thought Cedeno deserved another chance, but isn't a huge loss. However, our starting pitching depth is now lacking. I hate to see two young major league ready pitchers leave in a deal for one position player.

 

That being said, Welcome aboard BRob!

[badnews]

What makes you think I'm going to bother to track down entries and articles that old? I didn't ask you for links to prove what you said. Where's the thread that said the exact amount? It shouldn't be amazing even if they did know the exact amount, exact amounts were posted because other prospects were announced in the past, this isn't great mysticism here.

 

It looks very weird to me that every time someone says something about those guys, after every single post, there's a reply. That's being strangely over-defensive. You think you guys could let one skeptical post slide by without launching into a 1,000 word defense of... what? Guys you don't even know? That's bizarre to me.

 

Anyway, Roberts, yay, we got bilked, Hendry got cheated again, we can all post the lineups and drool and not be bored. The Insiders can be glad on the 45th try they got it right and hopefully we don't have to see the word "Orioles" on here again.

[TheDude]

When you take off the blue-tinted glasses it's a fair deal. I don't think anyone in the national media is going to look at this deal and say the Cubs overpaid.

[E.J.]

When you take off the blue-tinted glasses it's a fair deal. I don't think anyone in the national media is going to look at this deal and say the Cubs overpaid.

 

Agreed. I don't think we overpaid that much. I do wonder what happens to our pitching though. It's a little rough giving up 2 guys who could have possibly been our 5th starter this season.