The 2006 Thread, Current topic: Center Field

[gflore34]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

It's completely realistic. They have the money and the need. There's no reason they can't sign him. Any GM worth his salt could convince that type of player to come to Chicago with the available cash.

 

Now, I won't predict it will happen, but there's absolutely no reason why it couldn't.

 

I'd like to think Hendry is worth his salt and him, along with the Manager supposedly every player wishes to play for could get the job done. After all, shouldn't Master People Person Baker be good for something?

[AAApittsburgh]

This argument is as old as baseball, but I take the other side. A pitcher at his best can only help you win 20% of the team's games. A position player can help you win 100% of your team's games.

 

Further, in this case, I'm not so sure Prior is a #1 pitcher anymore. And even if he recovers to his 2003 form, Cabrera is already, at age 23, one of the five best hitters in the game.

 

I'd do Prior for Cabrera in a heartbeat, but I don't think the Fish would, and I KNOW Jim Hendry doesn't have the cajones for it. But it would improve the team.

Which is why the Marlins wouldn't do it. But if it did happen, I'd put Cabrera at 3B and trade Aram for a good pitching prospect and a corner OF.

[gflore34]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

As for who is going to patrol RF, I believe Hendry is going to go the trade route. Quite probably for a Juan Encarnacion type...

That type won't get us anywhere. You can take that to the bank.

 

We all know that but, such a move screams of Hendry, Encarnacion, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones or Jose Cruz Jr. (although he'd be a FA signing) these are what we can expect.

[YearofDaCubs]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

As for who is going to patrol RF, I believe Hendry is going to go the trade route. Quite probably for a Juan Encarnacion type...

That type won't get us anywhere. You can take that to the bank.

 

We all know that but, such a move screams of Hendry, Encarnacion, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones or Jose Cruz Jr. (although he'd be a FA signing) these are what we can expect.

Then, at least those who are left watching are in for a loong season yet again.

[AAApittsburgh]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

As for who is going to patrol RF, I believe Hendry is going to go the trade route. Quite probably for a Juan Encarnacion type...

That type won't get us anywhere. You can take that to the bank.

 

We all know that but, such a move screams of Hendry, Encarnacion, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones or Jose Cruz Jr. (although he'd be a FA signing) these are what we can expect.

Last offseason maybe. I'm not sure Hendry is dumb enough to make those kinds of moves this offseason if he wants to be GM of the Cubs for much longer. We're already hearing a lot more rumors involving the Cubs than we were last year during this time, which leads me to believe that we'll see something significant happen.

[gflore34]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

As for who is going to patrol RF, I believe Hendry is going to go the trade route. Quite probably for a Juan Encarnacion type...

That type won't get us anywhere. You can take that to the bank.

 

We all know that but, such a move screams of Hendry, Encarnacion, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones or Jose Cruz Jr. (although he'd be a FA signing) these are what we can expect.

Last offseason maybe. I'm not sure Hendry is dumb enough to make those kinds of moves this offseason if he wants to be GM of the Cubs for much longer. We're already hearing a lot more rumors involving the Cubs than we were last year during this time, which leads me to believe that we'll see something significant happen.

 

I'd like to think he isn't dumb enough as well but, this a GM who let his Manager bat the poorest team OPB players in the 1&2 slots all season long and early on, use Hawkins as the closer, etc. I don't believe he even had enough nerve to go to Baker, with stats in hand, and suggest a change in the 1&2 spots. I'm not suggesting Hendry should have dictated to Baker but, when your Manager is screwing up in such a blatant fashion...

[CubfaninCA]

I keep having this recurring nightmare that Jacque Jones is our RFer in 2006.

 

Getting Jacque Jones is a lot more likely than Giles. I think gflore laid out the most likely scenario where Giles will use the Cubs to get a better offer from the West Coast teams. Jmo but if Anaheim loses to NY, I think they'll go pretty hard after Giles. Their offense is not that good.

[CubfaninCA]

Is speculating about Giles realistic? We all know how this one's going to turn out, he'll let the Cubs Wine and Dine him ultimately to spurn their offer citing a desire to remain on the West Coast. Then of course, the blasted Cardinals will say boo to him and he'll sign with them for less years and money.

 

As for who is going to patrol RF, I believe Hendry is going to go the trade route. Quite probably for a Juan Encarnacion type...

That type won't get us anywhere. You can take that to the bank.

 

We all know that but, such a move screams of Hendry, Encarnacion, Preston Wilson, Jacque Jones or Jose Cruz Jr. (although he'd be a FA signing) these are what we can expect.

Last offseason maybe. I'm not sure Hendry is dumb enough to make those kinds of moves this offseason if he wants to be GM of the Cubs for much longer. We're already hearing a lot more rumors involving the Cubs than we were last year during this time, which leads me to believe that we'll see something significant happen.

 

I'd like to think he isn't dumb enough as well but, this a GM who let his Manager bat the poorest team OPB players in the 1&2 slots all season long and early on, use Hawkins as the closer, etc. I don't believe he even had enough nerve to go to Baker, with stats in hand, and suggest a change in the 1&2 spots. I'm not suggesting Hendry should have dictated to Baker but, when your Manager is screwing up in such a blatant fashion...

 

I don't think anyone foresaw Patterson being so awful. Baker just showed too much loyalty. Of course, he never gives young guys a shot. *shrug*

[goonys evil twin]

 

I'd like to think he isn't dumb enough as well but, this a GM who let his Manager bat the poorest team OPB players in the 1&2 slots all season long and early on, use Hawkins as the closer, etc. I don't believe he even had enough nerve to go to Baker, with stats in hand, and suggest a change in the 1&2 spots. I'm not suggesting Hendry should have dictated to Baker but, when your Manager is screwing up in such a blatant fashion...

 

I don't think anyone foresaw Patterson being so awful. Baker just showed too much loyalty. Of course, he never gives young guys a shot. *shrug*

 

I knew he'd be an awful leadoff candidate. I didn't think he'd be that bad, but I knew that move to leadoff would lead to disaster. It was a terrible move. And sticking with him when he was obviously failing miserably made it worse.

[CubfaninCA]

 

I'd like to think he isn't dumb enough as well but, this a GM who let his Manager bat the poorest team OPB players in the 1&2 slots all season long and early on, use Hawkins as the closer, etc. I don't believe he even had enough nerve to go to Baker, with stats in hand, and suggest a change in the 1&2 spots. I'm not suggesting Hendry should have dictated to Baker but, when your Manager is screwing up in such a blatant fashion...

 

I don't think anyone foresaw Patterson being so awful. Baker just showed too much loyalty. Of course, he never gives young guys a shot. *shrug*

 

I knew he'd be an awful leadoff candidate. I didn't think he'd be that bad, but I knew that move to leadoff would lead to disaster. It was a terrible move. And sticking with him when he was obviously failing miserably made it worse.

 

Neifi's inexcusable. Baker should have known for sure what he'd get. Patterson asked to bat leadoff and Dusty gave him the opportunity to prove himself. I wish he would have kept him @ 6 or 7, but w/ Nomar & Walker hurt, it was worth the gamble. Of course, he held his hand WAY too long. I could have lived w/ Hairston and Patterson at the top of the order for a while, but Patterson and Neifi was insane.

[goonys evil twin]

Patterson asked to bat leadoff and Dusty gave him the opportunity to prove himself. I wish he would have kept him @ 6 or 7, but w/ Nomar & Walker hurt, it was worth the gamble.

 

The decision was made prior to Opening Day, before the injuries, and everything I heard said the exact opposite about him "asking" to bat leadoff.

[gflore34]

Another point concerning Giles, given the weakness of this year's class, he may be biggest FA out there, when have the Cubs signed the biggest FA fish out there? One might say the Alou signing but, I don't believe he was the catch of that year's FA class.

[RynoRules]

I admit it: I am drinking from the Manny Kool-Aid.

 

Giles may be more realistic in terms of his "get-ability", that is unless his affinity for So-Cal is more truth than supposition.

Okay, so there is only one person in all of baseball that you would want more than Brian Giles. Good.

 

And I agree, that Giles is likely more "getable". Manny may be on the block, but the Cubs don't have the players to trade for him. Are you gonna trade DLee to get Manny?

 

And as far as the purpose of our discussion, which is RF, Manny cannot play RF by any stretch of the imagination. So, to get back on topic, is there any other RFer who is "getable" that is better than Brian Giles?

 

Probably correct, but getting him would allow us to move my new favorite player, Murton, to RF, where Dusty can test his theory that he has no arm. That was the point of suggesting Manny, but I digress.

 

And I do not see Abreu getting moved anywhere. He is the most underrated player in the game, and the Phils would essentially be pulling out a 97' Sox-like white flag in terms of their chances in 06'. They won't do that - they are only a no. 1 starter away from being a serious contender, IMO.

[goonys evil twin]

And I do not see Abreu getting moved anywhere. He is the most underrated player in the game, and the Phils would essentially be pulling out a 97' Sox-like white flag in terms of their chances in 06'. They won't do that - they are only a no. 1 starter away from being a serious contender, IMO.

 

They are also maxed out on payroll, littered with big contracts, and they've thought they were 1 pitcher away for 3 years now. At some point, they will get frustrated and want to try something else.

 

Personally, if I were them, I would not trade Abreu. But this is major league baseball, where teams make dumb moves all the time. The very fact that he is underrated may be part of the reason he could be moved. I do not think Philly would erupt if they dealt him. A lot of Philly fans feel let down by Abreu's 2nd half (kind of like how Yanks fans blamed ARod last year). They are sick of finishing 3rd every year, or just out of the wild card. The aura of the new stadium will start to wear off soon, and they will need to generate excitement.

 

They are far more excited about Utley and Howard than anybody else.

 

It could happen.

[MPrior]

So are we more or less decided that the #1 choice for RF is signing Giles?

 

If so, is it in the spirit of this thread to acknowledge that that might not be a possibility and come up with a backup plan? Or do we just move on?

[Bear Cub]

Isnt Matsui a free agent? Seems to me he is a better option than Giles.

[BigbadB]

Isnt Matsui a free agent? Seems to me he is a better option than Giles.

 

He might be. But, do you honestly envision him leaving the Yankees?

[HoopsCubs]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

 

Not surprising, but Giles was also fourth in the leage in runs created.

[rawaction]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

 

Not surprising, but Giles was also fourth in the leage in runs created.

 

Giles + Lee + Ramirez = Lot o' runs.

[HoopsCubs]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

 

Not surprising, but Giles was also fourth in the leage in runs created.

 

Giles + Lee + Ramirez = Lot o' runs.

 

Certainly more runs than Burnitz+Lee+Ramirez, but I would hold back on using your phrase "lotta runs" until we see who is batting 1 and 2.

[rawaction]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

 

Not surprising, but Giles was also fourth in the leage in runs created.

 

Giles + Lee + Ramirez = Lot o' runs.

 

Certainly more runs than Burnitz+Lee+Ramirez, but I would hold back on using your phrase "lotta runs" until we see who is batting 1 and 2.

 

I have faith that Hendry will get a token proven leadoff hitter whose likely to give a .340 OBP (Furcal, Lofton) to leadoff. That player combined with Murton/Walker/Barrett or whomever hits 2nd is what I am assuming would happen. Of course, I think Giles is a longshot at best.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Looking at it statistically, there were 16 right-fielders in 2005 that had at least 200 plate appearances and OPS values of .800 and above:

 

V. Guerrero, J. Drew, B. Giles, G. Sheffield,

G. Jenkins, L. Walker, J. Francoeur, B. Abreu,

J. Dye, J. Gibbons, S. Green, M. Cameron,

J. Guillen, J. Lane, E. Brown, T. Nixon

 

Interesting to note that Francoeur, Dye, Gibbons, Guillen and Lane had OBPs below 340.

 

It's pretty clear: unless the Cubs plan on taking a 1-year flier on Larry Walker or convince the Dodgers, Yankees, Brewers or Phils to trade Drew, Sheffield, Jenkins or Abreu respectively, the only real impact bat available for RF is Brian Giles. Screaming to the choir here, but Hendry has to focus on Giles. I would even advocate over-spending a little if he had to.

 

On the flip side, Hendry must stay away from the Juan Encarnacion, Aubrey Huff, Jacque Jones, Craig Monroe types of the world - that's a recipe for Burnitzitis.

 

Not surprising, but Giles was also fourth in the leage in runs created.

 

I agree. If we add Giles, I think we almost could live with Cedeno at SS, Walker a 2b, a Lofton/Hairston platoon in CF, Murton in LF and still have a very productive offense.

 

 

I just wish Hendry would got off the fixation for Furcal that I'm afraid he's on and focus on the best available FA.

 

Giles + Lee + Ramirez = Lot o' runs.

[Roast]

ok i've been gone for a while. So I'm gonna go throw up the poll, as it looks that you guys have put together a nice discussion. Just to remind you guys, Our two options which we narrowed it down to earlier are:

 

Trade for Bobby Abreu

Sign Brian Giles.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

If we get Giles do we have to give up our 1st round pick and a sandwich (as a type A)? IIRC, that's what would happen.

 

Ah, this year's class sucks anyway. Welcome to Chicago, Mr. Giles.