Ohtani to Dodgers for an ungodly amount of money

[Tryptamine]

Just now, LBiittner said:

This is a gazillion times more painful than the carlos correa drama from last year

That'll teach you to have expectations when it comes to the Cubs. Just grow old and cynical like me.

[SOFNR]

Nightengale has consistently proven himself to be completely full of horse feathers. No idea where the Cubs stand with Ohtani but I'd bet my house Nightengale doesn't either.

[chibears55]

5 minutes ago, Dfan25 said:

I don’t have access to the athletic but saw a headline from Mooney that says the Cubs appear to be pivoting in other directions .Guys Ohtani isn’t going to happen . I really don’t care what Jed said tonight . He is pissed that it got leaked . He probably wanted to give the impression they were in it until the end .

In a way it may give him some leverage with teams for a trade or another FA if they feel they might have to act fast to make a deal or agree to an offer otherwise they lose out if Ohtani agrees to sign with cubs.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

It is extremely funny to watch this thread get populated with contradictory information while people go "well that settles it, the thing that reinforces my prior conceptions was right again!"

[LBiittner]

3 minutes ago, Tryptamine said:

That'll teach you to have expectations when it comes to the Cubs. Just grow old and cynical like me.

I've got the old part down pat

[Jason Ross]

14 minutes ago, ToolDRT said:

Did Rogers update his stance from earlier? Last I heard he seemed to be sorta backing this up. I’m trying to figure out why this would have irked Jed so bad. Cause to be honest, if Bob is wrong and the cubs are in this, you’d almost think Hoyer would appreciate this “report” from Bob.

It would indicate the cubs have done the exact opposite to what Dave Roberts did this afternoon and kept a lid on their interest level. 

He did. Word for word "I wouldn't completely discount Soto. I put him back in the mix...if the Cubs strike out on Ohtani". That's not a "they're out on Ohtani" that's an if. Meaning...they're in at some level.

I think Jed is mad because he doesn't want people to think the Cubs are out on Ohtani. Look at the horsefeathers show reactions we have gotten here simply because Bob (on an island) said the Cubs wouldn't go to $500m. The Cubs were already a long shot here, and we knew that. But it's one thing to put a market equivalent contract on the table and lose to the favored Dodgers and it's another to make it seem like the Cubs were so ridiculous they were wasting everyone's time with a contract $50m below what everyone else offered. If the Cubs have been involved in the way, for example, Sharma suggested 2 days ago (he suggested they wouldn't be outbid) and people threw hissy fits thinking they cheaped out...I'd be pissed too, if I were Jed.

I don't think the Ohtani camp is really upset at speculation of who's "in". I do think they want their meetings kept quiet (why they might be more upset at things like Roberts).

Edited December 6, 2023 by 1908_Cubs

[Brian707]

People,  give it up he isn't coming to the Cubs. Enjoy life. 

[ILMindState]

21 minutes ago, ToolDRT said:

I mean, in my opinion if you went from coming in second the first time to being eliminated before the jays now, there was something “wrong”. Either with their pitch or not fully comprehending the dollars necessary to play poker here. 

A lot can happen in 6 years. In 2017 the Cubs were coming off a World Series. Teams couldn’t offer him as much money as they could now. Ohtani knows the league, players, country, culture, etc much more. It’s not even remotely close to being the same free agency experience. 

[ILMindState]

26 minutes ago, ToolDRT said:

I mean, in my opinion if you went from coming in second the first time to being eliminated before the jays now, there was something “wrong”. Either with their pitch or not fully comprehending the dollars necessary to play poker here. 

Edit: double post

Edited December 6, 2023 by ILMindState

[ILMindState]

25 minutes ago, ToolDRT said:

I mean, in my opinion if you went from coming in second the first time to being eliminated before the jays now, there was something “wrong”. Either with their pitch or not fully comprehending the dollars necessary to play poker here. 

Edit: wtf

Edited December 6, 2023 by ILMindState

[Ding Dong Johnson]

7 minutes ago, Transmogrified Tiger said:

It is extremely funny to watch this thread get populated with contradictory information while people go "well that settles it, the thing that reinforces my prior conceptions was right again!"

Do you have a handy graphic to help illustrate the point you are trying to make?

[ToolDRT]

3 minutes ago, 1908_Cubs said:

He did. Word for word "I wouldn't completely discount Soto. I put him back in the mix...if the Cubs strike out on Ohtani". That's not a "they're out on Ohtani" that's an if. Meaning...they're in at some level.

I think Jed is mad because he doesn't want people to think the Cubs are out on Ohtani. Look at the horsefeathers show reactions we have gotten here simply because Bob (on an island) said the Cubs wouldn't go to $500m. The Cubs were already a long shot here, and we knew that. But it's one thing to put a market equivalent contract on the table and lose to the favored Dodgers and it's another to make it seem like the Cubs were so ridiculous they were wasting everyone's time with a contract $50m below what everyone else offered. If the Cubs have been involved in the way, for example, Sharma suggested 2 days ago (he suggested they wouldn't be outbid) and people threw hissy fits thinking they cheaped out...I'd be pissed too, if I were Jed.

I don't think the Ohtani camp is really upset at speculation of who's "in". I do think they want their meetings kept quiet (why they might be more upset at things like Roberts).

I’m talking about earlier when he said he was close to writing an article about us being out or close to out. Can’t remember the wording. 
 

But I’m gonna double down on my point. Bob reporting that we’re no longer a factor while Dave Roberts was giving out information he should have kept to himself would actually make us look really, really good. It would show we’ve kept quiet enough to be considered “out” when we’re still in. That’s why Hoyer coming in hot is alarming. Something pissed him off enough to get into it with Bob in front of other reporters. That doesn’t strike me as a good sign. 

[s2obed]

The Athletic doesn’t say they’re out on Ohtani but the fact that they say they are pivoting says enough for me. 

Maybe Jed is just pissed  info got leaked? Jed loses leverage once other teams know Cubs are out. 

[Transmogrified Tiger]

1 minute ago, Ding Dong Johnson said:

Do you have a handy graphic to help illustrate the point you are trying to make?

Gonna have to make a new one with the No line pointing to "I knew it, Jed probably offered him 3/15"

[ToolDRT]

5 minutes ago, ILMindState said:

A lot can happen in 6 years. In 2017 the Cubs were coming off a World Series. Teams couldn’t offer him as much money as they could now. Ohtani knows the league, players, country, culture, etc much more. It’s not even remotely close to being the same free agency experience. 

Oh not at all. I agree there. But we were greatly behind the curve then with the lack of DH in the national league too. We shouldn’t have gotten as far as we did to be honest. Now, the playing field is even (in that regard) and we seem to have been booted rather early on. We’ll never know all the details of course. But in my mind that’s an issue with the pitch we gave. And unless something drastic happens nothing is really going to change my mind about that. 

[ILMindState]

1 minute ago, Transmogrified Tiger said:

Gonna have to make a new one with the No line pointing to "I knew it, Jed probably offered him 3/15"

The Cubs were never really interested. Jed was only mad because it was his first time finding out Ohtani was a free agent. 

[ToolDRT]

9 minutes ago, Brian707 said:

People,  give it up he isn't coming to the Cubs. Enjoy life. 

This thread seems split into groups of people who have come to terms with this and groups that haven’t. To me, it’s very,  eye obvious and I can’t see how anyone has any hope left. 

[Jason Ross]

5 minutes ago, ToolDRT said:

I’m talking about earlier when he said he was close to writing an article about us being out or close to out. Can’t remember the wording. 
 

But I’m gonna double down on my point. Bob reporting that we’re no longer a factor while Dave Roberts was giving out information he should have kept to himself would actually make us look really, really good. It would show we’ve kept quiet enough to be considered “out” when we’re still in. That’s why Hoyer coming in hot is alarming. Something pissed him off enough to get into it with Bob in front of other reporters. That doesn’t strike me as a good sign. 

This feels like a leap to support a perceived notion that the Cubs are not earnestly involved in the Ohtani sweeps. You're welcome to your views, Tool. I also know you're an intelligent person and deep down, you know just how often Bob Nightengale is just blatantly, and obviously wrong. He's on an island right now that is being supported by no one. 

I remain skeptical the Cubs will sign Ohtani. I even got a little pessimistic earlier today, started, by Nightengale, myself. But I think logic should dictate that when Nightengale is on an island, we go into those reports with heavy skepticism until someone else reliable supports it. To date, we have Nightengale saying one things, and Sharma, Mooney, Rogers, Heyman, and Levine saying another. At least as of right now. And sure, maybe this time Bob Nightengale has the scoop! But it's far more likely that the 5, far more reliable reporters aren't in the dark here.

Edited December 6, 2023 by 1908_Cubs

[WhyCantWeWin]

So out on both ohtani and Yamamoto? Jed needs to get over his fear of big contracts, his weird fetish of trying to model after the rays is absurd because they never have won a world series. You need star power to win. 

[almirhadzic123]

Bob Nightengale, the guy who tweeted that Counsell would decide between Milwaukee and New York and then he ended up a Cub a couple hours later lol this the guy you guys are losing time over LOL do better folks

[Irrelevant Dude]

Just now, WhyCantWeWin said:

 You need star power to win. 

And to some extent, to draw fans.  Right now this is a boring ass team.

[Jason Ross]

2 minutes ago, WhyCantWeWin said:

So out on both ohtani and Yamamoto? Jed needs to get over his fear of big contracts, his weird fetish of trying to model after the rays is absurd because they never have won a world series. You need star power to win. 

I think we should clarify here:

1. Bob Nightengale said the Cubs were out on Ohtani because they balked at $500m. This has yet to be supported by another claim. Sharma and Mooney said nothing of the sort in their article. The did use the word "pivot" but more in a "this is the contingency plan" kind of way, and not that the Cubs were actively doing that.

2. It does, however, seem the Cubs will pass on the Yamamoto market. It's looking like $300m+ That's from Mooney and Sharma, and those guys are close to the Cubs and very reliable. 

Edited December 6, 2023 by 1908_Cubs

[Brian707]

Just now, WhyCantWeWin said:

So out on both ohtani and Yamamoto? Jed needs to get over his fear of big contracts, his weird fetish of trying to model after the rays is absurd because they never have won a world series. You need star power to win. 

When you have PTR as owner, you run the team like the Rays. It is what it is. They would rather invest their profits in ****** political causes that benefit themselves

[Bertz]

8 hours ago, Bertz said:

If Jed doesn't pull down Ohtani, he ought to go after Soto.  If he doesn't do that for whatever reason, I'd expect two solid bats and a pretty stellar group of pitchers brought in.  Basically an offseason like this:

- Trade for Glasnow

- Trade for Jorge Polanco

- Sign Imanaga

- Sign Hoskins

- Sign one of the high end relievers (Stephenson?)

- Trade for another high end reliever (one of the Marlins lefties?)

It's not nearly as fun as an Ohtani or Soto offseason but that team is very very strong

Based on the Sharma/Mooney latest this...does not look far off

[ToolDRT]

3 minutes ago, 1908_Cubs said:

This feels like a leap to support a perceived notion that the Cubs are not earnestly involved in the Ohtani sweeps. You're welcome to your views, Tool. I also know you're an intelligent person and deep down, you know just how often Bob Nightengale is just blatantly, and obviously wrong. He's on an island right now that is being supported by no one. 

I remain skeptical the Cubs will sign Ohtani. I even got a little pessimistic earlier today, started, by Nightengale, myself. But I think logic should dictate that when Nightengale is on an island, we go into those reports with heavy skepticism until someone else reliable supports it. To date, we have Nightengale saying one things, and Sharma, Mooney, Rogers, Heyman, and Levine saying another. At least as of right now. And sure, maybe this time Bob Nightengale has the scoop! But it's far more likely that the 5, far more reliable reporters aren't in the dark here.

I genuinely don’t think that’s what I’m doing here. Though, maybe Nightengales report alone would have made me feel this way. To me, it seems that the tide has been shifting the last week and each new report seems to have us lower on the totem pole and more in the background than we were two weeks ago. 
 

Trust me when I tell you this, I want to be wrong about this more than anything. But something seems awfully pessimistic in regards to the cubs right now. I’m ready for the Hoskins, Glasnow, Chapman offseason to get over with already.