What will we spend our money on this offseason?

[Deeg]

Yeah, a big part of the appeal of Montero is that he and Castillo combine to provide depth and quality to that catcher's spot. Trading Castillo for Montero is just adding payroll for no reason.

 

Except the reason that Montero is left-handed, and pretty good against RHP even in his two down years. And that he's far better as a pitch-framer and general receiver than Castillo.

 

It would be nice to have the both of them as a platoon, but the Diamondbacks have no heir apparent at catcher and if you give them Castillo, Montero isn't going to cost you any additional talent. You can go out and sign a competent RH platoon catcher for a couple million easily enough.

[Guest]

Yeah, a big part of the appeal of Montero is that he and Castillo combine to provide depth and quality to that catcher's spot. Trading Castillo for Montero is just adding payroll for no reason.

 

Except the reason that Montero is left-handed, and pretty good against RHP even in his two down years. And that he's far better as a pitch-framer and general receiver than Castillo.

 

It would be nice to have the both of them as a platoon, but the Diamondbacks have no heir apparent at catcher and if you give them Castillo, Montero isn't going to cost you any additional talent. You can go out and sign a competent RH platoon catcher for a couple million easily enough.

 

The left handedness/effectivness v. RHP and pitch framing are nice, but they still add up to about the same total package as Castillo, except at 31 years old and guaranteed 3/40. You might be able to find a backup that plays better with Montero's strengths, but that's not all that appreciable an upgrade for the money and talent you're spending to swap Castillo with Montero.

 

Maybe Arizona would require Castillo to come back in any deal, no one can really tell since their new braintrust hasn't made any moves. That seems particularly illogical an ask to me(who else would want Montero and meet that price?), but maybe an MLB-ready catcher requirement sinks the Cubs chances. I like Montero, but that's a chance I'm willing to take. You trade for Montero and keep Castillo, you're basically signing up for 3 years of ~4 win catchers(albeit at a premium). You trade one for the other, and you're making an incremental at best upgrade for a similar premium and the deal doesn't make much sense.

[Deeg]

I'm not sure the upgrade is all that incremental. Even if you assume Montero never gets close to the guy he was before 2013 (which is by no means a safe assumption) he was still 100 OPS points better than Castillo vs. RHP last season. And it's pretty obvious the Cubs don't think Castillo's skills behind the plate are acceptable.

[Guest]

...And it's pretty obvious the Cubs don't think Castillo's skills behind the plate are acceptable.

Have I missed something that they have said?

[Guest]

I'm not sure the upgrade is all that incremental. Even if you assume Montero never gets close to the guy he was before 2013 (which is by no means a safe assumption) he was still 100 OPS points better than Castillo vs. RHP last season. And it's pretty obvious the Cubs don't think Castillo's skills behind the plate are acceptable.

 

Similarly, even if you think Castillo is a .631 OPS against RHP going forward(he turns 27 next year and has a .684 career mark, .758 in 2013), you can't hide Montero from every LHP. And the backup you get to platoon with him is very likely going to be worse(probably significantly) than Castillo's .845 career/.855 last year against them. They're both averageish catchers depending on how sold you are on framing numbers and/or Montero's decline. Trading the cheaper/younger one for the older more/expensive one is a bad idea. Getting both on the same roster so the catching position can wreak havoc offensively for little more than money is a pretty good idea.

[Guest]

For 3/$40 of a 31 year old catcher, we'd better not have to send them back anything more than a lottery ticket.

[Deeg]

For 3/$40 of a 31 year old catcher, we'd better not have to send them back anything more than a lottery ticket.

 

Catchers are like pitchers - the reality of the FA market is that you're going to have to overpay at the end of deals when they're likely in decline. Montero isn't a FA but is his deal more of an overpay than 4/56 (conservatively) for Martin? It's not a slam-dunk.

 

It would certainly be better to have both Montero and Castillo than just Montero. But if that's the approach, I think you'd have to give up something of some value. I don't think Montero is a straight salary dump at this point

[Clem Fandango]

MLBTR just put out their arb estimates for each team, this is the Cubs:

 

John Baker (5.141) – $1.1MM

Wesley Wright (5.105) – $2.0MM

Chris Coghlan (4.148) – $1.4MM

Luis Valbuena (4.148) – $3.1MM

Justin Ruggiano (4.019) – $2.5MM

Travis Wood (4.004) – $5.5MM

Pedro Strop (3.156) – $2.4MM

Jake Arrieta (3.145) – $4.1MM

Felix Doubront (3.120) – $1.3MM

Welington Castillo (3.009) – $2.1MM

[Hairyducked Idiot]

MLBTR just put out their arb estimates for each team, this is the Cubs:

 

John Baker (5.141) – $1.1MM

Wesley Wright (5.105) – $2.0MM

Chris Coghlan (4.148) – $1.4MM

Luis Valbuena (4.148) – $3.1MM

Justin Ruggiano (4.019) – $2.5MM

Travis Wood (4.004) – $5.5MM

Pedro Strop (3.156) – $2.4MM

Jake Arrieta (3.145) – $4.1MM

Felix Doubront (3.120) – $1.3MM

Welington Castillo (3.009) – $2.1MM

 

That makes me kinda want to trade Wood.

[Tryptamine]

MLBTR just put out their arb estimates for each team, this is the Cubs:

 

John Baker (5.141) – $1.1MM

Wesley Wright (5.105) – $2.0MM

Chris Coghlan (4.148) – $1.4MM

Luis Valbuena (4.148) – $3.1MM

Justin Ruggiano (4.019) – $2.5MM

Travis Wood (4.004) – $5.5MM

Pedro Strop (3.156) – $2.4MM

Jake Arrieta (3.145) – $4.1MM

Felix Doubront (3.120) – $1.3MM

Welington Castillo (3.009) – $2.1MM

 

That makes me kinda want to trade Wood.

 

I would think that's the plan after signing Wada.

[UK1679666180]

I would have never guessed that Baker still had service time left.

[Felix Leiter]

I think we have the depth at the corner OF slots, but need some CF help. Mendy is still learning and Lake is a question mark with his bat. Torii Hunter would have my interest but his age may be working aqainst him and don't know what he has left in the tank. But he's good in the clubhouse and could mentor the young ones for a couple years. Totally against signing Russell Martin to a 4 year deal, as I have confidence in Schwarber developing into a strong backstop. I'm afraid years 3-4 of a Martin deal would be bad. And of course, I'd trade Castro for a #2 starter today.

[TruffleShuffle]

i like john baker a lot, but he is a terrible baseball player. just give him some money to be a clubhouse leader/mascot and do media interviews.

[KaiserCesar]

Have him provide rain delay entertainment on the new Cubs network. 100% Pearl Jam covers by John Baker with some pop-up video trivia

[tfarks]

I think we have the depth at the corner OF slots, but need some CF help. Mendy is still learning and Lake is a question mark with his bat. Torii Hunter would have my interest but his age may be working aqainst him and don't know what he has left in the tank. But he's good in the clubhouse and could mentor the young ones for a couple years. Totally against signing Russell Martin to a 4 year deal, as I have confidence in Schwarber developing into a strong backstop. I'm afraid years 3-4 of a Martin deal would be bad. And of course, I'd trade Castro for a #2 starter today.

 

There's no question mark around Lake's bat. It's just bad and that's not going to change.

[Sammy Sofa]

I think we have the depth at the corner OF slots, but need some CF help. Mendy is still learning and Lake is a question mark with his bat. Torii Hunter would have my interest but his age may be working aqainst him and don't know what he has left in the tank. But he's good in the clubhouse and could mentor the young ones for a couple years. Totally against signing Russell Martin to a 4 year deal, as I have confidence in Schwarber developing into a strong backstop. I'm afraid years 3-4 of a Martin deal would be bad. And of course, I'd trade Castro for a #2 starter today.

 

There's no question mark around Lake's bat. It's just bad and that's not going to change.

 

Yeah, I had no idea there was still anyone wondering what Junior Lake could do besides being terrible at baseball.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I was thinking the other day it might be time to try for a Lake bounceback. He's still young and got some potential. I wouldn't mind seeing him start the year as our starting LFer and see if he could regain that 2013 magic.

[Guest]

Time to convert him to a pitcher who hits the occasional monstrous home run

[SouthSideRyan]

I'm just glad Kyle's found a new thing for today.

[Tyrant]

I was thinking the other day it might be time to try for a Lake bounceback. He's still young and got some potential. I wouldn't mind seeing him start the year as our starting LFer and see if he could regain that 2013 magic.

 

You're worried about Javy dragging the team out of playoff contention but you're cool with Lake opening the season as the starting LF?

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I was thinking the other day it might be time to try for a Lake bounceback. He's still young and got some potential. I wouldn't mind seeing him start the year as our starting LFer and see if he could regain that 2013 magic.

 

You're worried about Javy dragging the team out of playoff contention but you're cool with Lake opening the season as the starting LF?

 

I was kidding about Lake. I hope he's waived this offseason.

[Rob]

Time to convert him to a pitcher who hits the occasional monstrous home run

 

I think Lake is perfect for the Brooks Kieschnick type of role at this point.

[Guest]

goodness i thought it was obvious kyle was joking

 

NOBODY flip flops that hard

[SouthSideRyan]

Time to convert him to a pitcher who hits the occasional monstrous home run

 

I think Lake is perfect for the Brooks Kieschnick type of role at this point.

 

Yes, whatever it is Kieschnick is doing now, I'm sure Lake would be great at it.

[Rob]

Time to convert him to a pitcher who hits the occasional monstrous home run

 

I think Lake is perfect for the Brooks Kieschnick type of role at this point.

 

Yes, whatever it is Kieschnick is doing now, I'm sure Lake would be great at it.

 

Apparently he's running a BBQ joint now.

 

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