2013-2014 Chicago Bulls Thread

[Derwood]

Too lazy to check, but when was the last time a team finished with both the lowest PPG AND the lowest PPG Against? The Bulls had that distinction for awhile this year, though Indiana's defense is now 0.1 ppg better

[WrigleyField 22]

Yea but the Pacers stats are inflated by playing the Bulls a bunch

[SouthSideRyan]

I [expletive] loved Hawes. Never thought Noah would develop on offense the way he has. I guess much if his limitations in college were that there ws as no need for him with that stacked Florida team.

 

To my credit(and I believe most others) I laughed the Thomas over Aldridge selection right out of he building

[bcl412]

I [expletive] loved Hawes. Never thought Noah would develop on offense the way he has. I guess much if his limitations in college were that there ws as no need for him with that stacked Florida team.

 

To my credit(and I believe most others) I laughed the Thomas over Aldridge selection right out of he building

 

I didn't know much about basketball at the time and I thought it was a weird choice by the Bulls.

[Ryne Ween]

I was happy with Noah at the time. He was supposed to go 1-3 in the prior draft had he come out. I was happy with the Tyrus Thomas trade because I though Vic Kryapa was gonna be good. He had some big games in Portland and I thought he was gonna be a legit 4. Tyrus was the only athlete of the Paxson era.

[UMFan83]

I was happy with Noah at the time. He was supposed to go 1-3 in the prior draft had he come out. I was happy with the Tyrus Thomas trade because I though Vic Kryapa was gonna be good. He had some big games in Portland and I thought he was gonna be a legit 4. Tyrus was the only athlete of the Paxson era.

 

The problem with Noah is it seemed like the Bulls were collecting high energy, high effort bigs at the time, but had a glaring need for a low post player. Hawes was seen as a much better low post prospect, at least in my memory...he hasn't exactly turned out that way. I thought Noah would be another Tyson Chandler type player and never expected he would be able to have the effect on the game that he has.

[Ryne Ween]

While Noah ended up better, we coulda done a lot worse than Hawes who has ended being a really good player in his own right. If he was in an environment like the Bulls this whole time, he could be even better. Aside from Durant, Horford, Noah and Afflalo; hes arguably the next best guy (with Gasol and Conley Jr).

 

We dodged a bullet with Yi going #6. Hes the guy I wanted most and, almost certaily, we would have taken him at #9 if available. (then again maybe he would have developed into an all-star)

[Andy]

I was happy with Noah at the time. He was supposed to go 1-3 in the prior draft had he come out. I was happy with the Tyrus Thomas trade because I though Vic Kryapa was gonna be good. He had some big games in Portland and I thought he was gonna be a legit 4. Tyrus was the only athlete of the Paxson era.

 

The problem with Noah is it seemed like the Bulls were collecting high energy, high effort bigs at the time, but had a glaring need for a low post player. Hawes was seen as a much better low post prospect, at least in my memory...he hasn't exactly turned out that way. I thought Noah would be another Tyson Chandler type player and never expected he would be able to have the effect on the game that he has.

Yeah, I think my exact thought upon his drafting was 'great, a younger Ben Wallace'. He's made that thought look completely ridiculous.

[Ryne Ween]

Hold on you thought you were getting a younger Ben Wallace and you were unhappy? Noah is great but hes nowhere near Ben Wallace, a probable hall of famer and one of the best defenders in the history of the game. Noah not quite Ben Wallace at all./

[Bobson Dugnutt]

There's absolutely no way Ben Wallace ever gets into the Hall of Fame. He was a black hole on offense his entire career and his peak was about 5 years long. Outside of those years, he was very ordinary.

[cubbyvirus00]

Hold on you thought you were getting a younger Ben Wallace and you were unhappy? Noah is great but hes nowhere near Ben Wallace, a probable hall of famer and one of the best defenders in the history of the game. Noah not quite Ben Wallace at all./

 

How is Ben Wallace a HoFer?

[Bobson Dugnutt]

Hold on you thought you were getting a younger Ben Wallace and you were unhappy? Noah is great but hes nowhere near Ben Wallace, a probable hall of famer and one of the best defenders in the history of the game. Noah not quite Ben Wallace at all./

 

How is Ben Wallace a HoFer?

 

He's not. He's so assuredly not that Basketball-Reference doesn't even bother to put him on their Hall of Fame Probably list, which extends far enough down to include such greats as Mookie Blaylock and Byron Scott.

 

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html

[Ryne Ween]

I should have said "possible" because he is certainly going to get consideration. Basketball Reference probably uses some offensive stat based weighted system to get there "probable HOF" and means absolutelty nothing.

 

And this started with somebody being pissed about drafting "a young Ben Wallace" and me noting Wallace was a far better player than Noah. As for the HOF, there is some space between Noah and the HOF i think.

[Derwood]

I should have said "possible" because he is certainly going to get consideration

 

No, he will not

 

and me noting Wallace was a far better player than Noah.

 

Also, no

[cubbyvirus00]

I wonder if people over rate guys like Billups and Ben Wallace because of that 2004 team that won the title. It was a good collection of skilled players, but none of them should be considered for the Hall of Fame.

[Guest]

Ben Wallace going to the HoF ROFL

 

 

GET YOUR HOT SPROTS TAKES

[Ryne Ween]

I should have said "possible" because he is certainly going to get consideration

 

No, he will not

 

and me noting Wallace was a far better player than Noah.

 

Also, no

 

I dont know what to say other than you guys are wrong.

[Guest]

You know it's bad when Derwood is schooling you at sprots.

[Bobson Dugnutt]

I should have said "possible" because he is certainly going to get consideration. Basketball Reference probably uses some offensive stat based weighted system to get there "probable HOF" and means absolutelty nothing.

 

You have no idea how they determine the probabilities and yet you're certain they mean absolutely nothing? Ben Wallace was an above average, never elite, player for about 5 years. He is not going to get Hall of Fame consideration.

 

If you run a comparison through the first seven years of Noah and Wallace's careers, Noah comes out looking a little bit better overall. It's not an easy comparison because they're entirely different players, but I for one much prefer Noah's skillset to Wallace's.

[Derwood]

Joakim Noah, ages 25-28:

 

11.6 ppg, 10.7 rpg, 3.6 apg, 1.7 blkpg, .496% FG, .742% FT

 

Ben Wallace, ages 25-28:

 

6.4 ppg, 12.4 rpg, 1.4 apg, 2.4 blkpg, .502% FG, .410% FT

 

 

Is this even a real conversation?

[ConstableRabbit]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m695faemrG1rn95k2o1_500.gif

[Bobson Dugnutt]

Joakim Noah, ages 25-28:

 

11.6 ppg, 10.7 rpg, 3.6 apg, 1.7 blkpg, .496% FG, .742% FT

 

Ben Wallace, ages 25-28:

 

6.4 ppg, 12.4 rpg, 1.4 apg, 2.4 blkpg, .502% FG, .410% FT

 

 

Is this even a real conversation?

 

Yeah, but if you ignore the first five years and the last six years of Wallace's career, and also his offense for his whole career, he's definitely a Hall of Famer and Noah is nowhere near him.

[Ryne Ween]

He came into the league undrafted and didnt play for a few years. When he got to the pistons he established himself as an elite rebounder and shotblockers and the best defensive player in that era, and among the best of all time. With 4 DPOY awards and a handfull of all-nba teams, he very well might get into the hall. Noah is a great player, but not on Wallace's level. You guys probably were not watching basketball during his prime. He guarded multiple positions and averaged something like 3block/2stl a game. He was universally considered the best defensive player in the game for like a decade.

[Guest]

He came into the league undrafted and didnt play for a few years. When he got to the pistons he established himself as an elite rebounder and shotblockers and the best defensive player in that era, and among the best of all time. With 4 DPOY awards and a handfull of all-nba teams, he very well might get into the hall. Noah is a great player, but not on Wallace's level. You guys probably were not watching basketball during his prime. He guarded multiple positions and averaged something like 3block/2stl a game. He was universally considered the best defensive player in the game for like a decade.

 

What decade was this?

[Bobson Dugnutt]

He came into the league undrafted and didnt play for a few years. When he got to the pistons he established himself as an elite rebounder and shotblockers and the best defensive player in that era, and among the best of all time. With 4 DPOY awards and a handfull of all-nba teams, he very well might get into the hall. Noah is a great player, but not on Wallace's level. You guys probably were not watching basketball during his prime. He guarded multiple positions and averaged something like 3block/2stl a game. He was universally considered the best defensive player in the game for like a decade.

 

He's played in 4 less games than Noah through the first 7 years of their careers.

 

He was an embarrassment on offense and he maintained his status as an elite defensive player for a pretty short time. Even when his defense was elite, he gave much of that back on the other end of the court.