Miguel Alfredo Gonzalez Signs with the Phillies

[Neuby]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

[Guest]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

 

Soler?

[Neuby]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

 

Soler?

 

Soler is still a few years away and is having some character issues with lack of hustle and getting suspended. He was ranked well behind Puig and Cespedes who are currently staring in the Majors. Soler was a great signing but we didn't land the big fish.

[Guest]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

 

Soler?

 

Soler is still a few years away and is having some character issues with lack of hustle and getting suspended. He was ranked well behind Puig and Cespedes who are currently staring in the Majors. Soler was a great signing but we didn't land the big fish.

 

 

The bold isn't exactly true and the first part is LOL.

[Neuby]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

 

Soler?

 

Soler is still a few years away and is having some character issues with lack of hustle and getting suspended. He was ranked well behind Puig and Cespedes who are currently staring in the Majors. Soler was a great signing but we didn't land the big fish.

 

 

The bold isn't exactly true and the first part is LOL.

 

Are you trying to say that Soler wasn't ranked behind or that he isn't a few years away? Just based off the contracts the three of them landed there is quite a bit of difference in terms of how teams viewed there talent and it looks like the scouting reports were spot on considering both are all star caliber players currently putting up numbers in the majors not single A Daytona.

[SouthSideRyan]

I'd be more interested in Gonzalez but Theo so far has struck out when it comes to landing top international talent thats not restricted by the new CBA. We've come just short in trying to get Darvish,Puig,Cespedes. Maybe Gonzalez is the 1 we finally win.

 

Soler?

 

Soler is still a few years away and is having some character issues with lack of hustle and getting suspended. He was ranked well behind Puig and Cespedes who are currently staring in the Majors. Soler was a great signing but we didn't land the big fish.

 

 

The bold isn't exactly true and the first part is LOL.

 

Are you trying to say that Soler wasn't ranked behind or that he isn't a few years away? Just based off the contracts the three of them landed there is quite a bit of difference in terms of how teams viewed there talent and it looks like the scouting reports were spot on considering both are all star caliber players currently putting up numbers in the majors not single A Daytona.

 

Soler was the first to sign. If they signed in reverse order, Soler would've received a lot more money. He's also 6 years younger than Cespedes.

[XZero771679666304]

And I'm pretty sure Puig wasn't as well regarded as Soler or Cespedes.

[SouthSideRyan]

And I'm pretty sure Puig wasn't as well regarded as Soler or Cespedes.

 

That was my recollection as well

[Guest]

Yeah. Soler didn't sign before Cespedes, though. Not sure if that's what you meant, SSR.

[SouthSideRyan]

Yeah. Soler didn't sign before Cespedes, though. Not sure if that's what you meant, SSR.

 

Hm, maybe all the early rumors threw me off

[Guest]

And I'm pretty sure Puig wasn't as well regarded as Soler or Cespedes.

 

That was my recollection as well

 

You're both correct. Soler was more well regarded than Puig.

 

Also, if you're going to knock Soler for character issues and lack of hustle, you better knock Puig who has had similar issues.

[Sammy Sofa]

Puig seemingly wasn't well regarded by analysts and reporters and message board people and anyone else looking in, but there turned out be teams REALLY interested, included ours, so the "outside" opinions about these types of guys might not always be the most informed.

[sneakypower]

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=61110&p=2822919#p2822919

[Sammy Sofa]

Exactly.

[Guest]

http://www.northsidebaseball.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=61110&p=2822919#p2822919

 

What sucks about most of that is how right Kyle ended up being (even though it is just hindsight).

[Guest]

that was the general perception of the signing at the time though. he kind of came out of nowhere, but was universally rated below soler. then the dodgers signed him out of nowhere and pretty much everyone was shocked he got that much.

[sneakypower]

keithlaw ‏@keithlaw 3 Jun (2013)

Now, Puig. Career, Soler. RT @cubswin32: @keithlaw puig or soler???

 

ESPN ‏@MLBRumorCentral 28 Jun 12

@keithlaw tells us this AM that nobody he's spoken w/ views Puig as a better prospect than Soler. More to come, obviously.

[Sammy Sofa]

that was the general perception of the signing at the time though. he kind of came out of nowhere, but was universally rated below soler. then the dodgers signed him out of nowhere and pretty much everyone was shocked he got that much.

 

But the Dodgers didn't sign him "out of nowhere;" other teams were interested and were willing to spend big money. The only "out of nowhere" part were people on the outside looking in with relatively minimal information who were just wrong. The teams involved apparently had a much better idea of who he was/is.

[bukie]

that was the general perception of the signing at the time though. he kind of came out of nowhere, but was universally rated below soler. then the dodgers signed him out of nowhere and pretty much everyone was shocked he got that much.

 

But the Dodgers didn't sign him "out of nowhere;" other teams were interested and were willing to spend big money. The only "out of nowhere" part were people on the outside looking in with relatively minimal information who were just wrong. The teams involved apparently had a much better idea of who he was/is.

That is an argument framed around hindsight, though. It worked out, so the Dodgers knew what they were doing, obviously.

[Neuby]

Well looks the Dodgers have the best scouts in baseball because Puig looks like Bo Jackson on the field and is the same age as Soler. One is in the majors one is in Single A coming off a league suspension and one from the team. If you want to exclude Puig from the discussion the Cubs still came in second on Darvish and Cesepedes too young all stars currently in the majors. |ts good to hear some scouts view him the better players long term but those same scouts also thought Corey Patterson was the next Barry Bonds and Chris Davis wouldn't hit enough to warrant hs strikeouts.

[XZero771679666304]

Well looks the Dodgers have the best scouts in baseball because Puig looks like Bo Jackson on the field and is the same age as Soler. One is in the majors one is in Single A coming off a league suspension and one from the team. If you want to exclude Puig from the discussion the Cubs still came in second on Darvish and Cesepedes too young all stars currently in the majors. |ts good to hear some scouts view him the better players long term but those same scouts also thought Corey Patterson was the next Barry Bonds and Chris Davis wouldn't hit enough to warrant hs strikeouts.

 

Actually Puig is about a year older. And has had character issues. And, you know, small sample size. Darvish was a blind bid. Cespedes is the one you can point at and say the FO messed up.

 

When people were talking about the Cubans before they signed, the discussion was about Cespedes and Soler. Puig was an afterthought almost, certainly not a "priority" sign. But hindsight is 20/20.

[Guest]

Well looks the Dodgers have the best scouts in baseball because Puig looks like Bo Jackson on the field and is the same age as Soler. One is in the majors one is in Single A coming off a league suspension and one from the team. If you want to exclude Puig from the discussion the Cubs still came in second on Darvish and Cesepedes too young all stars currently in the majors. |ts good to hear some scouts view him the better players long term but those same scouts also thought Corey Patterson was the next Barry Bonds and Chris Davis wouldn't hit enough to warrant hs strikeouts.

 

Soler is actually 15 months younger, but who cares about that.

 

Obviously, Soler vs. Puig is already settled.

[jersey cubs fan]

Well looks the Dodgers have the best scouts in baseball because Puig looks like Bo Jackson on the field and is the same age as Soler. One is in the majors one is in Single A coming off a league suspension and one from the team. If you want to exclude Puig from the discussion the Cubs still came in second on Darvish and Cesepedes too young all stars currently in the majors. |ts good to hear some scouts view him the better players long term but those same scouts also thought Corey Patterson was the next Barry Bonds and Chris Davis wouldn't hit enough to warrant hs strikeouts.

 

This portion right here is completely stupid to include.

[jersey cubs fan]

Puig was an afterthought almost, certainly not a "priority" sign. But hindsight is 20/20.

 

Baseball executives are supposed to have a greater ability to judge such things than the media experts that write about them and especially the fans who form opinions based on those media reports.

 

It's not hindsight for them.

[Guest]

Well looks the Dodgers have the best scouts in baseball because Puig looks like Bo Jackson on the field and is the same age as Soler. One is in the majors one is in Single A coming off a league suspension and one from the team. If you want to exclude Puig from the discussion the Cubs still came in second on Darvish and Cesepedes too young all stars currently in the majors. |ts good to hear some scouts view him the better players long term but those same scouts also thought Corey Patterson was the next Barry Bonds and Chris Davis wouldn't hit enough to warrant hs strikeouts.

 

Actually Puig is about a year older. And has had character issues. And, you know, small sample size. Darvish was a blind bid. Cespedes is the one you can point at and say the FO messed up.

 

When people were talking about the Cubans before they signed, the discussion was about Cespedes and Soler. Puig was an afterthought almost, certainly not a "priority" sign. But hindsight is 20/20.

 

Can you though? I think the jury is still out.

 

This year he's on pace for an OK WAR total (that is largely tied up in fielding after having it be a huge negative last year - but he is playing more LF than CF) but his triple slash is pretty gross.

 

And (to Neuby's post) what the hell does "hit enough to warrant his strikeouts" mean? Nothing has to warrant strikeouts. They aren't inherently bad and don't need to be made up for or "warranted." People may have thought that Davis's strikeout numbers were an indication that he wouldn't be able to be a productive hitter, but that's a completely different thing.

 

And yes, we understand that highly thought of prospects bust (re: Patterson).

Edited July 3, 2013 by David