Trading Soriano

[ctcf]

The Red Sox are still very likely to finish last in the East. What they've done thus far is Hendry-esque patchwork [expletive] that never works, is a gigantic waste of money, but maybe gets you from 70 wins to 74. I hope those 4 wins are worth the 77 mill and counting, you've thrown out the window to get them.

 

I'm pretty sure they've improved more than that.

 

Healthy seasons from Pedroia and Ellsbury (if they keep them) should also help.

 

Still need SP though.

 

If they improve significantly more than that it's because players bounced back and stayed healthy, not because of the deals they signed.

[Guest]

The Red Sox are still very likely to finish last in the East. What they've done thus far is Hendry-esque patchwork [expletive] that never works, is a gigantic waste of money, but maybe gets you from 70 wins to 74. I hope those 4 wins are worth the 77 mill and counting, you've thrown out the window to get them.

 

I'm pretty sure they've improved more than that.

 

Healthy seasons from Pedroia and Ellsbury (if they keep them) should also help.

 

Still need SP though.

 

If they improve significantly more than that it's because players bounced back and stayed healthy, not because of the deals they signed.

 

It's because of both.

[davell]

They evidently are looking at trading Ellsbury. No clue what they may target for him, but they're looking up at every team in that division right now, especially the Rays and Blue Jays. The Yanks are old, but still have more talent than they do and the Orioles are fairly young, more talented, and may have a big move in them this offseason. Napoli and Victorino are both guys you sign to compete immediately. They're regressing and the 2nd and 3rd years of each of those deals likely aren't very helpful.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Kyle, I get that you feel compelled to beat the "front office isn't doing a good job unless they sign big FA's" drum or whatever the hell it is you ramble on about in like every freaking post, but apparently implying the Red Sox are doing a better job is probably not the best way to go about that.

 

My drum is "the front office isn't doing a good job unless they field a good baseball team at the Major League level."

 

I know that's crazybuckets and it means I don't understand the "plan," but it's my drum.

[biittner77]

Whether you believe that the Red Sox plan is their best long term strategy is moot. They might very well be better off punting this season. The fact that they aren't suggests that they will be at least a little better this year. They will certainly be better than they would be if they hit the reset button like the Cubs did.

 

The Orioles were 13-5 against the Red Sox last season. Any improvement by a team that they will play a lot will hurt their chances of making the playoffs. Oddly enough, they were also 13-5 against the Yankees. I doubt that they'll be able to do that again. Thus, I'm skeptical of the Orioles as a legit contender this season. Didn't they have one of the worst run differentials of any playoff team last season?

[Sammy Sofa]

Whether you believe that the Red Sox plan is their best long term strategy is moot. They might very well be better off punting this season. The fact that they aren't suggests that they will be at least a little better this year. They will certainly be better than they would be if they hit the reset button like the Cubs did.

 

The Orioles were 13-5 against the Red Sox last season. Any improvement by a team that they will play a lot will hurt their chances of making the playoffs. Oddly enough, they were also 13-5 against the Yankees. I doubt that they'll be able to do that again. Thus, I'm skeptical of the Orioles as a legit contender this season. Didn't they have one of the worst run differentials of any playoff team last season?

 

I do know they won a freakish amount of one-run games and come from behind games, and yes, I seem to recall it being pointed out that they had actually been outscored by their opponents pretty deep into the season.

[Cubswin11]

Whether you believe that the Red Sox plan is their best long term strategy is moot. They might very well be better off punting this season. The fact that they aren't suggests that they will be at least a little better this year. They will certainly be better than they would be if they hit the reset button like the Cubs did.

 

The Orioles were 13-5 against the Red Sox last season. Any improvement by a team that they will play a lot will hurt their chances of making the playoffs. Oddly enough, they were also 13-5 against the Yankees. I doubt that they'll be able to do that again. Thus, I'm skeptical of the Orioles as a legit contender this season. Didn't they have one of the worst run differentials of any playoff team last season?

Not only were they the worst, I'm pretty sure they had one of the worst run differentials historically for a playoff team. They also had a crazy W/L record in 1 run and extra inning games.

[jersey cubs fan]

They finished +7, 8 teams with a worse record had a better run differential.

 

Over their last 7 games they went 5-2 with a +18.

[Guest]

Machado could help next year, though.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Kyle, I get that you feel compelled to beat the "front office isn't doing a good job unless they sign big FA's" drum or whatever the hell it is you ramble on about in like every freaking post, but apparently implying the Red Sox are doing a better job is probably not the best way to go about that.

 

My drum is "the front office isn't doing a good job unless they field a good baseball team at the Major League level."

 

I know that's crazybuckets and it means I don't understand the "plan," but it's my drum.

 

I definitely see where you're coming from. Back to the building competive big league team and building a strong farm system doesn't need to be an either/or propsition for a high revenue organization. While there's no reason not to give the right players 3-5 year contracts, it could just be that the right players aren't willing to sign at "our price," at least not this early in the offseason. Guys like Marcum and McCarthy, or at least their agents who realistically should end up with 3-4 year deals are probably waiting for Greinke and Jackson to be off the market, in hopes that teams will over pay for them. And looking at how many team are in the hunt for starting pitching, I wouldn't be surprised if it pays off for them. As for the available outfielders, after seeing what Victorino got, I don't think we want to go to in on Bourn.

 

The other option is to go all in and overpay for someone who might be better than what we have, but not enough so that they warrant a a bigger contract than they're worth. The one exception might be Hamilton, who warts and all is someone who could catapult us right into contention.

[SouthSideRyan]

The Red Sox are still very likely to finish last in the East. What they've done thus far is Hendry-esque patchwork [expletive] that never works, is a gigantic waste of money, but maybe gets you from 70 wins to 74. I hope those 4 wins are worth the 77 mill and counting, you've thrown out the window to get them.

 

I'm pretty sure they've improved more than that.

 

Healthy seasons from Pedroia and Ellsbury (if they keep them) should also help.

 

Still need SP though.

 

If they improve significantly more than that it's because players bounced back and stayed healthy, not because of the deals they signed.

 

The Victorino contract is bad, but God what an awful post this is.

 

These contracts are bad because the Red Sox have players who are likely to bounce back and be healthier therefore if they're good, it's because of that and not because of the decent to good players they signed as free agents.

[Guest]

Why did I feel like Pedroia missed more than 20 games last year?

[neely crenshaw]

don't forget that Ortiz was having an MVP type season and then missed a ton of games around the deadline...

once they handed middlebrooks the 3rd base job, he got hurt after a great start and don't forget that Lester, buckholtz and beckett all had huge fall offs from their norms and lackey didn't throw a pitch. Lackey has been trending down but that put Matsuzaka in the rotation and I thought he was out of baseball.

Bottom line is they had a whole bunch go wrong to finish where they did. They cut some of those troubles but if what returns just bounces back to their average, they are a 90 win team.

[rocket]

According to Heyman, a Soriano + Cash for Domonic Brown trade is on the table, but the Phillies are going to explore the FA route first

 

Hopefully the FA route fails, Brown on the Cubs is intriguing

[Tryptamine]

DKnobler ‏@DKnobler

 

Cubs also shopped Soriano to Astros as a possible DH, but Astros don't have enough money (even with Cubs contributing a lot).

 

How the hell does a team with a 10 million dollar payroll not have enough money to take on Soriano with the Cubs contributing a lot? That is absolutely ridiculous.

[Guest]

There's nothing individually wrong with having Brown, DeJesus, or Schierholtz holding down an OF spot, or having Valbuena/Stewart manning 3B. All 4 at once would be a pretty huge disappointment. I do like Brown the best of those 4 though, so that's something.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

According to Heyman, a Soriano + Cash for Domonic Brown trade is on the table, but the Phillies are going to explore the FA route first

 

Hopefully the FA route fails, Brown on the Cubs is intriguing

 

Surprised to see the Cubs offering to pay only $10 million of the $36 million owed to Soriano, if this report is true. I thought we'd be offering to pay a heck of lot more than that.

Edited December 11, 2012 by Bryant's Disco Ball

[Clem Fandango]

Brown's biggest issues have been health related. The last time he was completely healthy he raked, but IIRC he's been battling leg and wrist injuries for the last couple of seasons, not to metion a coaching staff/FO that really seemed to fight against giving him regular playing time. I'd still love to have him on the Cubs.

[davell]

According to Heyman, a Soriano + Cash for Domonic Brown trade is on the table, but the Phillies are going to explore the FA route first

 

Hopefully the FA route fails, Brown on the Cubs is intriguing

 

Surprised to see the Cubs offering to pay only $10 million of the $36 million owed to Soriano, if this report is true. I thought we'd be offering to pay a heck of lot more than that.

I think it's the opposite: They'd pay all BUT 10 mill.

[Guest]

According to Heyman, a Soriano + Cash for Domonic Brown trade is on the table, but the Phillies are going to explore the FA route first

 

Hopefully the FA route fails, Brown on the Cubs is intriguing

 

Surprised to see the Cubs offering to pay only $10 million of the $36 million owed to Soriano, if this report is true. I thought we'd be offering to pay a heck of lot more than that.

 

 

The Phillies might be more willing to take on salary than give up additional trade pieces. Or maybe there's an FA target or two the Cubs would rather have the money to pursue if they're going to move from Soriano to Brown in the OF.

[XZero771679666304]

According to Heyman, a Soriano + Cash for Domonic Brown trade is on the table, but the Phillies are going to explore the FA route first

 

Hopefully the FA route fails, Brown on the Cubs is intriguing

 

Surprised to see the Cubs offering to pay only $10 million of the $36 million owed to Soriano, if this report is true. I thought we'd be offering to pay a heck of lot more than that.

 

I'm pretty sure it was all but $10MM.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Gotcha. I was reading the summary at MLB Trade Rumors, and they wrote it incorrectly.

 

That makes a lot more sense.

[treebird]

There's nothing individually wrong with having Brown, DeJesus, or Schierholtz holding down an OF spot, or having Valbuena/Stewart manning 3B. All 4 at once would be a pretty huge disappointment. I do like Brown the best of those 4 though, so that's something.

 

that was my first thought as well. these guys are all fine as inexpensive placefillers, but the point of having guys like this around is so you can acquire real production in another spot. instead our entire non castro-rizzo offense is going to be those guys.

[Guest]

There's nothing individually wrong with having Brown, DeJesus, or Schierholtz holding down an OF spot, or having Valbuena/Stewart manning 3B. All 4 at once would be a pretty huge disappointment. I do like Brown the best of those 4 though, so that's something.

 

that was my first thought as well. these guys are all fine as inexpensive placefillers, but the point of having guys like this around is so you can acquire real production in another spot. instead our entire non castro-rizzo offense is going to be those guys.

 

Well, at least Brown has huge upside as he was the #4 prospect in baseball in 2011.

 

Especially if the struggles are injury related (and there's actually a chance for a full recovery).

 

But the other three, yea.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

I'm beginning to think Injury Recovery Bingo is a real game we are playing and we want some Wrist insurance in case Stewart does get cut.