R.I.P. Felix Pie's Career (2001-April 20, 2008)

[ctcf]

I don't care who produces, as long as there's production. It's not "bittersweet" for Reed Johnson to do well. It's good.

 

Tell me this: do some of you guys want Reed Johnson to fail in each at-bat?

 

I don't want him to fail. I just want him to not be successful.

Unbelievable. I thought we were past the point of wanting to withhold success from our players. Post-Neifi, if you will.

 

I hope Reed Johnson plays like this all season and throughout the playoffs (assuming we get there), that doesn't mean I don't fully expect him to hit reality in the next month or so.

[sneakypower]

with Soriano hurt it's not impossible for both Reed and Pie to get starts, in their natural positions, but that thought has not been considered. it's disappointing but that's life.

[Guest]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

[Derwood]

i'm all for johnson, theriot and whoever to keep playing as long as we're scoring 13 runs a game

[Electron Blue]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

 

you being sarcastic?

 

 

 

 

:wink:

[CubColtPacer]

I don't care who produces, as long as there's production. It's not "bittersweet" for Reed Johnson to do well. It's good.

 

Tell me this: do some of you guys want Reed Johnson to fail in each at-bat?

 

I don't want him to fail. I just want him to not be successful.

Unbelievable. I thought we were past the point of wanting to withhold success from our players. Post-Neifi, if you will.

 

I hope Reed Johnson plays like this all season and throughout the playoffs (assuming we get there), that doesn't mean I don't fully expect him to hit reality in the next month or so.

 

I don't think Reed's reality is as far down as people are implying though. He's a .750 OPS type of CF, which would make him average (average with the bat, average defensively). That's what he did in 2003-2005. Then in 06 he had his career year with an 867 OPS, and then in 07 he was playing hurt. To have a good chance at average isn't a bad thing for this Cubs team, because it means there's one less hole.

 

At the same time, I don't feel that playing him everyday is the most efficient way to get the best production out of him though (because of his splits), and Pie needs at-bats if he is going to adjust. It would be the best thing for both of them individually and the Cubs if Pie gets at least half of the at-bats against right-handers. The question then becomes what is the breaking point for how much Pie needs to play beyond that in order to develop properly, and how much can the Cubs afford to let him play beyond that minimum of half the at-bats.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

It's just that we've seen this Reed Johnson story before. And we've seen the Pie story before.

 

Mediocre veteran comes in, has a hot month, then gets playing time long after he no longer deserves it.

 

Young player with great minor-league numbers comes up, doesn't immediately start hitting, fans and management overreacts and presumes he is no good, player sits on the bench during important development time, player burns out. Then we wonder why we've developed one good position player since Grace.

[Outshined_One]

Then we wonder why we've developed one good position player since Grace.

 

Just wait until we replace his name with "Ryan Theriot."

[Derwood]

i could understand the outrage if the Cubs were playing Johnson and losing, but they're not, so chill

[KingCubsFan]

Hey, I have an idea -- let's start a bitter thread about the Cubs not playing Felix, after they score 13 runs for the second straight day. Especially when the current CF is hitting .356.

Wait, I have an even better idea. Let's bench our top position player prospect after 20 bad at-bats in favor of a journeyman outfielder who was cut in spring training, even though our team currently has one of the best offenses in the National League.

If anything, the fact that we just scored 13 runs for two straight days should support the idea that Pie should be playing, since his struggles wouldn't affect us too much.

[Garage Party]

We need all the hitting we can get against the Mets. Just because the Cubs blew out the Pirates doesn't mean they'll blow out the Mets. I have no reservations about riding the hot hands here.

[bring stone back]

Hey, I have an idea -- let's start a bitter thread about the Cubs not playing Felix, after they score 13 runs for the second straight day. Especially when the current CF is hitting .356.

Wait, I have an even better idea. Let's bench our top position player prospect after 20 bad at-bats in favor of a journeyman outfielder who was cut in spring training, even though our team currently has one of the best offenses in the National League.

If anything, the fact that we just scored 13 runs for two straight days should support the idea that Pie should be playing, since his struggles wouldn't affect us too much.

 

1) I'd say Soto is the best position player prospect right now. Prospect seems to be a relative term.

 

2) He's had more than 20 at bats.

 

When Johnson comes "back to Earth" then you can start dividing playing time. If anything, this is a fantastic scenario for the Cubs. Johnson plays well, buys Pie some more time to get a few spot starts and works on his swing in hopes he shows something, anything at all offensively, in a month or so and they can then throw him out there a few more times.

 

This is really not difficult to understand. Clearly the Cubs have not given up on Pie or the manager wouldn't be working with him personally so much and going out of their way to get him at bats in blowouts.

 

I could see the argument if he was hitting the ball well and it they just weren't falling but Pie looks so overmatched it looks like "bleacher fan - win an at bat" give away. Honestly, has he even squared the ball up and hit one hard? I can think of a deep foul ball and 1 or 2 flyouts. That's it.

[biittner77]

The problem right now for Pie is that the Cubs, Piniella are more concerned with who leads off than what's best for the future of the franchise. I for one don't buy the line that Piniella will be loyal to Reed Johnson the rest of the year because of one good month. Yes, he was loyal to Theriot last year but he did drop him down in the order later in the season.

 

Pie's future depends more on Tyler Colvin than Reed Johnson at this point. If Colvin can make some strides this year at AA Pie gets that much more expendable for that last piece to the puzzle come the trade deadline.

 

Finally, the Cubs did face LH starters the last 2 days. Lets see what happens against the next RH starter. I'm thinking (hoping) it looks like this:

 

Theriot (this may be the only production we get from him, might as well take advantage)

Fukudome

Lee

Ramirez

Soto

Derosa

Murton

Pie

P

[sneakypower]

the problem isnt Reed Johnson, it's that Pie was given a total of four games as a starter and has been firmly entrenched in the dog house ever since.

 

It took 1 game for Eric Patterson to get sent back down.

It took 8 pitches for Pignatiello to get sent down.

It took 7 ABs for Soto to get sent back to Iowa last year.

 

and so forth

 

you can't hand out 8 and 9-figure contracts to fill every hole on your team, you need young minimum salary players to step in and play. Lou has absolutely no concern of the future, which is scary because winning this year becomes so much more critical with the window rapidly closing.

 

that we're having success thus far shouldn't cover up what is a very legitimate concern.

 

Pie's future depends more on Tyler Colvin than Reed Johnson at this point. If Colvin can make some strides this year at AA Pie gets that much more expendable for that last piece to the puzzle come the trade deadline.

what are we doing now to get any trade value out of Pie? his value is rapidly diminishing when we're indicating we're much more comfortable with a guy fresh off the waiver wire out there instead. and like Juan Cruz, Patterson, Farnsworth, we'll have waited until his value is at an all-time low before trading him.

[biittner77]

I'll put this question out there for everyone: If Soriano and Ramirez started the season hitting well would Pie have gotten more starts?

[Mizzou]

The Cubs are rolling, Reed Johnson is and has been playing very well... so let's complain about Pie not getting enough playing time! This is so stupid. It would be one thing if Johnson were stinking it up. But he's not. Quit complaining.

[NOLA]

Hey, I have an idea -- let's start a bitter thread about the Cubs not playing Felix, after they score 13 runs for the second straight day. Especially when the current CF is hitting .356.

I gotta say you always have a sense of perspective I appreciate. I couldn't agree more. People here can always find a way to see things in a bad light. It is ONLY 4-20. While Felix is struggling for now, we are getting great production from a CF that we picked up off the trash pile. The ace of the Brewers is ailing. Our big question marks in the rotation are holding their own. Kerry Wood has been lights out as our new closer. The Cardinals are starting to remember that they stink, and we are in first place with Soriano on the DL and Aramis off to a slow start. Our offense is exploding and Rich Hill is starting to come along. Yet some continue to gripe, hoping Theriot (.338) and RJohnson (.354) fail so we can get our real prospects in there. Personally, I like to win games and be in first place. Pie will get his ABs in blowouts until he starts swinging better. There, I feel better.

Also, the whole Grit thing is mildly amusing, but he did have 6 total bases, 2 rbi, a steal and and great slide to break up a double play in the big 5th innning. Start him until he sucks, as some think (see hope) he will.

[Soul]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

 

You make the board rules, am I right? You could change it.

 

I don't think it makes it less interesting. Overreaction and hyperbole is in many Cub fans' DNA. I dare say the majority, actually.

 

This one, however, is a on a level that's beyond what most would say, even me in my worst Cub doldrums.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Its kind of a catch 22 for ole' Felix. hes not going to get regular playing time until he proves he can produce, however, hes not going to get an opportunity to produce, especially while the rest of the team is so hot.

[NOLA]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

 

You make the board rules, am I right? You could change it.

 

I don't think it makes it less interesting. Overreaction and hyperbole is in many Cub fans' DNA. I dare say the majority, actually.

 

This one, however, is a on a level that's beyond what most would say, even me in my worst Cub doldrums.

Bitterness and vitriol toward some players make it less interesting to me. There are a couple of players I dislike on this team, but I do not pretend to have an absolute knowledge of how they will perform this season. One extreme: the stupid Cubs "fan" in the bleachers who just wants to see and be seen and talk on his cell. The other extreme: one who gets so bitter about a few players even during a redhot streak.

[KingCubsFan]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

 

You make the board rules, am I right? You could change it.

 

I don't think it makes it less interesting. Overreaction and hyperbole is in many Cub fans' DNA. I dare say the majority, actually.

 

This one, however, is a on a level that's beyond what most would say, even me in my worst Cub doldrums.

Wow. The thread title was supposed to be a joke. Considering how serious most people take this board, it doesn't surprise me that so many people caught feelings. Delete the thread if you want. What this board really needs is more Theriot grit jokes, condescending posts towards anyone who doesn't worship Baseball Prospectus, Hendry fat jokes, and remarks about sportswriters.

[carolinacubbie]

Hey, I have an idea -- let's start a bitter thread about the Cubs not playing Felix, after they score 13 runs for the second straight day. Especially when the current CF is hitting .356.

Wait, I have an even better idea. Let's bench our top position player prospect after 20 bad at-bats in favor of a journeyman outfielder who was cut in spring training, even though our team currently has one of the best offenses in the National League.

If anything, the fact that we just scored 13 runs for two straight days should support the idea that Pie should be playing, since his struggles wouldn't affect us too much.

 

 

 

Do you honestly believe that we would have scored 13 runs today or yesterday had Pie been in the lineup instead of Johnson? I don't know what player any of ya'll have been watching, but Felix Pie is not ready for the major leagues. It is one thing to bash AAA pitching, but in AAA the ball doesn't move like it does in the bigs. Pie can't hit a breaking ball to save his life. Out of all the players on our team, when he is up I have the least amount of confidence. Right now he is fine for what he is, a defensive sub and a pinch runner. Yeah, we should worry about the future, but we haven't won a world series in 100 years, and I honestly think this team is good enough to win one, and Reed Johnson as of now gives us a million times better chance to win then Pie does. We are 12-6 with the second best record in the major leagues, yet you people still will find a way to complain. It is amazing to me, be happy that Reed is doing well, and pull for him. I can't believe some of you actually pull against him. Sorry, but that isn't being a fan.

[NOLA]

I'm so tired of over the top sarcasm, overreactions, conclusion jumping, absolutism, etc. I wish I could hand out warnings, suspensions & bannings for all that crap, but it's not really against the board rules. It just makes the board less interesting.

 

You make the board rules, am I right? You could change it.

 

I don't think it makes it less interesting. Overreaction and hyperbole is in many Cub fans' DNA. I dare say the majority, actually.

 

This one, however, is a on a level that's beyond what most would say, even me in my worst Cub doldrums.

Wow. The thread title was supposed to be a joke. Considering how serious most people take this board, it doesn't surprise me that so many people caught feelings. Delete the thread if you want. What this board really needs is more Theriot grit jokes, condescending posts towards anyone who doesn't worship Baseball Prospectus, Hendry fat jokes, and remarks about sportswriters.

Dude, I am so there. Got ya covered!

[Sammy Sofa]

The ironic thing is that the Cubs' offense doing so well should be encouragement to play Felix more, since they could deal with him struggling more easily with all the runs being scored. Yes, the last couple of games were aganst lefties, so Johnson should have started, but acting like he's the lynchpin of this offense and needs to be in there as much as possible aganst all pitchers isn't realistic. The team is showing they can work around a young player adjusting right now, and they should capitalize on that as opposed to making as much time as possible for a journeyman riding a hot streak.

[Tyrant]

...in favor of a journeyman outfielder

 

A "journeyman" outfielder who is on his second team?