Jones to get more chances, Pie losing out

[Tracer Bullet]

If Pie is not going to get a shot now, when we have players who can't hit or defend CF like Pagan and Jones as the only alternatives, when is he going to get a chance? If you want to platoon him with Pagan for a while to hedge your bets and stay in contention, that's okay. But playing Pagan or the abysmal Jones in CF against RHP is inexcusable when Pie is in the system, never mind already on the 25 man roster.

 

You can't always have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes(most times) players struggle for a while breaking into the big leagues. Considering Pie's potential, current production(defense included), and (lack of) alternatives to him playing CF, he needs to be playing.

 

Jacque Jones posted an .886 OPS v. RHP in 2006 and has a career .825 OPS v. RHP. That's a considerable asset if it's coming from your centerfielder. Indeed, only 3 qualifying MLB center-fielders have an OPS over .886 (Pence, Hunter, and Granderson) and only four more are between .825 and .886 (Rowand, Ichiro, Sizemore, and Suzuki). Twenty MLB center-fielders are below .825, including Beltran, Lofton, Mathews, Jr., Hall, Dejesus, Vernon Wells, Cameron, Church, Winn, Crisp, Andruw Jones, Chris Young, and Damon.

 

Jones obviously has had a terrible year to date. And he's not a reasonable option in a corner spot. But to describe Jones as "abysmal" when he's being contemplated as this team's CF is simply wrong. Obviously, he should never ever start against LHP, but he's more than a credible option in CF against RHP.

 

Jones is just broken at the plate right now. It's not as if he only had a .750 OPS against RHP in the first half, and is a good bet to turn it around. He's got a .635 OPS in nearly 200 PA's against them this year, and they're going in the wrong direction(OPS v. RHP by month: .662 in 79 April PA's, .630 in 65 May PA's, and .523 in 50 June PA's). Add in the fact that Pie is pretty capable against RHP too(.723 OPS despite his struggles, plus the minor league success previously posted) and a significantly better defender and baserunner, and it makes it an easier decision.

 

What it boils down to is why gamble on Jones turning it around when you can make a similar(better?) gamble with Pie and enjoy the other benefits that choosing him provides(defense/baserunning, grooming future performance, having Soriano's buddy to thumb wrestle with, etc.)?

 

Don't get me wrong - my preference is that they play Pie for those very reasons. I just think it's ridiculous to suggest that Jones is an abysmal option against RHP. (Also, all of BP's metrics rate Jones as an above average CF both this year and in his career) Also, I don't think it's a tremendous risk to assume that Jones will be significantly better against RHP in the second half. His extensive career track record likely ensures it. You're free to believe his 200 plate appearance sample is his new performance standard; I prefer to believe his 4000 career plate appearances are more telling.

 

JJ could be significantly better against RHP in the 2nd half and still suck. A 100 point jump in OPS against RHP still makes it only .734. His career track record doesn't ensure anything. It shows that some years he's good against RHP, some years he's great, and some years he sucks. Unfortunately for us, this appears to be a suck year.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

If Pie is not going to get a shot now, when we have players who can't hit or defend CF like Pagan and Jones as the only alternatives, when is he going to get a chance? If you want to platoon him with Pagan for a while to hedge your bets and stay in contention, that's okay. But playing Pagan or the abysmal Jones in CF against RHP is inexcusable when Pie is in the system, never mind already on the 25 man roster.

 

You can't always have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes(most times) players struggle for a while breaking into the big leagues. Considering Pie's potential, current production(defense included), and (lack of) alternatives to him playing CF, he needs to be playing.

 

Jacque Jones posted an .886 OPS v. RHP in 2006 and has a career .825 OPS v. RHP. That's a considerable asset if it's coming from your centerfielder. Indeed, only 3 qualifying MLB center-fielders have an OPS over .886 (Pence, Hunter, and Granderson) and only four more are between .825 and .886 (Rowand, Ichiro, Sizemore, and Suzuki). Twenty MLB center-fielders are below .825, including Beltran, Lofton, Mathews, Jr., Hall, Dejesus, Vernon Wells, Cameron, Church, Winn, Crisp, Andruw Jones, Chris Young, and Damon.

 

Jones obviously has had a terrible year to date. And he's not a reasonable option in a corner spot. But to describe Jones as "abysmal" when he's being contemplated as this team's CF is simply wrong. Obviously, he should never ever start against LHP, but he's more than a credible option in CF against RHP.

 

Jones is just broken at the plate right now. It's not as if he only had a .750 OPS against RHP in the first half, and is a good bet to turn it around. He's got a .635 OPS in nearly 200 PA's against them this year, and they're going in the wrong direction(OPS v. RHP by month: .662 in 79 April PA's, .630 in 65 May PA's, and .523 in 50 June PA's). Add in the fact that Pie is pretty capable against RHP too(.723 OPS despite his struggles, plus the minor league success previously posted) and a significantly better defender and baserunner, and it makes it an easier decision.

 

What it boils down to is why gamble on Jones turning it around when you can make a similar(better?) gamble with Pie and enjoy the other benefits that choosing him provides(defense/baserunning, grooming future performance, having Soriano's buddy to thumb wrestle with, etc.)?

 

Don't get me wrong - my preference is that they play Pie for those very reasons. I just think it's ridiculous to suggest that Jones is an abysmal option against RHP. (Also, all of BP's metrics rate Jones as an above average CF both this year and in his career) Also, I don't think it's a tremendous risk to assume that Jones will be significantly better against RHP in the second half. His extensive career track record likely ensures it. You're free to believe his 200 plate appearance sample is his new performance standard; I prefer to believe his 4000 career plate appearances are more telling.

 

I'm not implying that Jones is going to hit .600 against RHP for the rest of his life, but when you're forecasting a half season, there's a lot more variability. With that in mind you have to weigh that Jones has been awful at the plate all year, and has degenerated performance wise. To reiterate, the question is not whether Jones will improve, it's comparing that probable improvement v. Pie and his likely improvement(although this year Pie's got a near 100 point head start in OPS) and whether it's worth stunting Pie's development further plus the other miscellany(Jones would likely be a capable defender in CF, but Pie's going to save you runs in comparison).

[frostwyrm]

Pie was a great option for us when we sucked. Let the young guy get at bats in a season that's pretty much a waste. Our team got hot, and we're now right in the middle of what looks like it will be a great playoff race, and running Pie out there just won't cut it if we want to win. Everybody in this organization knows that Pie is the centerfielder of the future. We let him get a taste of big league action, he knows now what he has to do to adjust to being a big league player.

 

Ah yes. The old "you can't win and develop players at the same time" argument. And the "give the kid a taste and he'll figure out the rest back at the farm" argument. Very Dustyesque.

[Warren Brusstar]

If Pie is not going to get a shot now, when we have players who can't hit or defend CF like Pagan and Jones as the only alternatives, when is he going to get a chance? If you want to platoon him with Pagan for a while to hedge your bets and stay in contention, that's okay. But playing Pagan or the abysmal Jones in CF against RHP is inexcusable when Pie is in the system, never mind already on the 25 man roster.

 

You can't always have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes(most times) players struggle for a while breaking into the big leagues. Considering Pie's potential, current production(defense included), and (lack of) alternatives to him playing CF, he needs to be playing.

 

Jacque Jones posted an .886 OPS v. RHP in 2006 and has a career .825 OPS v. RHP. That's a considerable asset if it's coming from your centerfielder. Indeed, only 3 qualifying MLB center-fielders have an OPS over .886 (Pence, Hunter, and Granderson) and only four more are between .825 and .886 (Rowand, Ichiro, Sizemore, and Suzuki). Twenty MLB center-fielders are below .825, including Beltran, Lofton, Mathews, Jr., Hall, Dejesus, Vernon Wells, Cameron, Church, Winn, Crisp, Andruw Jones, Chris Young, and Damon.

 

Jones obviously has had a terrible year to date. And he's not a reasonable option in a corner spot. But to describe Jones as "abysmal" when he's being contemplated as this team's CF is simply wrong. Obviously, he should never ever start against LHP, but he's more than a credible option in CF against RHP.

 

Jones is just broken at the plate right now. It's not as if he only had a .750 OPS against RHP in the first half, and is a good bet to turn it around. He's got a .635 OPS in nearly 200 PA's against them this year, and they're going in the wrong direction(OPS v. RHP by month: .662 in 79 April PA's, .630 in 65 May PA's, and .523 in 50 June PA's). Add in the fact that Pie is pretty capable against RHP too(.723 OPS despite his struggles, plus the minor league success previously posted) and a significantly better defender and baserunner, and it makes it an easier decision.

 

What it boils down to is why gamble on Jones turning it around when you can make a similar(better?) gamble with Pie and enjoy the other benefits that choosing him provides(defense/baserunning, grooming future performance, having Soriano's buddy to thumb wrestle with, etc.)?

 

Don't get me wrong - my preference is that they play Pie for those very reasons. I just think it's ridiculous to suggest that Jones is an abysmal option against RHP. (Also, all of BP's metrics rate Jones as an above average CF both this year and in his career) Also, I don't think it's a tremendous risk to assume that Jones will be significantly better against RHP in the second half. His extensive career track record likely ensures it. You're free to believe his 200 plate appearance sample is his new performance standard; I prefer to believe his 4000 career plate appearances are more telling.

 

JJ could be significantly better against RHP in the 2nd half and still suck. A 100 point jump in OPS against RHP still makes it only .734. His career track record doesn't ensure anything. It shows that some years he's good against RHP, some years he's great, and some years he sucks. Unfortunately for us, this appears to be a suck year.

 

He's never once had a season with an OPS v. RHP below .775 and he's been below .800 only twice. So, no. It's not accurate to say that in some years he "sucks." A .775 OPS v. RHP (his WORST season) from a CF does not suck.

 

You're putting way too much emphasis on his last 200 plate appearances v. RHP. If allowed to play every day, I expect that he'll perform at or near his career standards (.825 OPS v. RHP) in the second half.

[Tracer Bullet]

If Pie is not going to get a shot now, when we have players who can't hit or defend CF like Pagan and Jones as the only alternatives, when is he going to get a chance? If you want to platoon him with Pagan for a while to hedge your bets and stay in contention, that's okay. But playing Pagan or the abysmal Jones in CF against RHP is inexcusable when Pie is in the system, never mind already on the 25 man roster.

 

You can't always have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes(most times) players struggle for a while breaking into the big leagues. Considering Pie's potential, current production(defense included), and (lack of) alternatives to him playing CF, he needs to be playing.

 

Jacque Jones posted an .886 OPS v. RHP in 2006 and has a career .825 OPS v. RHP. That's a considerable asset if it's coming from your centerfielder. Indeed, only 3 qualifying MLB center-fielders have an OPS over .886 (Pence, Hunter, and Granderson) and only four more are between .825 and .886 (Rowand, Ichiro, Sizemore, and Suzuki). Twenty MLB center-fielders are below .825, including Beltran, Lofton, Mathews, Jr., Hall, Dejesus, Vernon Wells, Cameron, Church, Winn, Crisp, Andruw Jones, Chris Young, and Damon.

 

Jones obviously has had a terrible year to date. And he's not a reasonable option in a corner spot. But to describe Jones as "abysmal" when he's being contemplated as this team's CF is simply wrong. Obviously, he should never ever start against LHP, but he's more than a credible option in CF against RHP.

 

Did you really just cut and paste this post? Or am I imagining things? Does that mean I have to go back and paste in my post about how unlikely it is that Jones is going to go from a .634 OPS against RHP to an .825 OPS against RHP overnight?

 

That's just weird.

 

Sample size.

 

Why is it that you refuse to believe Pie's 2007 MLB performance is indicative of his true performance level or that Murton's 2007 MLB performance is indicative of his true performance level, but want us to disregard Jones' 4000 career plate appearances and instead look to his poor performance in his most recent 200?

 

Sample size explains why you cut & paste one of your posts from earlier in the same thread? Oh, wait, never mind now I get it.

 

Did you see my earlier post where I said 185 ABs isn't really a lot? Well, I did. I don't necessarily think Jones is going to OPS .634 against RHP for the rest of the season. But I've looked at Jones's 3300 career ABs against RHP and, like I just posted, sometimes he's good, sometimes he's great, and sometimes he sucks. This year, his OPS against RHP is .634 and, as TT posted, trending downward. I don't think it's unreasonable to think he's going to perform closer to .700 than his near-.900 OPS from last year.

 

So why do you think it's more likely that in the next 3 months, he's going to suddenly OPS 200-300 points higher than he has over the last 3 months?

 

And as to your Q about Murton and Pie - probably b/c they're both young. Murton did well in his first full ML season and his minor league stats indicate he could be good in the majors. Pie's minor league stats (and scout's opinions) indicate that he could be very good in CF. Does that mean they both will? No, but if you're going to choose between playing those 2 or playing some combination of Floyd, Pagan, and Jones, it's crazy not to play the kids.

[abuck1220]

You guys need to chill out on this, really.

 

Pie was a great option for us when we sucked. Let the young guy get at bats in a season that's pretty much a waste. Our team got hot, and we're now right in the middle of what looks like it will be a great playoff race, and running Pie out there just won't cut it if we want to win.

 

and throwing jones and pagan (whose baseball IQ makes michael barrett shake his head in disgust, by the way) will? you say that it was ok for pie to play when the cubs sucked, but not now...well, part of the reason the cubs sucked was jones. so now that they're good again, it's time to go back to the guy that led you into suckiness? that makes sense.

[Tracer Bullet]

He's never once had a season with an OPS v. RHP below .775 and he's been below .800 only twice. So, no. It's not accurate to say that in some years he "sucks." A .775 OPS v. RHP (his WORST season) from a CF does not suck.

 

You're putting way too much emphasis on his last 200 plate appearances v. RHP. If allowed to play every day, I expect that he'll perform at or near his career standards (.825 OPS v. RHP) in the second half.

 

In 3 of his seasons, JJ had OBP of .327, .310, and .294. I don't care where you play, that sucks.

 

I'm not putting too much emphasis on his last 200 PAs, I'm putting some emphasis on the last 3 months and some emphasis on his roller coaster performance over his career. He's career stats look pretty good v. RHP, but he's had a couple really good seasons and a couple really bad ones. I just don't know what makes you so convinced this year is going to be a good one, given that it's started pretty darn badly.

 

Maybe what scares me most is that JJ has frequently had below-average OBP, but made up for that to some degree with some pop. This year, he's horrible at getting on base and horrible at SLG. A .327 OBP is bad, but if a guy slugs .490 that year (against RHP) - you can deal. But he's not even slugging well this year.

[anabiono]

hang on...what is the record of this ballclub when pie start versus when he doesn't?

 

anyone got this?

[Fred Hornkohl]

hang on...what is the record of this ballclub when pie start versus when he doesn't?

 

anyone got this?

 

Team record by starting center fielder

 

CUBS are 12-10 when Jones starts at cf
CUBS are 5-7 when Soriano starts at cf
CUBS are 18-12 when Pie starts at cf
CUBS are 8-13 when Pagan starts at cf

[HoopsCubs]

If Pie is not going to get a shot now, when we have players who can't hit or defend CF like Pagan and Jones as the only alternatives, when is he going to get a chance? If you want to platoon him with Pagan for a while to hedge your bets and stay in contention, that's okay. But playing Pagan or the abysmal Jones in CF against RHP is inexcusable when Pie is in the system, never mind already on the 25 man roster.

 

You can't always have your cake and eat it too. Sometimes(most times) players struggle for a while breaking into the big leagues. Considering Pie's potential, current production(defense included), and (lack of) alternatives to him playing CF, he needs to be playing.

 

It appears to me that playing Jones is a pure "showcase to trade" move.

Therefore, given Pie's recent struggles, I don't see playing Jones for a week to 10 days as a bad move if they stick to the goal. Jones did go 2 for 4 in a recent game - maybe he is showing signs to the coaches during BP that he's coming out of his funk.

 

Incidentally, Bruce Levine of ESPN radio AM 1000 has consistently said over the past 3 weeks that in his opinion, Jones should be kept as the Cubs 4th OF. Levine said last week that the Cubs main priorities are to deal Izturis and Eyre. Easier said than done, of course.

[Bote McBoteface]

Pie was a great option for us when we sucked. Let the young guy get at bats in a season that's pretty much a waste. Our team got hot, and we're now right in the middle of what looks like it will be a great playoff race, and running Pie out there just won't cut it if we want to win. Everybody in this organization knows that Pie is the centerfielder of the future. We let him get a taste of big league action, he knows now what he has to do to adjust to being a big league player.

 

Ah yes. The old "you can't win and develop players at the same time" argument. And the "give the kid a taste and he'll figure out the rest back at the farm" argument. Very Dustyesque.

 

I never said that you can't win and develop at the same time, though I do appreciate you putting words in my mouth. If Pie was performing there is no doubt he'd be in the lineup. There are better options right now, especially with the desire to trade Jones. Nobody is going to want him if he's sat on the bench for 2 straight months.

[Warren Brusstar]

He's never once had a season with an OPS v. RHP below .775 and he's been below .800 only twice. So, no. It's not accurate to say that in some years he "sucks." A .775 OPS v. RHP (his WORST season) from a CF does not suck.

 

You're putting way too much emphasis on his last 200 plate appearances v. RHP. If allowed to play every day, I expect that he'll perform at or near his career standards (.825 OPS v. RHP) in the second half.

 

In 3 of his seasons, JJ had OBP of .327, .310, and .294. I don't care where you play, that sucks.

 

I'm not putting too much emphasis on his last 200 PAs, I'm putting some emphasis on the last 3 months and some emphasis on his roller coaster performance over his career. He's career stats look pretty good v. RHP, but he's had a couple really good seasons and a couple really bad ones. I just don't know what makes you so convinced this year is going to be a good one, given that it's started pretty darn badly.

 

Maybe what scares me most is that JJ has frequently had below-average OBP, but made up for that to some degree with some pop. This year, he's horrible at getting on base and horrible at SLG. A .327 OBP is bad, but if a guy slugs .490 that year (against RHP) - you can deal. But he's not even slugging well this year.

 

You can't pick and choose the parts of a player's performance record you don't like. I've already demonstrated that Jones has never before had an OPS v. RHP less than .775. Never. Not once. That does not suck for a CF. (And it's not even close to sucking)

 

Rather than simply conceding a rather obvious point, you've decided to focus on OBP figures that Jones put up during past seasons. But I've already demonstrated that despite those relatively poor OBP numbers, he's neverthelss slugged enough to be an acceptable player (especially if his contemplated usage is as a CF). Focusing on Jones' OBP alone (and ignoring his adequate slugging in those years) is like saying that Derrek Lee's 6 home runs sucks.

 

Again, he's never once had an OPS v. RHP lower than .775. To be sure, he's been brutal in 200 plate appearances this seasons. But based on those 200 plate appearances alone, you've concluded that it's unlikely that Jones will post a .734 OPS v. RHP in the second half, a number that is .041 points less than his previous WORST SEASON. By definition, that's placing way too much importance on his last 200 plate appearances.

[Skyballer]

Y'all are getting so upset that Pie doesn't start everyday in CF and Lou said he would. I seem to remeber him saying Murton was the starting Lf and how the team loved Muton and all that but he didn't start in Lf and was soon moved to RF.

[Bruno7481]

Y'all are getting so upset that Pie doesn't start everyday in CF and Lou said he would. I seem to remeber him saying Murton was the starting Lf and how the team loved Muton and all that but he didn't start in Lf and was soon moved to RF.

 

Well, Soriano had something to do with that.

[Tracer Bullet]

He's never once had a season with an OPS v. RHP below .775 and he's been below .800 only twice. So, no. It's not accurate to say that in some years he "sucks." A .775 OPS v. RHP (his WORST season) from a CF does not suck.

 

You're putting way too much emphasis on his last 200 plate appearances v. RHP. If allowed to play every day, I expect that he'll perform at or near his career standards (.825 OPS v. RHP) in the second half.

 

In 3 of his seasons, JJ had OBP of .327, .310, and .294. I don't care where you play, that sucks.

 

I'm not putting too much emphasis on his last 200 PAs, I'm putting some emphasis on the last 3 months and some emphasis on his roller coaster performance over his career. He's career stats look pretty good v. RHP, but he's had a couple really good seasons and a couple really bad ones. I just don't know what makes you so convinced this year is going to be a good one, given that it's started pretty darn badly.

 

Maybe what scares me most is that JJ has frequently had below-average OBP, but made up for that to some degree with some pop. This year, he's horrible at getting on base and horrible at SLG. A .327 OBP is bad, but if a guy slugs .490 that year (against RHP) - you can deal. But he's not even slugging well this year.

 

You can't pick and choose the parts of a player's performance record you don't like. I've already demonstrated that Jones has never before had an OPS v. RHP less than .775. Never. Not once. That does not suck for a CF. (And it's not even close to sucking)

 

Rather than simply conceding a rather obvious point, you've decided to focus on OBP figures that Jones put up during past seasons. But I've already demonstrated that despite those relatively poor OBP numbers, he's neverthelss slugged enough to be an acceptable player (especially if his contemplated usage is as a CF). Focusing on Jones' OBP alone (and ignoring his adequate slugging in those years) is like saying that Derrek Lee's 6 home runs sucks.

 

Again, he's never once had an OPS v. RHP lower than .775. To be sure, he's been brutal in 200 plate appearances this seasons. But based on those 200 plate appearances alone, you've concluded that it's unlikely that Jones will post a .734 OPS v. RHP in the second half, a number that is .041 points less than his previous WORST SEASON. By definition, that's placing way too much importance on his last 200 plate appearances.

 

Your logic is confusing. I'm only allowed to consider only OPS in determining a) whether a player sucks, and b) how said player will perform in the near future. Well, I don't agree to play by the rules you have made up as our discussion played out, so I don't know what to tell you.

 

OPS is a stat that's easy to calculate and generally a fair measure of a player's ability, though it has its faults. Many people who are much smarter than I think that OBP should be weighted somewhere between 2 (Neyer) and 4 (Tango Tiger) times more than SLG when calculating even a rough stat such as OPS. So if you have a below starter quality OPS, but an OBP of .310 - you suck, by my definition and that of several other people. His OPS may never have been below .775 - but he still sucked in at least 3 years. That's not to say it's impossible to overcome a bad OBP, I suppose if he SLG .600 with that .300 OBP, that'd be pretty good, but we're not talking anywhere near that.

 

Oh, and to clarify - DLee 6 HRs do suck. We need him to be a power hitter and SLG a bit. He's made up for it mostly with doubles and an insanely high AVG for most of the year, but that aspect of his game sucks this year. But that's not to say he sucks this year. Why? B/c OBP is significantly more important than SLG and Lee's OBP is great.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Not great, but not a bad first start back out of the gate for Jones.

[shnsajax]

Didn't the Cubs have Eric Patterson working out some at CF during ST?

[Guest]

Didn't the Cubs have Eric Patterson working out some at CF during ST?

 

Yeah, and he had a few games in LF for Iowa earlier this year but his defense wasn't up to par and so that idea seems to have been put on hold during the season.

[CUBZ99]

Not great, but not a bad first start back out of the gate for Jones.

 

Is there anyone that would be disappointed if Jones started the remaining games in CF against RHP and put up numbers in line with his numbers last year? I'm not a Jones fan, but if he could get out of his funk, he would not be a terrible option as the starting CF.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Not great, but not a bad first start back out of the gate for Jones.

 

Is there anyone that would be disappointed if Jones started the remaining games in CF against RHP and put up numbers in line with his numbers last year? I'm not a Jones fan, but if he could get out of his funk, he would not be a terrible option as the starting CF.

 

If he could play decent CF with his numbers from last season, I'd be ok with him there against RHers.

[SouthSideRyan]

I don't know what the hell has been wrong with Jones all year, but I'm starting to convince myself that the best thing for this season alone might be Jones in CF against RHP.

[Mizzou]

I don't know what the hell has been wrong with Jones all year, but I'm starting to convince myself that the best thing for this season alone might be Jones in CF against RHP.

I'm reluctantly starting to agree. Jacque is solid against RHP, no matter whether people want to admit it or not. 3-8 with 3 doubles in his last two starts. No reason to start Pie at this point.

[Wolverineman]

The Cubs made it known that Pie is as untouchable as it gets.

 

 

Of course they have, they need a few more years to completely destroy his development and confidence so they can deal him for a couple crappy A-ballers.

 

 

Also, this whole situation makes me wonder if the veteran problem we had under Dusty was really Dusty's fault or if he was just following orders. We got a new manager and the same things are happening. Of course it's quite possible it was Dusty's fault and Lou is just as bad as Dusty, but I have to wonder if it's almost all on Hendry instead.

[Tracer Bullet]

I don't know what the hell has been wrong with Jones all year, but I'm starting to convince myself that the best thing for this season alone might be Jones in CF against RHP.

I'm reluctantly starting to agree. Jacque is solid against RHP, no matter whether people want to admit it or not. 3-8 with 3 doubles in his last two starts. No reason to start Pie at this point.

 

Well, he went 3/8 in his last 2 starts? That's it, you've convinced me - Jacques is great against RHP and should start in CF from now on. All the thought and analysis I put into this question over the first 5 pages didn't take into account his last 8 ABs...and clearly, that's all that matters.

[Bull]

The Cubs made it known that Pie is as untouchable as it gets.

 

 

Of course they have, they need a few more years to completely destroy his development and confidence so they can deal him for a couple crappy A-ballers.

 

 

Also, this whole situation makes me wonder if the veteran problem we had under Dusty was really Dusty's fault or if he was just following orders. We got a new manager and the same things are happening. Of course it's quite possible it was Dusty's fault and Lou is just as bad as Dusty, but I have to wonder if it's almost all on Hendry instead.

 

The same things are not happening. How can you even suggest this?? Marmol is closing (under dusty it would be Howry or Eyre, because they're the highest paid/vettiest). Theriot and Fontenot have gotten extended looks while Izturis rides the pine. Pie has started over Jones for quite some time now. I know many of these are obvious, but they wouldn't have been to Dusty.

 

Sorry, not even close.