Rotoworld Rumors (11/17)

[C.C.]

it is been made very apperant that murton's numbers post break are better than lee's but lees toal numbers dominate murton's. i really could care less about the pre and post break splits, it is a full season and game one is just as important as game 162 so i think overall production is the number to look at. just my opinion though.

 

I think what people are saying is that Matt Murton improved from the first half to the second half. Which means he's making progress and should continue to progress. Since last year was his first full major league season it'll be interesting to see how he fares next year.

 

i am in favor of murton starting for us but if we get lee for example i will not complain, we need impact bats and right now lee is one, 3 years from now he might not be but he is now. i want to win now so i don't really care about the payroll, the cubs can spend with the best of them so we shouldn't have to worry about payroll problems too much in the future.

 

I'd rather have Drew or Soriano more then Lee. I have a feeling in a year or two he's going to eat himself into a DH.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

I think folks are being too negative on Carlos Lee; depending on the years and $$, I might actually prefer him to Soriano as a better value. The guy is a proven run producer, he actually has surprising speed on the bases (19 SBs!), and he is an absolute MONSTER at Wrigley Field.

 

I like Matt Murton plenty, we need solid players at low salaries at some positions, but Murton is not now nor will he ever likely be a run producer of Lee's ilk. If Hendry can turn Murton into a QUALITY starting pitcher, and he chooses to sign C. Lee to replace Murton in LF, I can live with that outcome.

 

I do agree with everyone else though, we could really REALLY use JD Drew, I'm disappointed about these rumors I'm hearing regarding Boston, it sure sounds to me that this is another Brian Giles situation--Drew WANTS to be in Boston, and if that's the case, there's not a whole lot JH can do here.

 

As for Soriano, I'd rather throw the same $$ at Zito, but I know that won't happen.

[Soul]

how does young, talented outfielder (murton) = back up ss?

 

Dunno, but I would do Murton for Westbrook straight up, especially if we ink Soriano and Drew as rumored.

 

i would rather the cubs keep murton and not sign soriano. drew and westbrook would be great if they can get them.

 

I think that's crazy, assuming the Cubs have the money to spend and it won't hurt other areas of the club.

 

Soriano's bat is loads & loads better than Matty's. While I like Matt, his defense has never impressed me either, so I don't think we lose much on that side of the ball. And the offensive gains, IMO, are massive.

 

If it was an either/or between Murt & Soriano I'd send Matt packing right now.

[XZero771679666304]

I think folks are being too negative on Carlos Lee; depending on the years and $$, I might actually prefer him to Soriano as a better value. The guy is a proven run producer, he actually has surprising speed on the bases (19 SBs!), and he is an absolute MONSTER at Wrigley Field.

 

I like Matt Murton plenty, we need solid players at low salaries at some positions, but Murton is not now nor will he ever likely be a run producer of Lee's ilk. If Hendry can turn Murton into a QUALITY starting pitcher, and he chooses to sign C. Lee to replace Murton in LF, I can live with that outcome.

 

I do agree with everyone else though, we could really REALLY use JD Drew, I'm disappointed about these rumors I'm hearing regarding Boston, it sure sounds to me that this is another Brian Giles situation--Drew WANTS to be in Boston, and if that's the case, there's not a whole lot JH can do here.

 

As for Soriano, I'd rather throw the same $$ at Zito, but I know that won't happen.

 

I actually agree with you. I can't remember where, but I have seen some estimate that Lee could sign for as little as 10-11 million per. I think it would actually be more like 12-13, but he would still be a better value than Sori, I think. I like Soriano, but not for 6-7 years at 17+ million.

 

And as you pointed out, Lee is a monster at Wrigley. I would feel better about Drew at 2-3 years at 14-15M and Lee at 3-4 years at 12-13M than Drew and Sori.

[Wheelimus]

I would take Carlos Lee at even 5/50, assuming he agrees to seriously work on his weight and conditioning. In a few years even if we regreat it we wouldn't have too much trouble trading him if we ate a few dollars. Frank Thomas just got 9 million a year.

[goonys evil twin]

Soriano's bat is loads & loads better than Matty's.

 

If Murton maintained his 2nd half 2006 numbers over a full season, then that's not true.

 

Or, if Soriano returns to his 2004/2005 seasons, that's not true.

 

It's quite likely that Soriano would outproduce Murton in 2007, but it's no guarantee.

[mg420]

how does young, talented outfielder (murton) = back up ss?

 

Dunno, but I would do Murton for Westbrook straight up, especially if we ink Soriano and Drew as rumored.

 

i would rather the cubs keep murton and not sign soriano. drew and westbrook would be great if they can get them.

 

I think that's crazy, assuming the Cubs have the money to spend and it won't hurt other areas of the club.

 

Soriano's bat is loads & loads better than Matty's. While I like Matt, his defense has never impressed me either, so I don't think we lose much on that side of the ball. And the offensive gains, IMO, are massive.

 

If it was an either/or between Murt & Soriano I'd send Matt packing right now.

 

i think it's crazy to expect soriano to be worth anywhere near what he is going to be paid at the end of his contract. how many times has a player gotten a big contract only to watch his production go down the tubes. murton has a chance to be a soild .300 25 hr .850 ops left fielder in the near future imo. i would much rather see the cubs keep murton, put some $ into their starting pitching by going after westbrook & signing him to an extention than paying 100 mil to soriano for what he did last year.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

I think folks are being too negative on Carlos Lee; depending on the years and $$, I might actually prefer him to Soriano as a better value. The guy is a proven run producer, he actually has surprising speed on the bases (19 SBs!), and he is an absolute MONSTER at Wrigley Field.

 

I like Matt Murton plenty, we need solid players at low salaries at some positions, but Murton is not now nor will he ever likely be a run producer of Lee's ilk. If Hendry can turn Murton into a QUALITY starting pitcher, and he chooses to sign C. Lee to replace Murton in LF, I can live with that outcome.

 

I do agree with everyone else though, we could really REALLY use JD Drew, I'm disappointed about these rumors I'm hearing regarding Boston, it sure sounds to me that this is another Brian Giles situation--Drew WANTS to be in Boston, and if that's the case, there's not a whole lot JH can do here.

 

As for Soriano, I'd rather throw the same $$ at Zito, but I know that won't happen.

 

I actually agree with you. I can't remember where, but I have seen some estimate that Lee could sign for as little as 10-11 million per. I think it would actually be more like 12-13, but he would still be a better value than Sori, I think. I like Soriano, but not for 6-7 years at 17+ million.

 

And as you pointed out, Lee is a monster at Wrigley. I would feel better about Drew at 2-3 years at 14-15M and Lee at 3-4 years at 12-13M than Drew and Sori.

 

I would be particularly excited if Murton could play some RF (because I know C. Lee can't, his defense is brutal). Then you could move Jones far away from Wrigley, free up some salary to put into the starting pitcher sweepstakes (Padilla?), and pursue a Dave Roberts for leadoff and CF?

 

I have no illusions we'll get Drew, he apparently doesn't want to play in Chicago, can't force a free agent to play for you.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Where have we gotten anything that says Drew doesn't want to play in Chicago?

[Garwilly]

I think folks are being too negative on Carlos Lee; depending on the years and $$, I might actually prefer him to Soriano as a better value. The guy is a proven run producer, he actually has surprising speed on the bases (19 SBs!), and he is an absolute MONSTER at Wrigley Field.

 

I like Matt Murton plenty, we need solid players at low salaries at some positions, but Murton is not now nor will he ever likely be a run producer of Lee's ilk. If Hendry can turn Murton into a QUALITY starting pitcher, and he chooses to sign C. Lee to replace Murton in LF, I can live with that outcome.

 

I do agree with everyone else though, we could really REALLY use JD Drew, I'm disappointed about these rumors I'm hearing regarding Boston, it sure sounds to me that this is another Brian Giles situation--Drew WANTS to be in Boston, and if that's the case, there's not a whole lot JH can do here.

 

As for Soriano, I'd rather throw the same $$ at Zito, but I know that won't happen.

 

I actually agree with you. I can't remember where, but I have seen some estimate that Lee could sign for as little as 10-11 million per. I think it would actually be more like 12-13, but he would still be a better value than Sori, I think. I like Soriano, but not for 6-7 years at 17+ million.

 

And as you pointed out, Lee is a monster at Wrigley. I would feel better about Drew at 2-3 years at 14-15M and Lee at 3-4 years at 12-13M than Drew and Sori.

 

I would be particularly excited if Murton could play some RF (because I know C. Lee can't, his defense is brutal). Then you could move Jones far away from Wrigley, free up some salary to put into the starting pitcher sweepstakes (Padilla?), and pursue a Dave Roberts for leadoff and CF?

 

I have no illusions we'll get Drew, he apparently doesn't want to play in Chicago, can't force a free agent to play for you.

 

Why do you say he doesnt want to come?

[Outshined_One]

Westbrook is 29 and in the last year of his contract, iirc.

 

There's no way I'd trade Murton for him unless the Cubs got something else in return.

[SouthSideRyan]

Meche, Westbrook, and Marquis are the guys Hendry should target.

 

Zambrano

Westbrook

Hill

Meche

Marquis/Miller/Prior

 

Are you on a quest to have crappy pitching? Marquis and Meche are not good.

 

"Not good" is being far too kind. They're pretty horrid.

 

I can see cases for Westbrook, Lilly, Padilla... but Meche, Marquis, and Batista should be nowhere near a pro ball club (except for the cardinals).

 

The way you guys want to throw money at hitter's, there is going to absolutley no money to spend for pitching. I would hate to see the Cubs go into next year having to out slug their opponents 10-8 every game. That is not the way you build a baseball team.

 

The only thing signing Marquis does to change that scenario is that the Cubs would have to outslug their opponents 12-10 instead.

[A New Era]

how does young, talented outfielder (murton) = back up ss?

 

Think outside the box, abuck. Outside the box.

Well if Hendry, as someone suggested, was saying how happy he was as a way of touting Izturis, then Cleveland is simply trying to get Murton for less by saying that they're only interested in a position which the Cubs obviously have nothing to offer them.

 

Obviously I meant that Hendry is thinking of new, creative ways to make this team worse:

 

"Hmmm, I currently employ no less than five players who could, in a pinch, function as a back-up shortstop. How about I give them a cheap, young, productive and improving starting left fielder instead? Eureka!"

 

Hmm. Could you point to where in the article Jim Hendry said, I will not trade you a shortstop. I will give you Matt Murton instead?

[PrimeTime]

It seems half this board wouldnt give up Murton for anything..Id give him for Westbrook straight up..Murton is a average player, and your getting a average,little above average back for him..How do you know Murton will get better?? Its not guranteed just because hes getting older and learning more, who knows this Matt Murton you see now could be the one for the next 10 years..Everyone seems to think hes gunna be some monster hitting 30+HR and 120+ RBI's... Sure his slugging and OBP is up there with Soriano and Lee, But Id take a monster like them in LF who can hit 30+ HR guranteed and scare the crap out of pitchers..

[jmajew]

It seems half this board wouldnt give up Murton for anything..Id give him for Westbrook straight up..Murton is a average player, and your getting a average,little above average back for him..How do you know Murton will get better?? Its not guranteed just because hes getting older and learning more, who knows this Matt Murton you see now could be the one for the next 10 years..Everyone seems to think hes gunna be some monster hitting 30+HR and 120+ RBI's... Sure his slugging and OBP is up there with Soriano and Lee, But Id take a monster like them in LF who can hit 30+ HR guranteed and scare the crap out of pitchers..

 

Here are the second half numbers for those three. Tell me who is who...

 

BA, OBP, SLG, OPS

 

287, 357, 572, 939

319, 390, 522, 912

311, 358, 512, 870

 

Both Lee and Soriano will be 31 for the majority of the season and are probably reaching the end of their primes while Murton will be 25 all of next season and hasn't even reached his prime yet. I don't know how you can say it is a risk not worth taking that a 25 year old, like Murton, will be better than two 31 year olds.

 

I also don't think Murton will be a monster like these guys in the homerun and RBI department but he brings other things to the table. I see Murton turning into a player that is much more similar to JD Drew than either Lee or Soriano.

 

Lastly, if the Matt Murton we saw in the second half will be there for the next ten years I'll be very pleased. Heck, even if his OPS levels out at 850-875 I'll be very happy. But you have to believe that he will develop a little more power as he gets older.

[Rob]

 

Here are the second half numbers for those three. Tell me who is who...

 

BA, OBP, SLG, OPS

 

287, 357, 572, 939

319, 390, 522, 912

311, 358, 512, 870

 

Soriano, Murton, Lee.

[YearofDaCubs]

It would be stupid to trade Murton unless you get something really good in return. I would rather leave him in LF and try and strengthen the other positions.

 

Drew for CF and Lugo for SS. Those two moves would solidify our entire lineup. Trade for Westbrook and this is what we would have:

 

SS Lugo

LF Murton

1B Lee

CF Drew

3B ARam

C Barrett

RF Jacque

2B DeRosa

PITCHER

 

I think that is a very solid lineup.

 

1. Z

2. Westbrook

3. Hill

4. Miller

5. Guz/Prior/Marshall/...

 

I would still like for us to acquire or sign at least one more pitcher.

[Bluescale]

It would be stupid to trade Murton unless you get something really good in return.

 

What about Murton and Hill at the center of a deal to get Manny?

[YearofDaCubs]

It would be stupid to trade Murton unless you get something really good in return.

 

What about Murton and Hill at the center of a deal to get Manny?

I would be all for it as long as we somehow solidify our starting pitching.

[Bluescale]

It would be stupid to trade Murton unless you get something really good in return.

 

What about Murton and Hill at the center of a deal to get Manny?

I would be all for it as long as we somehow solidify our starting pitching.

 

If we put Manny and Soriano on our roster, I'm not sure we can afford to solidfy our staff. I guess we could hope and pray Prior and Wood all of a sudden find the 2003 magic...

[beowulf28]

how does young, talented outfielder (murton) = back up ss?

 

Dunno, but I would do Murton for Westbrook straight up, especially if we ink Soriano and Drew as rumored.

 

Only if Westbrook was locked up longterm. Even then, I'm not sure. It's probably fair, but I'm just really bias toward Murton. He's my fav. player.

 

Besides, I don't think the Indians really want/need an outfielder. We really need to trade from our strength, which is bullpen pitching and even young arms.

 

How about giving them cash so they can go out and get...Lugo? (I'd much rather have Lugo, mind you, but wouldn't Westbrook be a good fit for the Cubs?)

[beowulf28]

Meche, Westbrook, and Marquis are the guys Hendry should target.

 

Zambrano

Westbrook

Hill

Meche

Marquis/Miller/Prior

 

Are you on a quest to have crappy pitching? Marquis and Meche are not good.

 

"Not good" is being far too kind. They're pretty horrid.

 

I can see cases for Westbrook, Lilly, Padilla... but Meche, Marquis, and Batista should be nowhere near a pro ball club (except for the Astros

 

fixed! :wink:

[MPrior]

how does young, talented outfielder (murton) = back up ss?

 

Think outside the box, abuck. Outside the box.

Well if Hendry, as someone suggested, was saying how happy he was as a way of touting Izturis, then Cleveland is simply trying to get Murton for less by saying that they're only interested in a position which the Cubs obviously have nothing to offer them.

 

Obviously I meant that Hendry is thinking of new, creative ways to make this team worse:

 

"Hmmm, I currently employ no less than five players who could, in a pinch, function as a back-up shortstop. How about I give them a cheap, young, productive and improving starting left fielder instead? Eureka!"

 

Hmm. Could you point to where in the article Jim Hendry said, I will not trade you a shortstop. I will give you Matt Murton instead?

 

Oh, this didn't come from an article. It came from one of my sources.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

My sources: Finn, my golden retriever, and Bear, my ferret.

[bhogg]

i'm afraid i'm going to resort to whipping someone's ass if Murton is given away.

[Roast]

i'm afraid i'm going to resort to whipping someone's ass if Murton is given away.

 

I will join you in this.