Maddux and $$$ to the Dodgers for Cesar Izturis

[C.C.]

All this talk reminds me of what Mets fans thought about Jose Reyes until this year...

 

Umm...I have relatives that a major Mets fans and trust me last year he was not loved!

 

Um, Okay...Whatever you say...Last thing I want to do today is argue over the love Mets show or don't show for Reyes. How stupid is that?

 

Yes, silly indeed.

 

Thanks for cutting and pasting my posts. I think I know what I posted, so no need to do it for me. Okay?

[Caryatid]

All this talk reminds me of what Mets fans thought about Jose Reyes until this year...

 

Umm...I have relatives that a major Mets fans and trust me last year he was not loved!

 

Um, Okay...Whatever you say...Last thing I want to do today is argue over the love Mets show or don't show for Reyes. How stupid is that?

 

Yes, silly indeed.

 

Thanks for cutting and pasting my posts. I think I know what I posted, so no need to do it for me. Okay?

 

If you're going to use anectdotal evidence to try and prove a point, you have to assume some will be used in opposition.

[Caryatid]

I think, understanding that Izturis is not going anywhere, its time to just root for him to do well next year and hope we're wrong about him. At this point, I'm happy to say I was wrong (at least right now-maybe not for the rest of the year) about Jones and I hope he does this well next year and, if the Cubs have him in '08, I hope he does well then too.

 

There's a certain level of acceptance that I think we're going to have to have here, because regardless of how stupid we think the philosophy is, its not going anywhere. Might as well root for the team to do well in '07, because that's all we have.

[C.C.]

All this talk reminds me of what Mets fans thought about Jose Reyes until this year...

 

Umm...I have relatives that a major Mets fans and trust me last year he was not loved!

 

Um, Okay...Whatever you say...Last thing I want to do today is argue over the love Mets show or don't show for Reyes. How stupid is that?

 

Yes, silly indeed.

 

Thanks for cutting and pasting my posts. I think I know what I posted, so no need to do it for me. Okay?

 

If you're going to use anectdotal evidence to try and prove a point, you have to assume some will be used in opposition.

 

Which I agree with you, but what point was he trying to make by taking cutting and pasting my posts?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

All this talk reminds me of what Mets fans thought about Jose Reyes until this year...

 

Umm...I have relatives that a major Mets fans and trust me last year he was not loved!

 

Um, Okay...Whatever you say...Last thing I want to do today is argue over the love Mets show or don't show for Reyes. How stupid is that?

 

Yes, silly indeed.

 

Thanks for cutting and pasting my posts. I think I know what I posted, so no need to do it for me. Okay?

 

If you're going to use anectdotal evidence to try and prove a point, you have to assume some will be used in opposition.

 

Which I agree with you, but what point was he trying to make by taking cutting and pasting my posts?

 

You brought it up, you argued the point, then you called it stupid and said it was the last thing you wanted to do.

[C.C.]

All this talk reminds me of what Mets fans thought about Jose Reyes until this year...

 

Umm...I have relatives that a major Mets fans and trust me last year he was not loved!

 

Um, Okay...Whatever you say...Last thing I want to do today is argue over the love Mets show or don't show for Reyes. How stupid is that?

 

Yes, silly indeed.

 

Thanks for cutting and pasting my posts. I think I know what I posted, so no need to do it for me. Okay?

 

If you're going to use anectdotal evidence to try and prove a point, you have to assume some will be used in opposition.

 

Which I agree with you, but what point was he trying to make by taking cutting and pasting my posts?

 

You brought it up, you argued the point, then you called it stupid and said it was the last thing you wanted to do.

 

Yes, because I realized how stupid it was to argue about it. The only point I made was the people I knew who where down on Reyes last year now love him.

[RonnieWooWooSanto]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

[JGalt73]

The Dodgers got Greg Maddux for free, dealing away the wildly overrated and overpaid Cesar Izturis. Correlation isn’t causation, but you can trace the Dodgers’ descent in the NL West to Izturis’ arrival from the disabled list: they were 14-21 between his debut June 21 and Sunday, the last game he played for them, as he batted .252/.302/.353 and got a ridiculous 30-odd plate appearances in the top two lineup spots. Every game he played that Willy Aybar didn’t pushed the Dodgers further back in the NL West. If the Dodgers got nothing back for him they would have been fine. Getting the current version of Maddux is a minor help. Losing Izturis, who’s just a glove playing out of position on the Dodgers, is a major one.

 

Is there a serious analyst out there not panning Hendry for this deal?

[A New Era]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Maybe Steve sees him as able to improve offensively. If that's why he likes him, then I like him too. .

[Mark Priors Calves]

The Dodgers got Greg Maddux for free, dealing away the wildly overrated and overpaid Cesar Izturis. Correlation isn’t causation, but you can trace the Dodgers’ descent in the NL West to Izturis’ arrival from the disabled list: they were 14-21 between his debut June 21 and Sunday, the last game he played for them, as he batted .252/.302/.353 and got a ridiculous 30-odd plate appearances in the top two lineup spots. Every game he played that Willy Aybar didn’t pushed the Dodgers further back in the NL West. If the Dodgers got nothing back for him they would have been fine. Getting the current version of Maddux is a minor help. Losing Izturis, who’s just a glove playing out of position on the Dodgers, is a major one.

 

Is there a serious analyst out there not panning Hendry for this deal?

 

The writers for the Trib? Oh wait, serious analyst.

[bring stone back]

The Dodgers got Greg Maddux for free, dealing away the wildly overrated and overpaid Cesar Izturis. Correlation isn’t causation, but you can trace the Dodgers’ descent in the NL West to Izturis’ arrival from the disabled list: they were 14-21 between his debut June 21 and Sunday, the last game he played for them, as he batted .252/.302/.353 and got a ridiculous 30-odd plate appearances in the top two lineup spots. Every game he played that Willy Aybar didn’t pushed the Dodgers further back in the NL West. If the Dodgers got nothing back for him they would have been fine. Getting the current version of Maddux is a minor help. Losing Izturis, who’s just a glove playing out of position on the Dodgers, is a major one.

 

Is there a serious analyst out there not panning Hendry for this deal?

 

The writers for the Trib? Oh wait, serious analyst.

 

Like Rob Neyer? Maybe he can write a book about it....

[SouthSideRyan]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Wasn't mocking you, was using your post to show the Stone for GM crowd, that he's as big of an antiquated baseball idiot as the rest of the Cubs organization.

[C.C.]

How about that Izturis! :o

[StMarksCubs]

How about that Izturis! :o

 

GO CUBBIES!!!!!!!

[Magnetic Curses]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Maybe Steve sees him as able to improve offensively. If that's why he likes him, then I like him too. .

 

first of all, i don't think that having izturis at short is the end of the world, although i see no reason, other than blind hope, to believe that he will improve drastically at the plate. he's exactly the type of player that hendry likes to acquire and exactly the type of player that dusty likes to pencil in at the top of the order--an overhyped, athletic player that can't get on base or hit for power.

 

now, as i said, it's not the end of the world with him at short, after all, he's very good deffensively and if we get better hitters in the off-season, his offense won't mean much. ideally, he hits 8th in a good lineup. however, if we start ronny cedeno at second and expect him to play most of the season there next year, we will fail and fail miserably. my only hope, if this indeed happens, is that no one gets hurt, not one soul--so that the cubs obvious (to some) inability to get on base or hit for power is seen by all as the reason for their inability to score runs or win games.

 

a lack of injuries next season will lay bare before us all why hendry's brand of baseball fails.

 

you can't score if you make outs all the time and can't hit for power.

[C.C.]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Maybe Steve sees him as able to improve offensively. If that's why he likes him, then I like him too. .

 

first of all, i don't think that having izturis at short is the end of the world, although i see no reason, other than blind hope, to believe that he will improve drastically at the plate. he's exactly the type of player that hendry likes to acquire and exactly the type of player that dusty likes to pencil in at the top of the order--an overhyped, athletic player that can't get on base or hit for power.

 

now, as i said, it's not the end of the world with him at short, after all, he's very good deffensively and if we get better hitters in the off-season, his offense won't mean much. ideally, he hits 8th in a good lineup. however, if we start ronny cedeno at second and expect him to play most of the season there next year, we will fail and fail miserably. my only hope, if this indeed happens, is that no one gets hurt, not one soul--so that the cubs obvious (to some) inability to get on base or hit for power is seen by all as the reason for their inability to score runs or win games.

 

a lack of injuries next season will lay bare before us all why hendry's brand of baseball fails.

 

you can't score if you make outs all the time and can't hit for power.

 

Unless Ronny really picks it up the last two months of the season. He's seeing the ball alot better. We'll have to see how he does. You do need someone like a Carlos Lee for LF next year and another starter or two.

[Magnetic Curses]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Maybe Steve sees him as able to improve offensively. If that's why he likes him, then I like him too. .

 

first of all, i don't think that having izturis at short is the end of the world, although i see no reason, other than blind hope, to believe that he will improve drastically at the plate. he's exactly the type of player that hendry likes to acquire and exactly the type of player that dusty likes to pencil in at the top of the order--an overhyped, athletic player that can't get on base or hit for power.

 

now, as i said, it's not the end of the world with him at short, after all, he's very good deffensively and if we get better hitters in the off-season, his offense won't mean much. ideally, he hits 8th in a good lineup. however, if we start ronny cedeno at second and expect him to play most of the season there next year, we will fail and fail miserably. my only hope, if this indeed happens, is that no one gets hurt, not one soul--so that the cubs obvious (to some) inability to get on base or hit for power is seen by all as the reason for their inability to score runs or win games.

 

a lack of injuries next season will lay bare before us all why hendry's brand of baseball fails.

 

you can't score if you make outs all the time and can't hit for power.

 

Unless Ronny really picks it up the last two months of the season. He's seeing the ball alot better. We'll have to see how he does. You do need someone like a Carlos Lee for LF next year and another starter or two.

 

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

[C.C.]

Steve Stone on the Score670 believes this is a good move.

 

He believes it's good to get Izturis a good glove who is locked up contract wise.

 

Also, he says it is better than if the Cubs would have signed Furcal at the money the Cubs offered in the off season.

 

OMG STEVE STONE FOR GM~! HE TELLS IT LIKE IT IS, CURVEBALL OUTSIDE CORNER!!

 

I was just throwing it out there. I never advocated Stone as GM. I've pointed to Hawk Harrelson's failed short tenure as GM of the Sox as a precursor to Stone becoming a GM(which he never will).

 

Maybe Steve sees him as able to improve offensively. If that's why he likes him, then I like him too. .

 

first of all, i don't think that having izturis at short is the end of the world, although i see no reason, other than blind hope, to believe that he will improve drastically at the plate. he's exactly the type of player that hendry likes to acquire and exactly the type of player that dusty likes to pencil in at the top of the order--an overhyped, athletic player that can't get on base or hit for power.

 

now, as i said, it's not the end of the world with him at short, after all, he's very good deffensively and if we get better hitters in the off-season, his offense won't mean much. ideally, he hits 8th in a good lineup. however, if we start ronny cedeno at second and expect him to play most of the season there next year, we will fail and fail miserably. my only hope, if this indeed happens, is that no one gets hurt, not one soul--so that the cubs obvious (to some) inability to get on base or hit for power is seen by all as the reason for their inability to score runs or win games.

 

a lack of injuries next season will lay bare before us all why hendry's brand of baseball fails.

 

you can't score if you make outs all the time and can't hit for power.

 

Unless Ronny really picks it up the last two months of the season. He's seeing the ball alot better. We'll have to see how he does. You do need someone like a Carlos Lee for LF next year and another starter or two.

 

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

 

What a guy hitting .292 with 28 HR and 82 RBI with a OBP .352 isn't good enough? Huh?

[cubfan1955]

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

Carlos Lee isn't perfect but he's one of the two best options available as a free agent. There is no way Hendry can pull off a trade and do better than either (Soriano). I think you are getting greedy and holding out for the perfect player that isn't going to arrive.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

 

What a guy hitting .292 with 28 HR and 82 RBI with a OBP .352 isn't good enough? Huh?

 

Carlos Lee is 96th of qualified players in OBP. He's not a bad player, but on a team that's going to need an OBP stud to overcome low OBP guys in Izturis, Jones, and possibly Cedeno, it's not enough.

[RynoRules]

Lee and Abreu would work. Tejada and Abreu would work. I could also live with Lee and Tejada, though I know many here could not.

[mul21]

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

 

What a guy hitting .292 with 28 HR and 82 RBI with a OBP .352 isn't good enough? Huh?

 

Carlos Lee is 96th of qualified players in OBP. He's not a bad player, but on a team that's going to need an OBP stud to overcome low OBP guys in Izturis, Jones, and possibly Cedeno, it's not enough.

 

The OBP guy is going to have to come from a different position. Adding Carlos Lee is adding power to the middle of the lineup, not OBP at the top. If he puts up the line he has now for the rest of this year and next, that is a nice piece to the puzzle to have in the 5 or 6 hole behing Aram or Jones.

[A New Era]

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

 

What a guy hitting .292 with 28 HR and 82 RBI with a OBP .352 isn't good enough? Huh?

 

Carlos Lee is 96th of qualified players in OBP. He's not a bad player, but on a team that's going to need an OBP stud to overcome low OBP guys in Izturis, Jones, and possibly Cedeno, it's not enough.

 

Well I don't know. Barret has a really high OBP, Derrek has (when healthy) a pretty good OBP, so does Ramirez. I agree we need more OBP but I still think if you add Carlos Lee to the mix we can CERTAINLY compete with the NL Central. It's not like we need to chase the yankees or red sox.

[C.C.]

carlos lee is not the answer, either. hendry will have to pull off a big trade to bring someone with a big bat AND a good OBP to this team in the offseason.

 

 

What a guy hitting .292 with 28 HR and 82 RBI with a OBP .352 isn't good enough? Huh?

 

Carlos Lee is 96th of qualified players in OBP. He's not a bad player, but on a team that's going to need an OBP stud to overcome low OBP guys in Izturis, Jones, and possibly Cedeno, it's not enough.

 

I think sometimes people can get blinded by OBP. His OBP is good and his production is even better. What we couldn't use those those 28 HR and 82 RBI this year?

[Salazar89]

In 2007 the combination of Pierre, Izturis and Cedeno I would imagine marks the end of Matt Murton's days as a Cub. With little to no power from those three positions Matt will not be able to continue his development in left field.

 

I fully expect to see Carlos Lee in Cubbie blue to help with the power outage up the middle.