Levine: Eyre done deal. 3 years $11 million

[Bruno7481]

But what relievers did you want instead of Eyre?

I haven't seen a list.

 

And I do realize Wagner and BJ Ryan are out there - and as much as I'd like to believe we could get them for $3.5 a year, I don't think that's going to happen.

 

I'm not trying to take on anybody - I legitimately can't think of a better Left RP out there on the market that'd be better.

 

I've been of the persuasion that the bullpen should have been the final focus after lead-off, shortstop, and the gaping hole in rightfield.

 

We have a number of arms for the pen. But if I were going to gamble three years on a reliever, Dotel please.

 

First off, I second your "Dotel please"

Secondly, your thinking is good in theory - but it has somewhat resulted in our bullpens the last couple years.

Isn't it possible that we could take care of all of these 'problems' in a somewhat similar timeframe? I know watching Eyre sign a contract might keep him busy, but not so busy he can't call Furcal up and tell him to c'mere.

 

I will admit that our bullpen wasn't good last season. But I also think throwing FA dollars at a bullpen, other than a few select guys, is never a great idea. We've thrown a lucrative three year deal at the bullpen two of the last three years and it hasn't helped. It's very difficult to predict the success of a reliever from year to year. Who thought Eyre was a great reliever before this past season? How quickly does a guy become lights out in the pen only to flame out the year before? Given the nature of the bullpen, I'd address it, but not with long term big money deals unless it is for someone that has proven to get it done year in and year out. Dotel fits that description. Wagner does as well. Eyre does not.

 

Why not bring back the Farns? He's had more good seasons than Eyre.

 

I think you get bullpen help whenver it make itself available. Putting together a sold bullpen to go along with the starters could relaly improve this team. IF the startes stay healthy and pitch to their potential, a strong bullpen would really shorten the game for opponents. B.J. Ryan is a closer, so is Wagner. I'd love those guys, but they aren't going to come here. Dempster is the closer.

 

I'm tired of watching the Cubs blow game late. Will Eyre stop that all by himself, of course not. But I think he helps.

[USSoccer]

Farnsworth and Eyre, as pointed out by Hoops, have an identical every-other-year thing going on. And I'm not crazy throwing more than $2m on relievers. hey are way too erratic, as Vance pointed ou.

 

This move would have been really great had we not resigned Rusch. We now theoretically have 4 LHP that could be in the bullpen. Hill might be traded, but what about Ohman? It's not as if LOOGY's have a ton of trade value. Rusch probably won't start, unless we trade Williams (which we shouldn't), but Rusch's best chance at providing value is starting. Then there's Eyre. Is he a primary setup guy like Remmy was supposed to be in 2003.

 

I hope Hendry has a clearer plan than I can see thus far. It looks muddled to me.

[frostwyrm]

$3.66 mil a year for 3 years on a semi-reliable reliever coming off of a career year, and whose best use is already provided by a player at one tenth his cost that the Cubs already have under contract, is not a good use of resources.

 

Yeah, I agree. LOOGY is one those peripheral roles that your farm system should be able to fill, and in the case of the Cubs, it did. Ohman could have done the job for a lot less.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

[ltb]

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

exactly

this signing makes me want to vomit

[Clogged Basepaths]

Why would we need to offer Dotel a 3 year offer anyway? I'm confused this is even an argument, as I just assumed we'd be offering him a nearly identical deal to Williamson.

 

I think it's going to take a deal greater than Williamson, but much less than what we had to pay Scott Eyre.

 

I dunno, wasn't Williamson's deal for $2mill this year? I was just assuming the $ would be higher for the Dotel deal (it is a year later, and Dotel has way more success).

 

The whole point is, if Hendry signs Furcal, acquires an OF (or 2) with good OBP, and gets ANOTHER set up type guy, this deal starts to look better. As a "5th most important deal" he's a pretty good player to get. As the centerpiece of your offseason...not so much.

[USSoccer]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

Exactly. Which points to Hendry wanting to trade surplus pitching, but it's not as if that group of relievers could fetch us a ton in return.

[Clogged Basepaths]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

The problem with that list, is that Mitre makes me sad. Also, Rusch will never be used correctly in the bullpen. Koronka/Hill are starters, and even though Koronka is destroying some random league this offseason - would you rather have him than Eyre? We can spare the extra $3 mill for a proven quantity.

 

Would we even be having this argument if Rusch and Neifi were floating around in the big FA pool still? I don't really think so.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

But what relievers did you want instead of Eyre?

I haven't seen a list.

 

And I do realize Wagner and BJ Ryan are out there - and as much as I'd like to believe we could get them for $3.5 a year, I don't think that's going to happen.

 

I'm not trying to take on anybody - I legitimately can't think of a better Left RP out there on the market that'd be better.

 

I've been of the persuasion that the bullpen should have been the final focus after lead-off, shortstop, and the gaping hole in rightfield.

 

We have a number of arms for the pen. But if I were going to gamble three years on a reliever, Dotel please.

 

First off, I second your "Dotel please"

Secondly, your thinking is good in theory - but it has somewhat resulted in our bullpens the last couple years.

Isn't it possible that we could take care of all of these 'problems' in a somewhat similar timeframe? I know watching Eyre sign a contract might keep him busy, but not so busy he can't call Furcal up and tell him to c'mere.

 

I will admit that our bullpen wasn't good last season. But I also think throwing FA dollars at a bullpen, other than a few select guys, is never a great idea. We've thrown a lucrative three year deal at the bullpen two of the last three years and it hasn't helped. It's very difficult to predict the success of a reliever from year to year. Who thought Eyre was a great reliever before this past season? How quickly does a guy become lights out in the pen only to flame out the year before? Given the nature of the bullpen, I'd address it, but not with long term big money deals unless it is for someone that has proven to get it done year in and year out. Dotel fits that description. Wagner does as well. Eyre does not.

 

Why not bring back the Farns? He's had more good seasons than Eyre.

 

I think you get bullpen help whenver it make itself available. Putting together a sold bullpen to go along with the starters could relaly improve this team. IF the startes stay healthy and pitch to their potential, a strong bullpen would really shorten the game for opponents. B.J. Ryan is a closer, so is Wagner. I'd love those guys, but they aren't going to come here. Dempster is the closer.

 

I'm tired of watching the Cubs blow game late. Will Eyre stop that all by himself, of course not. But I think he helps.

 

I'm all for a strong pen, but even spending money on the best relievers doesn't guarantee a good pen. Offensive performers are more consistent and more likely to produce where you expect them to produce. While saving a run in the eighth of a close game is nice, I'd rather have an offense capable of scoring enough in the early innings that there's less pressure on my bullpen and starters.

 

If we can get an offense capable of scoring 4.5-5.5 runs a game, then we can live with the ups and downs of the pitching staff much more easily.

[SouthSideRyan]

I have no clue where that 10.5M was coming from. Neifi is making at most 2.5 this year, Rusch is making 2.5, and Eyre you'd guess about 3.5

 

Still a colossal squandering of money that could be most of Giles's first year.

 

But no, we don't want a bidding war.

[Bruno7481]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

Are you comortable with Hill as a reliever? I'm not. Novoa was all over the place last year. Wuertz has his moments. Koronka????

 

Based on past experience the Cubs have 3 guys i'd classify as "reliable-to good." Those being Dempster, Williamson, and now Eyre. I liked what I saw from Ohman last year, but it has just been one year. Rusch does seem like he's caught in the middle.

 

I think Eyre is a good addition. I think he's more effective and reliable than Mitre, Hill, Koronka, Novoa, and Wuertz.

[NewUserName]

I didnt read through all 11 pages so if this has been said forgive me. How many times is Hendry going to overpay for a setup man? When will he realize that a managers usage will do alot more for a bullpen than pay 1 set up guy 3 million. If he wants to improve his bullpen get a manger who has a clue on how to run one.

[abuck1220]

$10+ mil on neifi, rusch, eyre or $10 mil on giles?

 

i think hendry made the right call. three guys can catch the ball better than one.

[Flames24Rulz]

i only read the first 5 pages of the thread, so don't shoot me if i post something that was already posted.

 

with a salary that Eyre is going to be receiving, I would think he would become the setup man. I don't understand Jim Hendry, but paying over 3 mil a year to just be a loogy does not make sense, not even for Hendry's standards. I don't think Eyre will be too bad, but he's definitely not worth this price. Maybe Jim got the OK from upper management to increase payroll over the $30 mil he had to begin with...or maybe I'm just dreaming.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

The problem with that list, is that Mitre makes me sad. Also, Rusch will never be used correctly in the bullpen. Koronka/Hill are starters, and even though Koronka is destroying some random league this offseason - would you rather have him than Eyre? We can spare the extra $3 mill for a proven quantity.

 

Would we even be having this argument if Rusch and Neifi were floating around in the big FA pool still? I don't really think so.

 

I'm not sure we can. That 3 million could be the difference in Giles in RF or Juan Encarnacion.

[Cubzfan64]

It's just so hard to evaluate this trade on it's own merit. Yes it wouldn't have been my first priority to help the club for 2006, but then again, if it can be done early and provide some ability to make later moves that fill the more glaring holes, then I have no problem with it - that will remain to be seen.

 

The only thing that concerns me so far with the Perez and Eyre signings are that once again the Cubs are in the position of "buying high" after a guy has a very good season and quite potentially "selling low" if they move Patterson after his value has plummetted. I absolutely dislike that method of trying to build a team that can contend for more than one year, unfortunately it appears to be the philosophy of the personnel who make the decisions on who is on the team and who isn't.

 

I'm staying tuned for further moves before I pass judgement on this one...

[abuck1220]

and while we're at it, i'm pretty sure i'd rather have bj ryan or wagner than dempster + eyre.

 

does hendry know that you can only have 25 guys on the roster?

[Clogged Basepaths]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

Are you comortable with Hill as a reliever? I'm not. Novoa was all over the place last year. Wuertz has his moments. Koronka????

 

Based on past experience the Cubs have 3 guys i'd classify as "reliable-to good." Those being Dempster, Williamson, and now Eyre. I liked what I saw from Ohman last year, but it has just been one year. Rusch does seem like he's caught in the middle.

 

I think Eyre is a good addition. I think he's more effective and reliable than Mitre, Hill, Koronka, Novoa, and Wuertz.

 

Stop making all these logical points! What am I supposed to say now?

 

I also agree with Vance's post about offense. There is no reason for us to spend the money we do and have such a middling offense (especially when you have DLee/Aram in said lineup).

 

At this point, we are above league average at 3 positions offensively (1B, 3B, C). We need to be above average at 1, maybe 2 more spots (SS at least). The rest we merely need to be around league average to be fine. The talk of Mench would be some logical step to that (assuming we upgrade at 2 other spots).

[frostwyrm]

$10+ mil on neifi, rusch, eyre or $10 mil on giles?

 

i think hendry made the right call. three guys can catch the ball better than one.

I'm not so sure. Vishnu can throw with one hand and wear gloves on the other 3. Is he available?

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/fr/thumb/a/a6/Vishnu.jpg/250px-Vishnu.jpg

[Clogged Basepaths]

Before we signed Eyre, we had these candidates for the pen:

 

Rightside: Dempster, Novoa, Wuertz, Mitre, Williamson

Leftside: Ohman, Rusch, Koronka, Hill

 

We're already in a roster crunch and I know we have money to spend. I'd just prefer we spend that money on places where we have no adequate replacements and then look to the bullpen.

 

As it is now, we've spent the equivalent of Furcal or Giles and have a bunch of spare parts to show for it.

 

The problem with that list, is that Mitre makes me sad. Also, Rusch will never be used correctly in the bullpen. Koronka/Hill are starters, and even though Koronka is destroying some random league this offseason - would you rather have him than Eyre? We can spare the extra $3 mill for a proven quantity.

 

Would we even be having this argument if Rusch and Neifi were floating around in the big FA pool still? I don't really think so.

 

I'm not sure we can. That 3 million could be the difference in Giles in RF or Juan Encarnacion.

 

I disagree, the $3 million is sitting on the bench backing up the middle infield. You can't judge all signings unfairly because of wasted funds on another player. This deal on its own is not bad.

 

Owners have lots of money to spend this winter (satellite radio $, record attendence figures, even the DRays/Royals are going to increase payroll), and not that many players to spend it on. I'm just waiting for another RP to sign a deal that makes this one look good.

[BigbadB]

It wasn't so much that I was upset about not liking the deal.

 

It's not enjoyable to read page after page of the same stuff, new ideas? New reasons it wasn't good?

 

Like I said previously, Sarcastic brought up a 'new' point about the unreliability of relievers - after 5 pages someone finally spoke up with this?

 

The fact that my sarcastic post yielding this many "shame on yous" from this community is baffling.

 

BAFFLE'D!!!

Don't be baffled, it happens to others that USED to post here regularly. The funny part is all the name calling and second guessing of Hendry, people still wonder why he won't post here or answer questions on the site. My question to you is, if you were Hendry, would you?

 

You know, i was just wondering why hendry doesn't post on this website. There are so many GMs that post on so many fan sites throughout sports, and I was wondering why hendry hasn't joined them.

 

Keep the thread about the transaction. Leave out all the personal stuff and the sarcasm, please.

 

I'm trying to. i don't exactly enjoy the fact that because I've hated the past two seasons and hated the signings so far this offseason (much like most of the other posters on the board), i and these other posters get attacked with the "culture of negativity" argument. I feel like people should stop attacking the posters that are being negative just for being negative and instead take a look at why they are down on the Cubs. I'd certainly like to not be pessimistic about my favorite team, but I don't see much reason not to be.

 

$3.66 mil a year for 3 years on a semi-reliable reliever coming off of a career year, and whose best use is already provided by a player at one tenth his cost that the Cubs already have under contract, is not a good use of resources.

 

It probably is frustrating for anyone who really likes this deal. The negativity gives the appearance that everyone is against this signing.

 

I don't think any person here was against signing Eyre. The money and the years is what is really perplexing and causing the angst.

 

The bullpen definitely needed to be addressed. Personally, I felt it could have been upgraded via trade. We have Patterson, Hairston, Walker, Novoa, Wuertz, Wellemeyer, Mitre, Ohman and minor leaguers galore that could be used to get a couple of really good bullpen arms from small market teams that didn't want to shell out the money to arby eligible bullpen guys.

 

I'm very upset about the 10.5m spent so far this offseason. Mike Fontenot or Ronny Cedeno would have made decent infield back ups at the league minimum for next year rather than resign Neifi at 2.5m for 2 years. Neifi, excluding Eyre and Rusch, probably wouldn't have made me blow a gasket.

 

Glendon Rusch as the long man at 3.5m is money not well spent either when you add in Neifi and Eyre. Mitre or Hill at league minimum is a ton of savings for a guy who basically gets a spot start or saves a starter on a bad day. Without Neifi and Eyre, it's not the worst signing in the world and didn't make me blow a gasket.

 

Eyre is a good pick up, excluding Neifi and Rusch. I could deal with a 3.6m LOOGY if we didn't have a 3.5m swing man and a 2.5m bench guy. Ohman makes league minimum. Someone could have been brought in via trade at a much lower cost than Eyre. Eyre by himself wouldn't have made me blow a gasket.

 

Relievers are a crap shoot to begin with. No one knows yet who will be the most effective guys in the pen next year, but when they have that good season, teams will be knocking on their doors next offseason. Most fall back to their career norms.

 

I'm not saying we should have gone cheap with the league minimum at every one of those positions. But, when you've spent most of your available money on guys who aren't the guys who will have the most impact on the team, where will the money be when it's time to get the impact players?

 

That 10.5m, or most of it sure would have been nice for applying to the woeful offense this offseason. I think we can pretty much forget about another starter at this point, especially if he's going to sign another free agent as a set up man.

 

What exactly are they going to do with all of these guys (Novoa, Ohman, etc...) that no longer have jobs? You can't exactly trade them for major league talent with no room on the roster.

 

I'm really baffled.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

And let me reiterate. If this were the first signing of the offseason, I would likely roll my eyes at it, but I wouldn't be terribly upset. My reaction to it would be similar to how I reacted to the Rusch signing. Combined with Rusch and Perez, this is a bad signing.

 

Let me share a simple analogy. Blowing an extra thirty bucks on something I don't need at the mall is likely not going to put my family in a bind. If I do it every day it starts to add up. Doing it once, no big deal. Doing it for two weeks, then I start to look around at a bunch of crap that could have really equaled a nice purchase. Neifi, Rusch, and Eyre are the pile of crap that could have been Giles or Furcal.

 

Let's put it this way...assume all those guys were under contract. We're about to make a trade. On one side, Neifi, Rusch and Eyre. On the other side, Furcal or Giles. Which side would you choose?

 

Now if Hendry has a blank checkbook and still can pay the money for Giles and Furcal....great. But with a 105 payroll, the prospects of that happening are looking pretty slim.

 

Moves like this make me wonder if Hendry really understands how flawed this team is.

[JeffH]

The most frustrating thing is that, to attract a guy to sign with you, you might have to EITHER give him a little extra money OR throw him a bone like a player option.

 

NOT BOTH!!!

[USSoccer]

Vance,

 

Great Post.

[Clogged Basepaths]

I agree with you again BBB, but like I was saying the years/$ of this deal is just a result of the market/climate now.

 

Doesn't mean we have to be happy about it, but until we get a pitching coach that can routinely work wonders with reclamation projects - this will have to be what we do.