Gold Glove Awards

[Rob]

Nico, Dansby, and Happ all won for their respective positions.

 

Edited November 6, 2023 by Rob
Jpg

[Transmogrified Tiger]

seems good

[javy knows my name]

Wheeler gonna win the cya and the gold glove? Anybody done that since Maddux? Or is it definitely gonna be Snell

[Transmogrified Tiger]

19 minutes ago, javy knows my name said:

Wheeler gonna win the cya and the gold glove? Anybody done that since Maddux? Or is it definitely gonna be Snell

Looks like Keuchel did it in 2015.

[DYMNO]

So happy for Nico, Dansby, and Happ.

[chopsx9]

LOL at Moreno winning a GG but not Daulton Varsho.  BJ fans getting salt kicked in their eyes all offseason.

[PackLandVA]

Happ is the clumsiest looking two-time gold glove winner ever.

[Jason Ross]

6 hours ago, PackLandVA said:

Happ is the clumsiest looking two-time gold glove winner ever.

Yeah, and realistically, he probably shouldn't have won this year. NL LF'ers were pretty bad as a whole, as only three finished with +DRS. Happ's DRS was tied with Reynolds for 2nd at a +2 behind Eddie Rosario's +3. Happ's OAA was significantly worse than Rosario's but made up for it with a much better arm. Splitting the difference, Rosario was probably the wee-better choice. The reality is, any of the AL runner-ups would have been a more deserving winner if they were in the NL.

With that said, congrats to Happ, Swanson and Hoerner. All put in significant work this year, enjoy the night!

[CubUgly]

8 minutes ago, 1908_Cubs said:

Yeah, and realistically, he probably shouldn't have won this year. NL LF'ers were pretty bad as a whole, as only three finished with +DRS. Happ's DRS was tied with Reynolds for 2nd at a +2 behind Eddie Rosario's +3. Happ's OAA was significantly worse than Rosario's but made up for it with a much better arm. Splitting the difference, Rosario was probably the wee-better choice. 

With that said, congrats to Happ, Swanson and Hoerner. All put in significant work this year, enjoy the night!

Agreed, folks tend to put their worst fielders in left so typically you get the best of a mediocre group of fielders there winning the GG.  Look no further than last year when Yelich who is about as bad a fielder as your gonna get, finished runner up to Happ.  Happ was good last year, he regressed back a bit this year, I don't think anyone who watched every day could say differently. 

I would agree given what you said above Re: Rosario, but I don't know the politics and everything else that comes into play here.  Would love to hear from the decision makers on this. 

[Jason Ross]

1 minute ago, CubUgly said:

Agreed, folks tend to put their worst fielders in left so typically you get the best of a mediocre group of fielders there winning the GG.  Look no further than last year when Yelich who is about as bad a fielder as your gonna get, finished runner up to Happ.  Happ was good last year, he regressed back a bit this year, I don't think anyone who watched every day could say differently. 

I would agree given what you said above Re: Rosario, but I don't know the politics and everything else that comes into play here.  Would love to hear from the decision makers on this. 

I can't remember the documentary/video and it was a while ago, but I had watched something about gold glove voting/award voting (along these lines) and basically there are people who barely watch these guys who vote and pick mainly on reputation. Now, that was a handful of years ago, so I'm not entirely sure that's the way it is so much any more. Probably helped Happ that last year he won the GG in winning this year. Thankfully, with the addition of things like baseball savant, and DRS, I think most of the voting (or at least the nomination process) is set up that the 3 (or so) best fielders get nominated, which should stop from egregious gold glove winners of past. 

But yeah, I too wonder  how these things go down. We see some of the ridiculous voting when it comes to HoF every year.

[Jason Ross]

If you all need a fun baseball savant page, might I interest you in Brenton Doyle, winner of the gold glove (rightfully so) in the NL for the CF position. Doyle finished with a +19 DRS in CF, and a +16 in OAA. He also finished dead last in the league with a 43 wRC+ and a 35% K%. 

His Baseball Savant page is absolutely wild.

Edited November 6, 2023 by 1908_Cubs

[javy knows my name]

I got stuck with the pirates announcers on a Pirated stream this year and they spent about 10 minutes gushing over Ke'Bryan Hayes making the most routine horsefeathers play and now I irrationally hate him and seeing him here annoys me

That's it

Edited November 6, 2023 by javy knows my name

[Tryptamine]

It's kind of funny that all those outfield assist Happ got paid off for him even though they were mostly caused by him playing a ball badly in the first place. 

[chopsx9]

3 hours ago, TomtheBombadil said:

Oooh, good call. Varsho basically turned their OF defense from poop to one of the handful best in the league 

Well Kiermaier helped a bit as well.  Varsho just couldn't hit water if he fell out of a boat.  Toronto media brings up that trade everyday.  They were convinced that Moreno or Gurriell were going to win WS MVP so they were at least spared that.  The team will be better served with Varsho in CF and somebody who can hit in LF next year.

[CubinNY]

On 11/6/2023 at 10:26 AM, Tryptamine said:

It's kind of funny that all those outfield assist Happ got paid off for him even though they were mostly caused by him playing a ball badly in the first place. 

It's called the Soriano Method (TM).

[Stratos]

Madrigal had a shot if he played the whole season.  Add PCA, that's one heck of a defense.

[Rcal10]

26 minutes ago, Stratos said:

Madrigal had a shot if he played the whole season.  Add PCA, that's one heck of a defense.

Madrigal cannot be the regular 3rd baseman full time. That would not make for good offense at 3rd. 

[Tryptamine]

19 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

Madrigal cannot be the regular 3rd baseman full time. That would not make for good offense at 3rd. 

Sure he can, If Alonso is your 1B and Ohtani/Soto is your DH.

[Jason Ross]

21 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

Madrigal cannot be the regular 3rd baseman full time. That would not make for good offense at 3rd. 

I think it's likely Nick Madrigal will be the opening day 3b. The Cubs won't be able to solve all of their issues and will likely have to make concessions. They seem to be aiming big at DH, and appear to be interested in a 1b. They seem to be interested in a SP and they don't seem to believe much in Morel playing 3b. I think 3b is much more of a "back burner" position in this offseason. Not to suggest it's impossible or they 100% wont, but the Cubs have decent-to-below average ready-made at the 3b right now and multiple prospects who will be close to the MLB come mid-season. 

Then add in Counsell's past. He ran out Jace Peterson, a defense-first-low-offense 3b in Milwaukee in 2022, so there's some basis in a Nick Madrigal type in our new manager's recent past preferences. 

End result, I think Madrigal is the most likely OD 3b as of now. Things can change, but I'm assuming that if the Cubs could accomplish Plan A this offseason, that Madrigal would be the starter at 3b in late-March (and him being replaced by Shaw or Murray come mid-June).

[Rcal10]

35 minutes ago, 1908_Cubs said:

I think it's likely Nick Madrigal will be the opening day 3b. The Cubs won't be able to solve all of their issues and will likely have to make concessions. They seem to be aiming big at DH, and appear to be interested in a 1b. They seem to be interested in a SP and they don't seem to believe much in Morel playing 3b. I think 3b is much more of a "back burner" position in this offseason. Not to suggest it's impossible or they 100% wont, but the Cubs have decent-to-below average ready-made at the 3b right now and multiple prospects who will be close to the MLB come mid-season. 

Then add in Counsell's past. He ran out Jace Peterson, a defense-first-low-offense 3b in Milwaukee in 2022, so there's some basis in a Nick Madrigal type in our new manager's recent past preferences. 

End result, I think Madrigal is the most likely OD 3b as of now. Things can change, but I'm assuming that if the Cubs could accomplish Plan A this offseason, that Madrigal would be the starter at 3b in late-March (and him being replaced by Shaw or Murray come mid-June).

If accomplishing plan A means they have one of Ohtani or Soto, 1 of Hoskins or Alonso and a trade for a young pitcher and/or sign another pitcher, I agree with you that Madrigal will be the OD 3rd baseman, But my comment was Madrigal cannot be the full time everyday 3ed baseman. You even agree he should be replaced in mid-June. So therefore you don’t think he will be the everyday 3rd baseman either. I don’t think Morel will be an option at 3rd under plan A. Mainly because I think he will be needed in a trade for either Soto, Alonso or a young pitcher. So as you said they cannot fill all positions and Madrigal will open at 3rd. Hopefully he is replaced in mid June. 

Edited November 14, 2023 by Rcal10

[Stratos]

2 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

Madrigal cannot be the regular 3rd baseman full time. That would not make for good offense at 3rd. 

He's not my ideal regular 3B for sure, just saying we have some good fielders.

[Jason Ross]

7 hours ago, Rcal10 said:

If accomplishing plan A means they have one of Ohtani or Soto, 1 of Hoskins or Alonso and a trade for a young pitcher and/or sign another pitcher, I agree with you that Madrigal will be the OD 3rd baseman, But my comment was Madrigal cannot be the full time everyday 3ed baseman. You even agree he should be replaced in mid-June. So therefore you don’t think he will be the everyday 3rd baseman either. I don’t think Morel will be an option at 3rd under plan A. Mainly because I think he will be needed in a trade for either Soto, Alonso or a young pitcher. So as you said they cannot fill all positions and Madrigal will open at 3rd. Hopefully he is replaced in mid June. 

It depends. I think there's a world where Madrigal is the primary 3b and the Cubs are still pretty fine. For example, I think the Rangers were a good enough team, but they weren't a juggernaut. They had Leody Tavares pick up 143 games in CF with a 98 wRC+ and was worth 2.3 fWAR. Madrigal can probably batting average and defense his way to close to 2 fWAR. 

I'm not advocating for him at 3b, but I think they *can* get away with him there. They'll probably have to for half if not more of the season barring something unforseen right now, as I don't think the Cubs will go in for Chapman based on what we've heard so far they're looking for this offseason, and outside of him, I can't find a readily available 3b upgrade (maybe Candelario, but I'm not sure I buy him as a 3b much longer. He's not good defensively).

[Rcal10]

1 hour ago, 1908_Cubs said:

It depends. I think there's a world where Madrigal is the primary 3b and the Cubs are still pretty fine. For example, I think the Rangers were a good enough team, but they weren't a juggernaut. They had Leody Tavares pick up 143 games in CF with a 98 wRC+ and was worth 2.3 fWAR. Madrigal can probably batting average and defense his way to close to 2 fWAR. 

I'm not advocating for him at 3b, but I think they *can* get away with him there. They'll probably have to for half if not more of the season barring something unforseen right now, as I don't think the Cubs will go in for Chapman based on what we've heard so far they're looking for this offseason, and outside of him, I can't find a readily available 3b upgrade (maybe Candelario, but I'm not sure I buy him as a 3b much longer. He's not good defensively).

I agree on Chapman. I would rather save the money and play Madrigal. I also agree that if they accomplished the off season we hope they have, Madrigal will get a lot of starts at 3rd. Just hope someone fills that spot later in the season. The only wild card on the team is Morel. But he doesn’t appear to be a 3rd baseman. So he will be traded, is my guess. 

[Backtobanks]

Saw a story linking Madrigal to the Yankees to play 3B.

[CubinNY]

11 hours ago, 1908_Cubs said:

I think it's likely Nick Madrigal will be the opening day 3b. The Cubs won't be able to solve all of their issues and will likely have to make concessions. They seem to be aiming big at DH, and appear to be interested in a 1b. They seem to be interested in a SP and they don't seem to believe much in Morel playing 3b. I think 3b is much more of a "back burner" position in this offseason. Not to suggest it's impossible or they 100% wont, but the Cubs have decent-to-below average ready-made at the 3b right now and multiple prospects who will be close to the MLB come mid-season. 

Then add in Counsell's past. He ran out Jace Peterson, a defense-first-low-offense 3b in Milwaukee in 2022, so there's some basis in a Nick Madrigal type in our new manager's recent past preferences. 

End result, I think Madrigal is the most likely OD 3b as of now. Things can change, but I'm assuming that if the Cubs could accomplish Plan A this offseason, that Madrigal would be the starter at 3b in late-March (and him being replaced by Shaw or Murray come mid-June).

If Shaw stays on trajectory I would not be the least bit surprised if he's starting at 3B around or after the ASB. It's more aggressive than usual for the Cubs, but they appear to be balls out right now (get your mind out of the gutter, I'm talking about a steam engine). Madrigal might start, but at some point in the cold spring, he's going to have a leg issue. 

Also, LOL, Madrigal's noodle arm and windup throw to third preclude him from any consideration for a gold glove. He's not a 3rd baseman. 

Edited November 14, 2023 by CubinNY