Cubs offseason chit chat...

[Backtobanks]

How about a different trade proposal:

Kim + Cosgrove for Mervis + Brown + Little.

Mervis would move Cronenworth back to 2B, where he has much more value.  The deal helps the Padres bloated payroll and they get a decent pitching prospect in Brown and a flyer on Little.  Cubs get a solid 3B and a lefty reliever.

 

[Rcal10]

2 minutes ago, thawv said:

Because he's used a 6 man rotation the last 3 years.  His top 2 starters get like 31-32 starts, and the other 4 get like 24-25 starts.  Then obviously there's going to be injuries to throw that out of whack.

 

Got it. I am not sure he would do straight 6 man staff, but I would bet even if there weee no jnjuries(which isn’t possible) he would still have some pitchers get extra rest from time to time. So I could see ) starters used, for sure. 

[Jason Ross]

I doubt the Cubs run a true, "6 man" rotation where they have six settled starters who take consistent turns in the rotation. I do think the Cubs, through injuries, rest days, prospects and the like, will run some sort of hybrid rotation where guys will get some "rest days" here or there...etc. So I don't expect the Cubs will run a traditional "5 man" either.

[LBiittner]

30 minutes ago, Backtobanks said:

I didn't say straight up, but PCA would greatly reduce any other prospects that might need to be added to complete the deal.

 

You're right.

I was thinking back on the Kenny Holtzman for Rick Monday type of deal. Which I hated. I wouldn't ever trade a very good pitcher for a good hitter straight up. 

[LBiittner]

36 minutes ago, Backtobanks said:

How about a different trade proposal:

Kim + Cosgrove for Mervis + Brown + Little.

Mervis would move Cronenworth back to 2B, where he has much more value.  The deal helps the Padres bloated payroll and they get a decent pitching prospect in Brown and a flyer on Little.  Cubs get a solid 3B and a lefty reliever.

 

Kim was a 5.8 war. 

I highly doubt he gets moved

[chibears55]

6 hours ago, Backtobanks said:

I don't understand all of this discussion about Bellinger and his worth as a 1B.  I don't think anyone has suggested that we go after Bellinger to play 1B.  If we want a 1B, there are cheaper options available.  Bellinger is being sought as a CF and his asking price is based on playing CF.  Of course, he is probably the only FA versatile enough to excel offensively and defensively at two prime positions.

For me at least, I would like to see them bring Bellinger back as yhe CFer, so PCA can get more seasoning in AAA, and when PCA is ready whether it this season or next, then they have options with Bellinger with the corner OF, 1B, and with DH.

[Rcal10]

13 minutes ago, chibears55 said:

For me at least, I would like to see them bring Bellinger back as yhe CFer, so PCA can get more seasoning in AAA, and when PCA is ready whether it this season or next, then they have options with Bellinger with the corner OF, 1B, and with DH.

That is fine. But what has been pointed out numerous times now, to get Bellinger they have to pay him as a centerfielder. As a centerfielder he can very well be worth $25M to $27M a year for 6 or 7 years. As a first baseman he is probably worth maybe $20M or $21M a year for maybe 4 or 5 years. There is no reason he should DH, and if he did he isn’t worth $26M a year. And if he played the corner either Happ or Suzuki has to be traded or they DH. And if the have Morel and he can’t play 3rd, DH is taken. So, sure, they can put him at 1st but his contract would be a substantial overpay for his production. 

[Bertz]

Nothing Cubs specific, but as another big market team in on players at a lot of the same positions it's a good market check.  Plus obviously we should presume they have the same taste in pitchers as us.  A few notes that stood out to me:

- Lucas Giolito got divorced last year, so between the off field stuff and the White Sox being a mess sounds like none of the smart teams are worried about him at all.  You really get the sense this is who Boston is expecting to end up with (in addition to James Paxton)

- We've talked about getting Bellinger on a Carlos Correa type deal, sounds like that might be the route Blake Snell goes too

- Much like the position player market, Boras is being blamed for dragging his feet on Montgomery and Snell (I didn't realize he represents them too)

- Imanaga is being framed as living in the second tier of SPs with Giolito/Stroman, not with Montgomery/Snell.  Apparently teams have to make an offer to Imanaga and then he's setting up visits from there?  The Sox do not have one on the books yet

- Sox get mentioned as going after Robery Stephenson and Teoscar Hernandez, and a potential fit for Rhys Hoskins among others

[LBiittner]

Brought this here because there were Cease and cub rumors.

Sox fans along with oriole fans have a source tying the 2 teams Cease for Povich plus 2 more highly ranked kids from orioles.

Probably just jibber jabber? 

[Tryptamine]

8 minutes ago, LBiittner said:

Brought this here because there were Cease and cub rumors.

Sox fans along with oriole fans have a source tying the 2 teams Cease for Povich plus 2 more highly ranked kids from orioles.

Probably just jibber jabber? 

Povich would be at best a #2 piece in that deal and likely #3 if the Sox Cincy asking price was even remotely true.

[LBiittner]

Looking further they mentioned cowser Ortiz povich I don't know about any of these players 

[Tryptamine]

11 minutes ago, LBiittner said:

Looking further they mentioned cowser Ortiz povich I don't know about any of these players 

That would make more sense. Cowser+Ortiz is kind of what I've been guessing, Povich would be bonus. Holiday is 100% off the table and Basallo probably too. Cowser+Kjersted+Mayo carry similar value with Ortiz a big step down and completely blocked by Henderson. 

[Stratos]

3 hours ago, TomtheBombadil said:

Wicks may not be the one super mega duper ace destined to save us all immediately but he’s going to be excellent 

I will walk back Manaea a liiiiitttle. His four seam fastball is a good pitch at 94 that the rotation doesn’t have, different approach from Wicks altogether and not really blocking, and it looks like he tweaked the mechanics, shaped up the secondaries, and got stronger in general. As the FAs go I can see the fit and potential value on a 2 year deal, good teams being interested, but ultimately do want more velo and stuff? Sumfin like that 

Can Manaea throw 94 mph as a starter though?  Did he do that last year?  Or just in relief?  His K rate went up as a reliever.  So did his velo I assume.  He sucked last year as a SP.  4.82 ERA in 43.2 IP.

The Cubs seem to like guys with control and try to improve the stuff in the lab.  I think that's why they signed Taillon.

[Stratos]

4 hours ago, TomtheBombadil said:

Wicks may not be the one super mega duper ace destined to save us all immediately but he’s going to be excellent.

His 4-seamer was terrible for the Cubs last year, hitters slugged .771 off it.  He needs to figure a FB he can use, maybe the sinker or cutter, or get the 4-seamer going better.  He cutter sucked too though, the sinker was effective.  Small samples though.

Weird how pitchers seem to throw sinkers less these days.

[Rcal10]

10 hours ago, Tryptamine said:

Povich would be at best a #2 piece in that deal and likely #3 if the Sox Cincy asking price was even remotely true.

The issue could be with the reds discussion people and talking about who the Sox are asking for. With the orioles that might be who the orioles want to give up. IMO the Sox ask is ridiculous. And that’s fine. They can ask that. Doesn’t mean they get it. 

Edited December 29, 2023 by Rcal10

[CubinNY]

I love Joey Votto. 
 

 

[Post Count Padder]

I know they need pitching but I really want Wicks to win a spot in the rotation. Heck can maybe even piggyback him and either Assad or Wesneski. Especially if we go with a 6 man rotation. 

Also I'm still really holding out hope that Keegan can still be a guy.

[Rcal10]

10 minutes ago, Post Count Padder said:

I know they need pitching but I really want Wicks to win a spot in the rotation. Heck can maybe even piggyback him and either Assad or Wesneski. Especially if we go with a 6 man rotation. 

Also I'm still really holding out hope that Keegan can still be a guy.

You lost me at Keegan.

[Stratos]

3 hours ago, CubinNY said:

I love Joey Votto. 
 

 

He needs to accept the fact that he's old, he sucks now, and he needs to retire.  But I like the fact that he seems to love playing baseball.

[Post Count Padder]

Red Sox sign Giolito, 2 years and $38 mil.

[Backtobanks]

From MLBTR:

Red Sox In Agreement With Lucas Giolito

Meanwhile:

Cubs Sign Joe Hudson To Minor League Deal.

 

Jed is hopeless.

[Bertz]

Great news, assuming as expected they're doing Giolito and Paxton and not not Giolito + someone bigger

[Rcal10]

3 minutes ago, Bertz said:

Great news, assuming as expected they're doing Giolito and Paxton and not not Giolito + someone bigger

I don’t see it as great news at all. Just another guy the Cubs can’t sign. And if he cost $19M annual what are the other 3 going to cost? I know there is time. I know you think they will make some bigger signing. I wish I shared your belief. Even a guy like Stroman. What is he going to cost? I am started to wish he didn’t opt out because I doubt they get anyone better than him via free agency. 

[LBiittner]

2 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

I don’t see it as great news at all. Just another guy the Cubs can’t sign. And if he cost $19M annual what are the other 3 going to cost? I know there is time. I know you think they will make some bigger signing. I wish I shared your belief. Even a guy like Stroman. What is he going to cost? I am started to wish he didn’t opt out because I doubt they get anyone better than him via free agency. 

Don't worry Rcal, jed has smyly as his trump card.

Bwahahaha 

[Bertz]

4 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

I don’t see it as great news at all. Just another guy the Cubs can’t sign. And if he cost $19M annual what are the other 3 going to cost? I know there is time. I know you think they will make some bigger signing. I wish I shared your belief. Even a guy like Stroman. What is he going to cost? I am started to wish he didn’t opt out because I doubt they get anyone better than him via free agency. 

If you're going to worry when teams that have the ability to sign players we want instead sign players we don't want I don't really know what to tell you.