Martin Maldonado to Cubs

[Andy]

I bet it was because Monty and Maldonado's money matches up.

Think I saw the Royals are saving some $400K, but yeah that's probably a nonzero part of the reason.

[Deeg]

If they trade Vic, they damn well better get something pretty good. He can hit, is a switch-hitter decent from both sides, and his overall D and framing have really improved this season.

[Cubswin11]

If they trade Vic, they damn well better get something pretty good. He can hit, is a switch-hitter decent from both sides, and his overall D and framing have really improved this season.

I’m fine letting some team dream on him being a starting caliber catcher and selling highish. He has a career 87 wRC+, he’s most likely a career backup.

[Cubswin11]

Wonder if they were talking something like Monty, Vic, Happ, Amaya and some other prospects for Whit and Maldonado.

 

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Gross.

[We Got The Whole 9]

If they trade Vic, they damn well better get something pretty good. He can hit, is a switch-hitter decent from both sides, and his overall D and framing have really improved this season.

I’m fine letting some team dream on him being a starting caliber catcher and selling highish. He has a career 87 wRC+, he’s most likely a career backup.

Dude he didn't have nearly enough career PA to give a horsefeathers about that number. I mean that's ridiculous. 260 PA.

 

He is killing it according to xwoba so hes earned that line. And he has shown some of the best plate discipline on the team as well with his zswing-oswing. Maybe some holes are being poked now but it's too early to write him off and not believe he can make the adjustments. As a prospect he put up solid lines at every level that he had a decent sample, including 2 stints at AAA with a 3/4/5 slash line.

 

I'm actually surprised you're so willing to write him off when he doesnt have huge red flags but you pined for Happ to get a shot even when he had an 80 wRC+ with a 30+ Krate in the supercharged PCL this year.

 

Steamer and zips even like him over Happ, FWIW

[Cubswin11]

If they trade Vic, they damn well better get something pretty good. He can hit, is a switch-hitter decent from both sides, and his overall D and framing have really improved this season.

I’m fine letting some team dream on him being a starting caliber catcher and selling highish. He has a career 87 wRC+, he’s most likely a career backup.

Dude he didn't have nearly enough career PA to give a horsefeathers about that number. I mean that's ridiculous. 260 PA.

 

He is killing it according to xwoba so hes earned that line. And he has shown some of the best plate discipline on the team as well with his zswing-oswing. Maybe some holes are being poked now but it's too early to write him off and not believe he can make the adjustments. As a prospect he put up solid lines at every level that he had a decent sample, including 2 stints at AAA with a 3/4/5 slash line.

 

I'm actually surprised you're so willing to write him off when he doesnt have huge red flags but you pined for Happ to get a shot even when he had an 80 wRC+ with a 30+ Krate in the supercharged PCL this year.

 

Steamer and zips even like him over Happ, FWIW

I certainly was wrong on Vic going in to the year, I wanted a backup C (ironically Maldonado was top of the list) and Vic has been really good and I hope he continues to do well. But Vic's value will probably never be higher and with Willy his path to playing time will be limited (assuming this really is a 10 day injury thing for him). If a team wants to pay up for Vic thinking he's a full time starter I'm not against moving him, I wouldn't just trade him to trade him. That was really my point, the answer to what Vic really is probably falls somewhere between what he's been for his career and what he's been this year. And I more wanted Happ to get a shot because of who he'd be taking ABs over (Almora, Descalso, Russell, Zagunis, etc). I also don't think the answer to improving the offense is giving Vic more catching time and putting WIlly in the OF, if we're going to do the 3 catcher thing.

[Edith Cox]

Theo is losing his fastball.

 

Hope this turns out to be more or becomes better than it looks on paper. I fully expected use to sell Monty for some IFA pool money or to fill out of bigger trade not to add a defensive catcher who can't hit. He's been terrible but the possibility of being a cost controlled SP the next two year should have had a hell of a lot more value than this.

[Deeg]

Wonder if they were talking something like Monty, Vic, Happ, Amaya and some other prospects for Whit and Maldonado.

 

 

The starting point for Merrifield would probably be Schwarber and Hoerner, and that wouldn't be enough. That's not happening.

[Bear Cub]

This trade makes a trade for another lefty in the pen more likely.

[jersey cubs fan]

Wonder if they were talking something like Monty, Vic, Happ, Amaya and some other prospects for Whit and Maldonado.

 

“We’d actually” is just tradesplaining

[Banedon]

The important thing is...

 

Willson Traymor was right.

[squally1313]

If they trade Vic, they damn well better get something pretty good. He can hit, is a switch-hitter decent from both sides, and his overall D and framing have really improved this season.

I’m fine letting some team dream on him being a starting caliber catcher and selling highish. He has a career 87 wRC+, he’s most likely a career backup.

Steering clear of the whole Caratini/Happ discussion, but FWIW, here are the league average wRC+s for catchers the last few years:

 

2019: 88

2018: 84

2017: 89

2016: 87

2015: 85

 

Four more years of control on someone who has hit like an average catcher in a small sample size (and is showing a lot more this year in an even smaller sample size) isn't nothing. He may not work out with someone like the Giants given their catching situation, but I'm hoping he could bring back a reliable reliever.

[muntjack]

 

The starting point for Merrifield would probably be Schwarber and Hoerner, and that wouldn't be enough. That's not happening.

 

Not attacking your point, but it's funny to me how many have written off (or are in the process of writing off) Schwarber, a pedigreed 26 year old with a career .340 wOBA/111 wRC+, and now he's being discussed as not enough to bring back a guy who at 26 hadn't reached the majors and was putting up a .308 wOBA and 81 RC+ in the Texas league.

[We Got The Whole 9]

I’m fine letting some team dream on him being a starting caliber catcher and selling highish. He has a career 87 wRC+, he’s most likely a career backup.

Dude he didn't have nearly enough career PA to give a horsefeathers about that number. I mean that's ridiculous. 260 PA.

 

He is killing it according to xwoba so hes earned that line. And he has shown some of the best plate discipline on the team as well with his zswing-oswing. Maybe some holes are being poked now but it's too early to write him off and not believe he can make the adjustments. As a prospect he put up solid lines at every level that he had a decent sample, including 2 stints at AAA with a 3/4/5 slash line.

 

I'm actually surprised you're so willing to write him off when he doesnt have huge red flags but you pined for Happ to get a shot even when he had an 80 wRC+ with a 30+ Krate in the supercharged PCL this year.

 

Steamer and zips even like him over Happ, FWIW

I certainly was wrong on Vic going in to the year, I wanted a backup C (ironically Maldonado was top of the list) and Vic has been really good and I hope he continues to do well. But Vic's value will probably never be higher and with Willy his path to playing time will be limited (assuming this really is a 10 day injury thing for him). If a team wants to pay up for Vic thinking he's a full time starter I'm not against moving him, I wouldn't just trade him to trade him. That was really my point, the answer to what Vic really is probably falls somewhere between what he's been for his career and what he's been this year. And I more wanted Happ to get a shot because of who he'd be taking ABs over (Almora, Descalso, Russell, Zagunis, etc). I also don't think the answer to improving the offense is giving Vic more catching time and putting WIlly in the OF, if we're going to do the 3 catcher thing.

 

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game. I'd rather pair Maldonado to mentor Caratini and improve on his above average game. Right now BP, statcorner, and FG rank him in the top 25, and his bat could be good enough to actually produce 3-4 war. Move Schwarber and put Contreras in LF. According to BR Schwarber has produced 3 WAR over 4 seasons. His bat just isn't valuable enough to cling to him, and his fielding is not good (yes I fell for his fielding last year, some might point out). At some point you have to stop waiting on the upside and recognize him for what hes been and it's not worth it. Putting Willy out there and Vic behind the dish might not improve the offense a lot but I dont think it would impact is negatively and we would get a boost in our walk rate, IMO, and put our pitchers in more favorable counts consistently. I think that would be big for those guys.

[jersey cubs fan]

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

[squally1313]

I like how everyone glosses over the whole 'Just convert Contreras to an outfielder! He'll be fine!' thing too.

[jersey cubs fan]

I like how everyone glosses over the whole 'Just convert Contreras to an outfielder! He'll be fine!' thing too.

He's shown no interest in getting better at catcher because all his interest lies in being the best left fielder he can be.

[We Got The Whole 9]

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

 

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher. So, yes. He's had the keys. But they have an opportunity to hand those keys to a better defender. So I'll rephrase and say that I'll be disappointed if he retains those keys.

[Tim]

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

 

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher. So, yes. He's had the keys. But they have an opportunity to hand those keys to a better defender. So I'll rephrase and say that I'll be disappointed if he retains those keys.

by pretty much every account I've ever read, the guy works his ass off to get better and is very open to instruction. I'd be interested in where you are getting your info that he has no "desire" to improve. Or admit that's [expletive] and what you really mean to say is that he simply hasn't gotten better at that aspect of the game.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher.

 

Team ERA- by year:

 

2017: 91 - T-4th in NL

2018: 91 - T-2nd in NL

2019: 93 - 4th in NL

[squally1313]

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

 

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher. So, yes. He's had the keys. But they have an opportunity to hand those keys to a better defender. So I'll rephrase and say that I'll be disappointed if he retains those keys.

 

Alright first off, let's throw out 'our pitching has degraded', because that's nonsense. Fairly positive he isn't responsible for Lester and Hendricks getting older, or Theo picking Yu over Jake, etc etc etc.

[jersey cubs fan]

My disappointment would (so far this is all internet spec and I might be getting miffed for nothing) largely lie in handing the keys to the one of the worst receivers in the league whom hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

 

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher. So, yes. He's had the keys. But they have an opportunity to hand those keys to a better defender. So I'll rephrase and say that I'll be disappointed if he retains those keys.

I think the pitching has gotten worse mostly because the best pitchers on the team are generally on the older side and many of them have gone through injuries.

 

There's an argument to be made that the results of pitching may be slightly better with somebody else back there, but there is no doubt the offense would take a hit and there is not one ounce of justification for claiming he hasn't shown much interest in improving his game.

[BigSlick]

Sending Montgomery for a back up is a fleecing for the Royals but what can you do? He’s been pretty bad and I’ve been beaten into submission by bad moves by the front office

 

Oh well

[We Got The Whole 9]

 

Are you talking about Willson Contreras? The converted infielder who has been the primary catcher the past four years? You are disappointed they handed the keys to him, 4 years ago? Four years they've largely spent in 1st place and been among the best teams in baseball. That disappoints you?

 

I don't really like him as a catcher and our pitching has degraded each year hes been our fulltime catcher. So, yes. He's had the keys. But they have an opportunity to hand those keys to a better defender. So I'll rephrase and say that I'll be disappointed if he retains those keys.

by pretty much every account I've ever read, the guy works his ass off to get better and is very open to instruction. I'd be interested in where you are getting your info that he has no "desire" to improve. Or admit that's [expletive] and what you really mean to say is that he simply hasn't gotten better at that aspect of the game.

 

I cant find the quote but he said, 'a ball is a ball and a strike is a strike, I dont really care about that' when asked about his pitch framing. I believe this happened after his argument with Flowers. The proof is in the pudding. Hes not climbed out of the bottom 3 in 3 years. His setup remains poor, his glove is loud, the numbers back it up.

Edited July 16, 2019 by We Got The Whole 9