Cubs add Chapman for Torres, et al. imb wishes we paid more

[MWV]

Would be cool if Robertson blows a save and then Chapman comes in and saves it for the Cubs.

It would be even cooler if the Cubs win 9-0 and Chapman just gets to hang out and make small talk.

[Banedon]

This is on par with my feelings....

 

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[Ding Dong Johnson]

This is on par with my feelings....

 

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I'm not entirely convinced yet the Cubs gave up too much, but I don't want to root for him either.

[imb]

 

Pretty close. It's not unreasonable to be uneasy about paying a high price for a half season of an elite reliever. It can and has been taken too far into prospect clutching, but so is taking the 'Chapman is an elite reliever that makes us better' argument to 'Torres, Cease, McKinney, who cares they're in A-ball'.

 

im just not going to fret one little bit about shoring up this team's biggest weakness by giving up ONE ENTIRE PROSPECT that anyone remotely cares about. Had cease actually been included i woulda tugged my collar a little bit and i would have been annoyed (but still happy to have chapman) if eloy had been the headliner. the package we gave up is literally one guy who might just as well turn into felix pie and three pieces of nothing. who cares, let's win a world series

 

But again, not everybody even cares about trading Torres. A lot of us are cool with trading him. We just thought he could be used for another area of weakness but also for a guy in return with lots more years of control.

 

Now in his defense, maybe Theo explored Archer, etc. and Torres was being viewed as the third piece to a trade and it wasn't going to happen so he did this.

 

does theo seem like the kind of guy to you to do something big without exploring all available options?

 

(also chapman has thrown 90 less innings than archer this year and has been worth one-tenth of a point less in WAR)

[Cubfanintheknow]

Would be cool if Robertson blows a save and then Chapman comes in and saves it for the Cubs.

It would be even cooler if the Cubs win 9-0 and Chapman just gets to hang out and make small talk.

 

That would be kind of cool if he popped into the dugout late in a blowout Cubs victory and got all huggy with his new teammates. While Clayton Richard was getting his bus ticket out of town.

[Cubswin11]

This is on par with my feelings....

 

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I'm not entirely convinced yet the Cubs gave up too much, but I don't want to root for him either.

I agree, Torres to me turns out to be a little bit better version of Jean Segura.

[BigSlick]

It is nice that Clayton Richard will never ever again touch a mound for the 2016 Chicago Cubs

 

my hate for him is entirely outsized his actual talent and performance

[Cubfanintheknow]

I'm not ashamed to admit I drooled when I read the stat lines Chapman has posted against NL opponents. It's at the bottom of the article.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/ct-cubs-aroldis-chapman-20160725-story.html

[Bryants Disco Ball]

 

im just not going to fret one little bit about shoring up this team's biggest weakness by giving up ONE ENTIRE PROSPECT that anyone remotely cares about. Had cease actually been included i woulda tugged my collar a little bit and i would have been annoyed (but still happy to have chapman) if eloy had been the headliner. the package we gave up is literally one guy who might just as well turn into felix pie and three pieces of nothing. who cares, let's win a world series

 

But again, not everybody even cares about trading Torres. A lot of us are cool with trading him. We just thought he could be used for another area of weakness but also for a guy in return with lots more years of control.

 

Now in his defense, maybe Theo explored Archer, etc. and Torres was being viewed as the third piece to a trade and it wasn't going to happen so he did this.

 

does theo seem like the kind of guy to you to do something big without exploring all available options?

 

(also chapman has thrown 90 less innings than archer this year and has been worth one-tenth of a point less in WAR)

 

I'm in no way disputing the actual talent of Chapman. Just the time we have him under control. Chapman the baseball player is an amazing addition and right up there with anybody we could have reasonably acquired.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

This is on par with my feelings....

 

[tweet]

[/tweet]

I'm not entirely convinced yet the Cubs gave up too much, but I don't want to root for him either.

I agree, Torres to me turns out to be a little bit better version of Jean Segura.

thank you, that's the guy I was thinking of earlier. I was still scouring the Brewers roster, forgetting he's the one who helped kill Schwarber

[BigSlick]

I don't think the Cubs gave up too much, and would be sure of it if they landed an extension.

It would be entirely appropriate if they could get an extension with it, its impossible for us to know that right now

[imb]

 

But again, not everybody even cares about trading Torres. A lot of us are cool with trading him. We just thought he could be used for another area of weakness but also for a guy in return with lots more years of control.

 

Now in his defense, maybe Theo explored Archer, etc. and Torres was being viewed as the third piece to a trade and it wasn't going to happen so he did this.

 

does theo seem like the kind of guy to you to do something big without exploring all available options?

 

(also chapman has thrown 90 less innings than archer this year and has been worth one-tenth of a point less in WAR)

 

I'm in no way disputing the actual talent of Chapman. Just the time we have him under control. Chapman the baseball player is an amazing addition and right up there with anybody we could have reasonably acquired.

 

well sometimes you need to win the world series and not worry as much about winning the award for most team control. 90 percent of our team is controlled for the next half-decade.

[Tim]

I agree, Torres to me turns out to be a little bit better version of Jean Segura.

thank you, that's the guy I was thinking of earlier. I was still scouring the Brewers roster, forgetting he's the one who helped kill Schwarber

Hate that guy.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I need new friends...

 

text exchange summed up with:

 

him: now Strop or Rondon can go. don't need both

me: what???? Richard can go

him: I like him

[Bryants Disco Ball]

 

does theo seem like the kind of guy to you to do something big without exploring all available options?

 

(also chapman has thrown 90 less innings than archer this year and has been worth one-tenth of a point less in WAR)

 

I'm in no way disputing the actual talent of Chapman. Just the time we have him under control. Chapman the baseball player is an amazing addition and right up there with anybody we could have reasonably acquired.

 

well sometimes you need to win the world series and not worry as much about winning the award for most team control. 90 percent of our team is controlled for the next half-decade.

 

If we win the World Series, it's the greatest trade ever!

[UMFan83]

Lefties vs. Chapman for his career

 

.123/.234/.155/.389, 1 HR allowed (the immortal Luke Scott, in 2011)

[Tracer Bullet]

 

does theo seem like the kind of guy to you to do something big without exploring all available options?

 

(also chapman has thrown 90 less innings than archer this year and has been worth one-tenth of a point less in WAR)

 

I'm in no way disputing the actual talent of Chapman. Just the time we have him under control. Chapman the baseball player is an amazing addition and right up there with anybody we could have reasonably acquired.

 

well sometimes you need to win the world series and not worry as much about winning the award for most team control. 90 percent of our team is controlled for the next half-decade.

 

how much do you think this increases the chances the cubs win the WS this year?

[Tim]

I need new friends...

 

text exchange summed up with:

 

him: now Strop or Rondon can go. don't need both

me: what???? Richard can go

him: I like him

hahahahahahahahahaha

 

your friend may be a perfectly decent person. But I hope I never have to talk baseball with him (or her).

[David]

I need new friends...

 

text exchange summed up with:

 

him: now Strop or Rondon can go. don't need both

me: what???? Richard can go

him: I like him

hahahahahahahahahaha

 

your friend may be a perfectly decent person. But I hope I never have to talk baseball with him (or her).

 

ahahha what the hell?

[imb]

 

I'm in no way disputing the actual talent of Chapman. Just the time we have him under control. Chapman the baseball player is an amazing addition and right up there with anybody we could have reasonably acquired.

 

well sometimes you need to win the world series and not worry as much about winning the award for most team control. 90 percent of our team is controlled for the next half-decade.

 

how much do you think this increases the chances the cubs win the WS this year?

 

how much would any move have increased our chances? I think this increases it as much or more than any other single possible move we could have realistically made.

[UK]

Solid move, IMO.

 

Torres is locked behind Russell, Baez, Zobrist (not that important given his age), Bryant, and possibly Happ.

 

McKinney is in a similar position behind Soler, Schwarber, Almora, Eloy, and Heyward. Didn't include Fowler in this scenario although I hope he comes back.

 

You have a current team with a 2 year window, currently tops in overall talent (maybe a case for Washington) addressing their biggest need with one of the best relievers of all-time without losing someone who likely projects to be a main contributor long-term.

I think they have much longer than a 2 year window (they will need to find a couple new starters in the next couple years, that can be accomplished with money and other trades pretty easily)

 

They will have lost Deliverance and Hammel, Lester will be declining as Arrieta likely will be as well with Kyle in his prime. They'll likely need a top 15 WAR starter at that point, which would create another window.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I need new friends...

 

text exchange summed up with:

 

him: now Strop or Rondon can go. don't need both

me: what???? Richard can go

him: I like him

hahahahahahahahahaha

 

your friend may be a perfectly decent person. But I hope I never have to talk baseball with him (or her).

yeah, I'll likely punch him in the grundle next time I see him

[Tim]

Solid move, IMO.

 

Torres is locked behind Russell, Baez, Zobrist (not that important given his age), Bryant, and possibly Happ.

 

McKinney is in a similar position behind Soler, Schwarber, Almora, Eloy, and Heyward. Didn't include Fowler in this scenario although I hope he comes back.

 

You have a current team with a 2 year window, currently tops in overall talent (maybe a case for Washington) addressing their biggest need with one of the best relievers of all-time without losing someone who likely projects to be a main contributor long-term.

I think they have much longer than a 2 year window (they will need to find a couple new starters in the next couple years, that can be accomplished with money and other trades pretty easily)

 

They will have lost Deliverance and Hammel, Lester will be declining as Arrieta likely will be as well with Kyle in his prime. They'll likely need a top 15 WAR starter at that point, which would create another window.

I have great faith that the FO will be able to patch together a good enough rotation to support what should be a dominating offense for a long time.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Hendricks is right between DeGrom and Greinke in fWAR..

 

 

Forecasting pretty much any SP beyond the next 2 years is going to be rife with issues. The Cubs will need to make changes to keep a solid rotation for 2018 and beyond. So will literally every team in baseball. That doesn't mean their window is closed or shutting or whatever, but more that sustained success is difficult and can't be guaranteed for long time horizons.

[BigSlick]

I agree, Torres to me turns out to be a little bit better version of Jean Segura.

thank you, that's the guy I was thinking of earlier. I was still scouring the Brewers roster, forgetting he's the one who helped kill Schwarber

Hate that guy.

Jean Segura also joins the Billy Hamilton Club of Extremely Mediocre HItters who Inexplicably Kill the Cubs