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Cubs add Chapman for Torres, et al. imb wishes we paid more

David

By David,
in Chicago Cubs Talk

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Bryants Disco Ball ACL Cubs

Bryants Disco Ball

Old-Timey Member
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Posted

I'm genuinely feeling shitty about myself that him being an abuser doesn't bother me much. Like if I knew this guy in my personal life, there is no way I'd be friends with him and I would despise him. But I don't know him and he just happens to play for a baseball team I root for, and for some reason I just don't feel the same.

 

And that is really shitty of me. It makes no sense that I feel two different ways.

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Thrilho Draft Eligible

Thrilho

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Posted (edited)

 

Yeah. With like a billion dollars coming off the books if he was going to sign for 4/60 he'd be a Yankee. He probably still will be but just for more years and perhaps AAV.

 

You said this last night too...wondering why you're so sure he'd rather be a Yankee than a Cub at equal salaries.

 

Because he seems happy and has at least been quoted as saying he would be down with returning next season even if he got traded. No reason not to stay with what you know if you're happy and the money is the same.

I think Girardi has already proven this theory wrong, with the same two teams involved. Unless maybe he's super happy about managing the team on the selling end of this deal.

 

To put it another way, which team's future would you take, which manager would you rather play for, and which bunch of guys would you rather hang with for the next half decade? I'm guessing Chapman sees it the same way as JHey did and he signs up eventually.

Edited by Thrilho
Elrhino Draft Eligible

Elrhino

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Posted (edited)
So, Travis Wood goes from 7th/8th inning high leverage lefty reliever to long relief guy? I'm alright with that.

Yeah the trickle down effect is Travis Wood, Trevor Cahill and Justin Grimm are now essentially mop up guys. Which is pretty incredible because in the last 16 months or so all 3 have been incredibly effective at various points.

 

Also a trickle down effect in a quicker hook for struggling starters getting high in pitch counts. Particularly if there's an opportunity to pinch hit for them in a leveraged situation.

Edited by Elrhino
Cubswin11 All-Star

Cubswin11

Old-Timey Member
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Posted
So, Travis Wood goes from 7th/8th inning high leverage lefty reliever to long relief guy? I'm alright with that.

Yeah the trickle down effect is Travis Wood, Trevor Cahill and Justin Grimm are now essentially mop up guys. Which is pretty incredible because in the last 16 months or so all 3 have been incredibly effective at various points.

 

Also a trickle down effect in a quicker hook for struggling starters getting high in pitch counts.

True, John Lackey and his stupid teeth should never see life past the 6th inning the rest of the year

imb MVP

imb

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

 

You're starting to sound as silly as the people lamenting McKinney's inclusion.

 

umm no

 

Pretty close. It's not unreasonable to be uneasy about paying a high price for a half season of an elite reliever. It can and has been taken too far into prospect clutching, but so is taking the 'Chapman is an elite reliever that makes us better' argument to 'Torres, Cease, McKinney, who cares they're in A-ball'.

 

im just not going to fret one little bit about shoring up this team's biggest weakness by giving up ONE ENTIRE PROSPECT that anyone remotely cares about. Had cease actually been included i woulda tugged my collar a little bit and i would have been annoyed (but still happy to have chapman) if eloy had been the headliner. the package we gave up is literally one guy who might just as well turn into felix pie and three pieces of nothing. who cares, let's win a world series

UMFan83 GOAT

UMFan83

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Posted
Posted
Feel bad for calling this guy quasi legit earlier. Holy backtracking and trying to save face

 

https://twitter.com/wildermind_aeh/status/757622915319857153

I mean is it really that unbelievable that even tho they didn't extend him now, they have an understanding and are in the ballpark on a contract once the offseason gets here?

 

No its perfectly possible, just not as likely as him having a bad source or no source at all. An hour ago he was saying the Cubs WILL NOT (yes he used Caps) do the deal without an extension and that they were actively negotiating.

 

Now after mainstream reporters come out saying that there was not really any discussions about an extension, he all the sudden says 'yeah but like the cubs totally feel confident he will resign' even though he's a Boras client and will probably be positioning him to get in a bidding war and end up with the largest contract for a relief pitcher ever.

Brian MVP

Brian

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted (edited)
Is it possible the Cubs have informal framework on an extension in place, but can't really confirm it or discuss it because Chapman isn't under Cubs control yet? Edited by Brian
BigSlick South Bend Cubs

BigSlick

Old-Timey Member
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favorite Adam Warren moment: now

He did have a pretty decent spot start there

 

This is a bad trade but far from disastrous and will be a blip in terms of future success unless like 3 disastrous infield injuries occur in the next 5 years

 

Theo wants to weigh that roulette wheel ever more slightly in our favor and clearly doesn't feel *entirely* too safe with the division/home field lead.

sneakypower South Bend Cubs

sneakypower

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

I can't say that I would rather have McKinney than Cease. Sure McKinney will be higher on the prospect lists and Cease is a complete wild card, but he is also a rarity in the Cubs system.

 

mckinney is literal garbage so of course id rather have cease than him but jesus christ the wailing and gnashing of teeth over these children in LOW A BALL is really amazing.

 

Prospect-hoarding gone mad. You knew it was bound to happen.

you said all this horsefeathers 2 years ago and the prospects we hoarded were the full first-wave of young MLB producers that has us currently perched as the model franchise

 

Donny, you're out of your element

Bryants Disco Ball ACL Cubs

Bryants Disco Ball

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

 

You said this last night too...wondering why you're so sure he'd rather be a Yankee than a Cub at equal salaries.

 

Because he seems happy and has at least been quoted as saying he would be down with returning next season even if he got traded. No reason not to stay with what you know if you're happy and the money is the same.

I think Girardi has already proven this theory wrong, with the same two teams involved. Unless maybe he's super happy about managing the team on the selling end of this deal.

 

To put it another way, which team's future would you take, which manager would you rather play for, and which bunch of guys would you rather hang with for the next half decade? I'm guessing Chapman sees it the same way as JHey did and he signs up eventually.

 

I mean, it's not like the Yankees don't have the resources to get back into contention rather quickly. It's not a stretch that somebody, if cool with playing for the Yanks right now, would view that situation just as good and wouldn't feel the need to move without a raise.

Irrelevant Dude Knoxville Smokies

Irrelevant Dude

Old-Timey Member
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Posted
Is it possible the Cubs have informal framework on an extension in place with Boras, but can't really confirm it or discuss it because Chapman isn't under Cubs control yet?

Boras would tell them to take that informal framework and shove it.

UK First Round Pick

UK

Old-Timey Member
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Posted

Solid move, IMO.

 

Torres is locked behind Russell, Baez, Zobrist (not that important given his age), Bryant, and possibly Happ.

 

McKinney is in a similar position behind Soler, Schwarber, Almora, Eloy, and Heyward. Didn't include Fowler in this scenario although I hope he comes back.

 

You have a current team with a 2 year window, currently tops in overall talent (maybe a case for Washington) addressing their biggest need with one of the best relievers of all-time without losing someone who likely projects to be a main contributor long-term.

Bryants Disco Ball ACL Cubs

Bryants Disco Ball

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted

 

umm no

 

Pretty close. It's not unreasonable to be uneasy about paying a high price for a half season of an elite reliever. It can and has been taken too far into prospect clutching, but so is taking the 'Chapman is an elite reliever that makes us better' argument to 'Torres, Cease, McKinney, who cares they're in A-ball'.

 

im just not going to fret one little bit about shoring up this team's biggest weakness by giving up ONE ENTIRE PROSPECT that anyone remotely cares about. Had cease actually been included i woulda tugged my collar a little bit and i would have been annoyed (but still happy to have chapman) if eloy had been the headliner. the package we gave up is literally one guy who might just as well turn into felix pie and three pieces of nothing. who cares, let's win a world series

 

But again, not everybody even cares about trading Torres. A lot of us are cool with trading him. We just thought he could be used for another area of weakness but also for a guy in return with lots more years of control.

 

Now in his defense, maybe Theo explored Archer, etc. and Torres was being viewed as the third piece to a trade and it wasn't going to happen so he did this.

BigSlick South Bend Cubs

BigSlick

Old-Timey Member
Posted
Posted
Solid move, IMO.

 

Torres is locked behind Russell, Baez, Zobrist (not that important given his age), Bryant, and possibly Happ.

 

McKinney is in a similar position behind Soler, Schwarber, Almora, Eloy, and Heyward. Didn't include Fowler in this scenario although I hope he comes back.

 

You have a current team with a 2 year window, currently tops in overall talent (maybe a case for Washington) addressing their biggest need with one of the best relievers of all-time without losing someone who likely projects to be a main contributor long-term.

I think they have much longer than a 2 year window (they will need to find a couple new starters in the next couple years, that can be accomplished with money and other trades pretty easily)

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