Bears game 14: Monday Dec 20, at MIN (TCF)

[UMFan83]

Time to give Lovie props? I've been as critical as anyone of Coach Smith, but he now has led the team to 3 NFC north titles in the last 6 years. Obviously, that is better than either Minnesota or Green Bay over the same span. Two of the 3 came when the Bears were nowhere near favorites to do so. And now the 3 non-playoff seasons in between don't look so bad with no seasons below 7-9.

 

3 in 6 years and would have had a 4th playoff appearance if he didn't choose to squib kick in atlanta. Mostly good results, and there have been some things about Lovie that I've always liked. There are plenty more things I don't like and some decisions he's made that are inexcusible.

[hawkeyecub]

Well that really sucked. At least it was fun for 1.5 quarters. After that first td drive and the defensive play early I really thought it was going to happen.

 

Then pretty much everything went wrong. Leber dropped an interception near midfield, the fumble went right to Olsen. Favre throws a screen right into a dude but you guys catch your tipped ball. But most of all we've got you 1st and 30, crowd into it and defense playing with a lot of energy. Cutler just chucks it up and it looks to me like it's gonna be a pick or at least batted down. Then Madieu Williams makes one of the worst plays I've ever seen an NFL safety make and lets it go 70 for a TD. That was a huge swing play.

 

E.J., Antoine and Kevin Williams were the only guys on defense who played well after that. The o-line that was below average is terrible without the two starting guards. Toby was running hard but once Brett went out there was no chance. Then you just hand them 10 special teams points.

 

If we get blown out again next week (which looks likely) I doubt Leslie gets the job.

[hawkeyecub]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

[Guest]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

The first Forte call was a blatant helmet to helmet hit. Not sure how you can complain about that one at all.

 

The second Forte call was more of a judgement call. But I don't think he ever really got completely stopped there. I can see that one as more of a complaint, but it should be looked at completely independently from the previous call which was about leading with the helmet as opposed to piling on a stopped runner.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

I only saw a little more than half of the game and couldn't really hear what was going on, but I did notice the officiating was pretty terrible.

[hawkeyecub]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

The first Forte call was a blatant helmet to helmet hit. Not sure how you can complain about that one at all.

 

The second Forte call was more of a judgement call. But I don't think he ever really got completely stopped there. I can see that one as more of a complaint, but it should be looked at completely independently from the previous call which was about leading with the helmet as opposed to piling on a stopped runner.

 

It was helmet to helmet. My problem is just nit-picking I guess. He said it was helmet to helmet on a runner whose progress had been stopped, but the whistle hadn't blown yet. Then the next play I thought he was completely stopped and they let it go. Now that's still on the Vikings for not coming in and finishing it cleanly, just an annoyance I guess.

[Guest]

Nothing against you, flames. Sorry.

 

yeah i like you flames, and i like neifi, and bcl. elcaballo isn't bad either. you guys are alright.

 

chuckywang inconspicuously missing from that list.

 

Well, I'm pretty sure he's still not afraid of the Bears.

[jersey cubs fan]

The refs were on edge because of the terrible field conditions. I didn't think it was any worse than every other NFL games which features missed helment to helmet hits, phantom holding and pass interference calls and everything else.

[CubColtPacer]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

The first Forte call was a blatant helmet to helmet hit. Not sure how you can complain about that one at all.

 

The second Forte call was more of a judgement call. But I don't think he ever really got completely stopped there. I can see that one as more of a complaint, but it should be looked at completely independently from the previous call which was about leading with the helmet as opposed to piling on a stopped runner.

 

The first one wouldn't have been called if his forward progress hadn't been stopped. That's the problem. They ruled Forte was defenseless and that was why he got the protection of the helmet to helmet rules. Either that call was wrong (because forward progress had not been stopped) or the second call was wrong.

[UMFan83]

I think its more likely we lose 1 of the last two than Philly loses one of their last 2 (vs. Vikings, vs. Cowboys both in Philly). So I'm not at all eliminating the 2 seed, but it makes sense to discuss possible opponents for the 3/6 matchup.

 

Here are the contenders, in the order I'd like to play them:

 

Buccaneers (8-6) - Haven't beat a +500 team all season, really choked last week at home against improving Lions team, the youngest and maybe least talented of the contenders. They need to win their last 2, while several other things could to happen. The Packers I believe clinched a tiebreaker over them, and it looks like the Giants have that tiebreaker as well. Since GB and NYG and TB can't tie, they either need to overtake the Saints or hope for an Eagles collapse (at least that's what the playoff machine is telling me). If TB wins their last 2 (1 against NO) and the Saints lose their other game (against Atlanta), and the Packers lose on of their last 2 then they are in

 

Giants - Really good team who dominated us defensively when we played them. I strangely don't feel all that intimidated facing them again. The Bears d played really well against them until they spent a majority of the 2nd half on the field and got gassed. Still a dangerous team that could beat us. Really good running game, dangerous receivers, and one of if not the best defensive line in football. There's a ton of scenarios that get this team in, and they can clinch at least a 6 seed (and eliminate GB) with a win this weekend. They can win 1 of 2 and make the playoffs I believe.

 

Saints - They can still slip into the 6th seed and they can still slip out of the playoffs with 2 losses and 2 TB wins (one is head to head). The Saints are a really tough team with a still explosive offense but they seem to be missing that extra gear this year. And while both teams have changed, the Bears have owned the Saints the later half of the decade, beating them 4 consecutive years from 2005-2008 (3 at home with brees). But they still are a really solid team and if they can get some blocking from their line, Brees could light up are secondary all game.

 

Packers - Another really good team that's been banged up keeping it from reaching potential. I think we can beat this team, especially in Chicago (as we did earlier in the year), but its a different team now that doesn't expect to commit 18 penalties this time. Plus the fans would look at this as a mini-super bowl between the 2 rivals. They control their own destiny with 2 home games left, and believe it or not can still make the playoffs with a win against the Giants and a loss to the Bears, but it would require the Giants losing to the Skins, and the Bucs losing one of their last 2 games. GB can still take the 5 seed as well.

 

The Eagles also have a somewhat remote chance of winning the 6th seed but I don't feel like typing anymore. They'd probably go either before or after the Packers even though we beat them.

[UMFan83]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

 

Whistle blew a sack of Favre dead a second after we began wrapping him up before he was even really falling, and he fumbled the ball on the way down but didnt count because it was dead. Also, Cutler was hit helmet to helmet on the play he threw his interception and it was not called. The Bears were driving before halftime on that drive and at the time it was a big swing.

 

Some have said the roughing the passer call on the Vikings later in the game was really iffy too. I could see an argument made. It's much harder for me with biased eyes to see plays where the Vikings were screwed instead of the Bears though.

[Guest]

How bad was the officiating overall? That hold they called on Kreutz/Garza that made it 1st and 30 was awful. Not calling intentional grounding on Cutler was inexcusable. The pass interference against the Bears on the deep jump ball to Sidney was terrible. Then I thought they mishandled the two Forte forward progress plays late.

 

Chris Harris looked like Ed Reed compared to our safeties. And apparently we could have acquired him just by dealing some guy. Ugh

The first Forte call was a blatant helmet to helmet hit. Not sure how you can complain about that one at all.

 

The second Forte call was more of a judgement call. But I don't think he ever really got completely stopped there. I can see that one as more of a complaint, but it should be looked at completely independently from the previous call which was about leading with the helmet as opposed to piling on a stopped runner.

 

The first one wouldn't have been called if his forward progress hadn't been stopped. That's the problem. They ruled Forte was defenseless and that was why he got the protection of the helmet to helmet rules. Either that call was wrong (because forward progress had not been stopped) or the second call was wrong.

On that first play, Forte was being held stationary for a decent length of time by around 4-5 guys. The helmet to helmet is a point of emphasis right now, so it's going to get called more often than not in those situations.

 

There were never that many on him on the second play. I don't think he ever got completely stopped on that play, either. But I think this was much more of a judgement call.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

You're looking at either the Giants or Packers as the 6 seed. I don't see any way New Orleans does not get the 5th seed, and Tampa will not make the playoffs. If I had to guess, I'd say the Packers will get that last spot and we see another Bears/Packers game.

[UMFan83]

The refs were very laid back because of the pristine field conditions.

 

Fixed for minnesotacubsfan.

[hawkeyecub]

 

Whistle blew a sack of Favre dead a second after we began wrapping him up before he was even really falling, and he fumbled the ball on the way down but didnt count because it was dead. Also, Cutler was hit helmet to helmet on the play he threw his interception and it was not called. The Bears were driving before halftime on that drive and at the time it was a big swing.

 

Some have said the roughing the passer call on the Vikings later in the game was really iffy too. I could see an argument made. It's much harder for me with biased eyes to see plays where the Vikings were screwed instead of the Bears though.

 

Who could have possibly thought that roughing the passer by Harris on Webb was really iffy? He launched himself into him helmet to helmet. That was as textbook as it gets.

 

I would have flipped out if they called helmet to helmet on Winfield during the pick. He completely tried to stop as well as he could on a slick field and just grabbed onto Cutler and held him. You can't penalize him because he's short and the field is slick.

[Wilson A2000]

For Sully in case he grows tired of his present icon

 

http://score670.com/phpBB/download/file.php?avatar=7302_1284961485.jpg

[David]

Yes, you can. Helmet to helmet is helmet to helmet... not helmet to helmet when players are of similar height and field conditions are good

[jersey cubs fan]

I would have flipped out if they called helmet to helmet on Winfield during the pick. He completely tried to stop as well as he could on a slick field and just grabbed onto Cutler and held him. You can't penalize him because he's short and the field is slick.

 

That is as dumb a thing as I have ever read said about something that happened on a field. Are you serious? That is absurd. You are responsible for your body, and especially helmet. Just because your incompetent organization couldn't provide a decent playing field for the game there is no excuse.

[Wilson A2000]

Yes, you can. Helmet to helmet is helmet to helmet... not helmet to helmet when players are of similar height and field conditions are good

 

I thought you can go helmet to helmet on running backs?

[JonJayCutler]

If the Packers win out and the Saints lose out, do the Packers jump ahead of the Saints for the 5th seed? Looks to me like both would have 8-4 conference records. What's the next tiebreaker?

[David]

Yes, you can. Helmet to helmet is helmet to helmet... not helmet to helmet when players are of similar height and field conditions are good

 

I thought you can go helmet to helmet on running backs?

 

 

Except Jay Cutler isn't a running back

[hawkeyecub]

Yes, you can. Helmet to helmet is helmet to helmet... not helmet to helmet when players are of similar height and field conditions are good

 

No you're wrong. There's helmet to helmet contact all the time and it doesn't get called. They don't call it when a player ducks, they don't call it on running plays. They try to determine intent when calling it.

Winfield was running straight trying to get to him. He didn't lead with his head, launch himself or do any of the other things they've made it clear that they won't allow. He tried stopping himself and didn't even try to hit Cutler. It would have been a terrible call.

[hawkeyecub]

Just because your incompetent organization couldn't provide a decent playing field for the game there is no excuse.

 

Hey, no one saw that coming.

[jersey cubs fan]

Yes, you can. Helmet to helmet is helmet to helmet... not helmet to helmet when players are of similar height and field conditions are good

 

No you're wrong. There's helmet to helmet contact all the time and it doesn't get called. They don't call it when a player ducks, they don't call it on running plays. They try to determine intent when calling it.

Winfield was running straight trying to get to him. He didn't lead with his head, launch himself or do any of the other things they've made it clear that they won't allow. He tried stopping himself and didn't even try to hit Cutler. It would have been a terrible call.

 

They don't call it on running plays because that is not a QB standing still. Running plays, when the runner is still running makes for unavoidable helmet to helmet. Hitting the passing QB's helmet is an automatic penalty regardless of how crappy your field is.

[JonJayCutler]

And what happens if there's a 4-way tie at 10-6 between the Packers, Giants, Bucs, and Saints? This could happen...